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"The army have been used before during strikes. They'll always be used as a fallback when needed. It won't do anything ti help the long term failings of the NHS but that's a totally different story which requires everyone to do their bit. A log of people could start by not using the A & E departments for non emergencies. I know it can be difficult to get a GP appointment but using your local A & E instead simply adds to the pressures in the system." That is the issue though isn't it, I agree the A&E shouldn't be used for anything but emergancies, but if you have not been able to get a GP's appointment and you have no WIC then where are you meant to go for help? | |||
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"If ambulances go on strike then there are plans to send in the army to drive and staff hospitals. The army would be brilliant at this but does it really help the long term plight of NHS" There are many instances when the Armed Forces - for some reason apparently there’s only the Army- are called upon to support public services, it’s done often to the detriment of their family lives, in this case and in others, often will require short notice deployments in the run up till Christmas, to cover the jobs of people who are getting bigger pay rises than the people providing the cover. | |||
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"The army have been used before during strikes. They'll always be used as a fallback when needed. It won't do anything ti help the long term failings of the NHS but that's a totally different story which requires everyone to do their bit. A log of people could start by not using the A & E departments for non emergencies. I know it can be difficult to get a GP appointment but using your local A & E instead simply adds to the pressures in the system. That is the issue though isn't it, I agree the A&E shouldn't be used for anything but emergancies, but if you have not been able to get a GP's appointment and you have no WIC then where are you meant to go for help? " 111 | |||
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"If ambulances go on strike then there are plans to send in the army to drive and staff hospitals. The army would be brilliant at this but does it really help the long term plight of NHS There are many instances when the Armed Forces - for some reason apparently there’s only the Army- are called upon to support public services, it’s done often to the detriment of their family lives, in this case and in others, often will require short notice deployments in the run up till Christmas, to cover the jobs of people who are getting bigger pay rises than the people providing the cover. " Spot on fiddles | |||
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"The army have been used before during strikes. They'll always be used as a fallback when needed. It won't do anything ti help the long term failings of the NHS but that's a totally different story which requires everyone to do their bit. A log of people could start by not using the A & E departments for non emergencies. I know it can be difficult to get a GP appointment but using your local A & E instead simply adds to the pressures in the system. That is the issue though isn't it, I agree the A&E shouldn't be used for anything but emergancies, but if you have not been able to get a GP's appointment and you have no WIC then where are you meant to go for help? 111" Yeah I knew someone would pick up that I hadn't mentioned 111 So will clarify, once everything is exhausted, which includes Doctors/ 111, no WIC , the only place left is A&E Before anyone picks up that 111 you may get an answer, you may not either. A relative is still waiting for a call back from a Doc from three months ago. They ended up in A&E Dsiclaimer, I am not dissing the NHS or "most" of their staff but we have to face reality, it seems to be broken | |||
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"If ambulances go on strike then there are plans to send in the army to drive and staff hospitals. The army would be brilliant at this but does it really help the long term plight of NHS There are many instances when the Armed Forces - for some reason apparently there’s only the Army- are called upon to support public services, it’s done often to the detriment of their family lives, in this case and in others, often will require short notice deployments in the run up till Christmas, to cover the jobs of people who are getting bigger pay rises than the people providing the cover. Spot on fiddles" I should add that the people of the Royal Navy, the British Army and the Royal Air Force are extremely capable and will just get on with the job mostly with good humour and pride. | |||
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"The army have been used before during strikes. They'll always be used as a fallback when needed. It won't do anything ti help the long term failings of the NHS but that's a totally different story which requires everyone to do their bit. A log of people could start by not using the A & E departments for non emergencies. I know it can be difficult to get a GP appointment but using your local A & E instead simply adds to the pressures in the system. That is the issue though isn't it, I agree the A&E shouldn't be used for anything but emergancies, but if you have not been able to get a GP's appointment and you have no WIC then where are you meant to go for help? " Mydoctors surgery actively encourages you to go to A&E if you cabt get an appointment with them (which you never can) | |||
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"The army have been used before during strikes. They'll always be used as a fallback when needed. It won't do anything ti help the long term failings of the NHS but that's a totally different story which requires everyone to do their bit. A log of people could start by not using the A & E departments for non emergencies. I know it can be difficult to get a GP appointment but using your local A & E instead simply adds to the pressures in the system. That is the issue though isn't it, I agree the A&E shouldn't be used for anything but emergancies, but if you have not been able to get a GP's appointment and you have no WIC then where are you meant to go for help? 111 Yeah I knew someone would pick up that I hadn't mentioned 111 So will clarify, once everything is exhausted, which includes Doctors/ 111, no WIC , the only place left is A&E Before anyone picks up that 111 you may get an answer, you may not either. A relative is still waiting for a call back from a Doc from three months ago. They ended up in A&E Dsiclaimer, I am not dissing the NHS or "most" of their staff but we have to face reality, it seems to be broken" There would be a reason for that; tory-imposed austerity for public services while the private sector gets rich. | |||
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"If ambulances go on strike then there are plans to send in the army to drive and staff hospitals. The army would be brilliant at this but does it really help the long term plight of NHS There are many instances when the Armed Forces - for some reason apparently there’s only the Army- are called upon to support public services, it’s done often to the detriment of their family lives, in this case and in others, often will require short notice deployments in the run up till Christmas, to cover the jobs of people who are getting bigger pay rises than the people providing the cover. " Bigger pay rises they haven't won their case yet, hence the strikes which won't be on such a big a scale as being threatened in my opinion. There are already nurses leaving the unions so as not to be forced to go on strike. Its a farce | |||
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"The army have been used before during strikes. They'll always be used as a fallback when needed. It won't do anything ti help the long term failings of the NHS but that's a totally different story which requires everyone to do their bit. A log of people could start by not using the A & E departments for non emergencies. I know it can be difficult to get a GP appointment but using your local A & E instead simply adds to the pressures in the system. That is the issue though isn't it, I agree the A&E shouldn't be used for anything but emergancies, but if you have not been able to get a GP's appointment and you have no WIC then where are you meant to go for help? 111 Yeah I knew someone would pick up that I hadn't mentioned 111 So will clarify, once everything is exhausted, which includes Doctors/ 111, no WIC , the only place left is A&E Before anyone picks up that 111 you may get an answer, you may not either. A relative is still waiting for a call back from a Doc from three months ago. They ended up in A&E Dsiclaimer, I am not dissing the NHS or "most" of their staff but we have to face reality, it seems to be broken There would be a reason for that; tory-imposed austerity for public services while the private sector gets rich." They have been running it down for years , so they can say, look it isn't working we need to sell it off. Some is already privatised, WIC etc | |||
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"The army have been used before during strikes. They'll always be used as a fallback when needed. It won't do anything ti help the long term failings of the NHS but that's a totally different story which requires everyone to do their bit. A log of people could start by not using the A & E departments for non emergencies. I know it can be difficult to get a GP appointment but using your local A & E instead simply adds to the pressures in the system. That is the issue though isn't it, I agree the A&E shouldn't be used for anything but emergancies, but if you have not been able to get a GP's appointment and you have no WIC then where are you meant to go for help? 111 Yeah I knew someone would pick up that I hadn't mentioned 111 So will clarify, once everything is exhausted, which includes Doctors/ 111, no WIC , the only place left is A&E Before anyone picks up that 111 you may get an answer, you may not either. A relative is still waiting for a call back from a Doc from three months ago. They ended up in A&E Dsiclaimer, I am not dissing the NHS or "most" of their staff but we have to face reality, it seems to be broken There would be a reason for that; tory-imposed austerity for public services while the private sector gets rich. They have been running it down for years , so they can say, look it isn't working we need to sell it off. Some is already privatised, WIC etc" Absolutely; death by a thousand cuts. | |||
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" Good idea but seeing the end of the NHS as most of us know it ! and they've been itching to do it for years and years and years and jeremy Hunt even wrote more than afew articles about it ... "People love the idea of the nhs myth. And "it" still at times does some stuff really well. But.. It hasn't been fit for purpose for a long long time. Yes that included it's funding, but it includes the people who abuse it, some of the incompetent staff (who for just one example think it's OK to discharge an elderly and frail patient with none of her medications, no transport to her home and no care even if she were to arrive there, and no contact with family and just leave her on a cold corridor unattended), it's ridiculous processes and dreadful admin systems... Change is needed not just a shit load of cash. So yes bring in the army and do the job professionally and efficiently. | |||
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"If ambulances go on strike then there are plans to send in the army to drive and staff hospitals. The army would be brilliant at this but does it really help the long term plight of NHS There are many instances when the Armed Forces - for some reason apparently there’s only the Army- are called upon to support public services, it’s done often to the detriment of their family lives, in this case and in others, often will require short notice deployments in the run up till Christmas, to cover the jobs of people who are getting bigger pay rises than the people providing the cover. Bigger pay rises they haven't won their case yet, hence the strikes which won't be on such a big a scale as being threatened in my opinion. There are already nurses leaving the unions so as not to be forced to go on strike. Its a farce" The previous pay increases and current offers are all higher than the Armed Forces. For the record I believe all public services should be rewarded better and the staff issues in the NHS are startling. | |||
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"If ambulances go on strike then there are plans to send in the army to drive and staff hospitals. The army would be brilliant at this but does it really help the long term plight of NHS There are many instances when the Armed Forces - for some reason apparently there’s only the Army- are called upon to support public services, it’s done often to the detriment of their family lives, in this case and in others, often will require short notice deployments in the run up till Christmas, to cover the jobs of people who are getting bigger pay rises than the people providing the cover. Bigger pay rises they haven't won their case yet, hence the strikes which won't be on such a big a scale as being threatened in my opinion. There are already nurses leaving the unions so as not to be forced to go on strike. Its a farce The previous pay increases and current offers are all higher than the Armed Forces. For the record I believe all public services should be rewarded better and the staff issues in the NHS are startling. " Not up on Army wages but have they had a real term cut over the last ten years? I do find the "but other people didn't get a big pay rise so why should they" a bit off to be honest. Everyone should get a good pay packet and what they deserve and we shouldn't be complaining if they do as it means everyone might eventually | |||
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"If ambulances go on strike then there are plans to send in the army to drive and staff hospitals. The army would be brilliant at this but does it really help the long term plight of NHS There are many instances when the Armed Forces - for some reason apparently there’s only the Army- are called upon to support public services, it’s done often to the detriment of their family lives, in this case and in others, often will require short notice deployments in the run up till Christmas, to cover the jobs of people who are getting bigger pay rises than the people providing the cover. Bigger pay rises they haven't won their case yet, hence the strikes which won't be on such a big a scale as being threatened in my opinion. There are already nurses leaving the unions so as not to be forced to go on strike. Its a farce The previous pay increases and current offers are all higher than the Armed Forces. For the record I believe all public services should be rewarded better and the staff issues in the NHS are startling. Not up on Army wages but have they had a real term cut over the last ten years? I do find the "but other people didn't get a big pay rise so why should they" a bit off to be honest. Everyone should get a good pay packet and what they deserve and we shouldn't be complaining if they do as it means everyone might eventually " True I agree with you I was merely pointing out that it is equally unfair when people have to cover for somebody else with no choice in the matter when they could have the same grievance. And then I was responding to the gentleman who was disputing the factual element. As I said earlier and as you say, I believe lots of people deserve better pay and conditions, I guess I was trying to raise some greater awareness of the effects of strike action on others. | |||
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"https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-58685219.amp Happy to help. Evie" Yeah, not quite how the OP put it | |||
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"If ambulances go on strike then there are plans to send in the army to drive and staff hospitals. The army would be brilliant at this but does it really help the long term plight of NHS There are many instances when the Armed Forces - for some reason apparently there’s only the Army- are called upon to support public services, it’s done often to the detriment of their family lives, in this case and in others, often will require short notice deployments in the run up till Christmas, to cover the jobs of people who are getting bigger pay rises than the people providing the cover. " The above comment is correct. It is tri service that will backfill. However, most people have no idea how small the Armed Forces are to do. These jobs and deliver normal output. | |||
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"Evie saves Tom again. The army are called the Senior Service for a reason. The govt will not let them carry rifles in the ambulances but they should carry pick elves. If anybody kicks off then they will crack a few skulls.. " with a pick elve I thought kindness and gentleness were the backbone of the NHS?  | |||
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"Evie saves Tom again. The army are called the Senior Service for a reason. The govt will not let them carry rifles in the ambulances but they should carry pick elves. If anybody kicks off then they will crack a few skulls.. " The Army are not called the Senior Service. The Royal Navy are the Senior Service. | |||
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"Evie saves Tom again. The army are called the Senior Service for a reason. The govt will not let them carry rifles in the ambulances but they should carry pick elves. If anybody kicks off then they will crack a few skulls.. with a pick elve I thought kindness and gentleness were the backbone of the NHS? "Only to be used on those that physically attack the NHS emergency workers. It's called self defence. | |||
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"Evie saves Tom again. The army are called the Senior Service for a reason. The govt will not let them carry rifles in the ambulances but they should carry pick elves. If anybody kicks off then they will crack a few skulls.. with a pick elve I thought kindness and gentleness were the backbone of the NHS?
Only to be used on those that physically attack the NHS emergency workers. It's called self defence. "I think the armed forces are well prepared for attacks | |||
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"The whole idea of 111 is you always get an outcome that is appropriate for your problem. We live in a world where everyone expects something same day. Well that may not be clinically appropriate. A and e is for accidents and emergencies everything else can wait. There are so many other options. Econcults, 111, walk in centeretc. The reason the NHS is broken is from everybody thinking they are the priority. Call 111, get an assessment then get the help right for you." Whilst I don't disagree with an efficient triage process. When you have people being put off and put off and put off endlessly, often for multiple years, they can be forgiven for trying anything to actually see a medical / health expert rather than speak to a call centre operative. | |||
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"The whole idea of 111 is you always get an outcome that is appropriate for your problem. We live in a world where everyone expects something same day. Well that may not be clinically appropriate. A and e is for accidents and emergencies everything else can wait. There are so many other options. Econcults, 111, walk in centeretc. The reason the NHS is broken is from everybody thinking they are the priority. Call 111, get an assessment then get the help right for you. Whilst I don't disagree with an efficient triage process. When you have people being put off and put off and put off endlessly, often for multiple years, they can be forgiven for trying anything to actually see a medical / health expert rather than speak to a call centre operative. " Quite frankly just insulting. That "call center operative" deals with everything from a sore throat to a cardiac arrest, they deliver babies, cpr instructions over the phone, deal with fittings, heart attacks, everything, they are the voice in the night when you are having the worst thing imaginable. They do it without the sense of touch, smell or sight. They are highly skilled. But of course the 40+ calls they take a day for years on end mean nothing. | |||
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"The whole idea of 111 is you always get an outcome that is appropriate for your problem. We live in a world where everyone expects something same day. Well that may not be clinically appropriate. A and e is for accidents and emergencies everything else can wait. There are so many other options. Econcults, 111, walk in centeretc. The reason the NHS is broken is from everybody thinking they are the priority. Call 111, get an assessment then get the help right for you." If the rest of the system and indeed 111 worked as it should I'd agree with this. However it doesn't. | |||
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"I hate to state the obvious but, I will anyway. The NHS is a self-defeating concept. The more advances in medicine there are the better we are at keeping people alive who would have otherwise died or lived with their illness. This doesn't come cheap, and demands will only increase. Couple this with the inevitable inefficiency of public sector bureaucracy, incompetence and the odd dash of corruption, and it's doomed to fail completely." You win the internet! | |||
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"If ambulances go on strike then there are plans to send in the army to drive and staff hospitals. The army would be brilliant at this but does it really help the long term plight of NHS" Hahahah we better check there is enough supply of coffins. You have no idea what is happening in our hospitals these days man. It is worse than a war zone. The army knows one rule: no resource= retreat. for the NHS, no resource = coping, mitigating... | |||
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"The whole idea of 111 is you always get an outcome that is appropriate for your problem. We live in a world where everyone expects something same day. Well that may not be clinically appropriate. A and e is for accidents and emergencies everything else can wait. There are so many other options. Econcults, 111, walk in centeretc. The reason the NHS is broken is from everybody thinking they are the priority. Call 111, get an assessment then get the help right for you. Whilst I don't disagree with an efficient triage process. When you have people being put off and put off and put off endlessly, often for multiple years, they can be forgiven for trying anything to actually see a medical / health expert rather than speak to a call centre operative. Quite frankly just insulting. That "call center operative" deals with everything from a sore throat to a cardiac arrest, they deliver babies, cpr instructions over the phone, deal with fittings, heart attacks, everything, they are the voice in the night when you are having the worst thing imaginable. They do it without the sense of touch, smell or sight. They are highly skilled. But of course the 40+ calls they take a day for years on end mean nothing. " What would call someone who works in a call centre and answers a phone? It's not insulting just a fact. Are all 111 call handlers as you described? If they are all highly trained and experienced medical experts in all the fields you have described I take my hat off to them. | |||
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"The army have been used before during strikes. They'll always be used as a fallback when needed. It won't do anything ti help the long term failings of the NHS but that's a totally different story which requires everyone to do their bit. A log of people could start by not using the A & E departments for non emergencies. I know it can be difficult to get a GP appointment but using your local A & E instead simply adds to the pressures in the system." Very good spins doctors' tactic. Blame the victim as your way out of trouble. Check the NHS stat ( beds, GPs,hospital Drs,nurses, health GDP pe per 100k people in the UK over the past 20 years). To give you an idea, in all the above parameters the UK is behind other EU contries. | |||
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"The army have been used before during strikes. They'll always be used as a fallback when needed. It won't do anything ti help the long term failings of the NHS but that's a totally different story which requires everyone to do their bit. A log of people could start by not using the A & E departments for non emergencies. I know it can be difficult to get a GP appointment but using your local A & E instead simply adds to the pressures in the system. That is the issue though isn't it, I agree the A&E shouldn't be used for anything but emergancies, but if you have not been able to get a GP's appointment and you have no WIC then where are you meant to go for help? 111 Yeah I knew someone would pick up that I hadn't mentioned 111 So will clarify, once everything is exhausted, which includes Doctors/ 111, no WIC , the only place left is A&E Before anyone picks up that 111 you may get an answer, you may not either. A relative is still waiting for a call back from a Doc from three months ago. They ended up in A&E Dsiclaimer, I am not dissing the NHS or "most" of their staff but we have to face reality, it seems to be broken" If you ring 111, they'll tellyou to go to A&E anyway.. | |||
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"The army have been used before during strikes. They'll always be used as a fallback when needed. It won't do anything ti help the long term failings of the NHS but that's a totally different story which requires everyone to do their bit. A log of people could start by not using the A & E departments for non emergencies. I know it can be difficult to get a GP appointment but using your local A & E instead simply adds to the pressures in the system. Very good spins doctors' tactic. Blame the victim as your way out of trouble. Check the NHS stat ( beds, GPs,hospital Drs,nurses, health GDP pe per 100k people in the UK over the past 20 years). To give you an idea, in all the above parameters the UK is behind other EU contries." So what's your point? Is it that the nhs as a system is not the way that all other eu countries... (Who have better health care if your point above is accurate.) . Provide for their health care? | |||
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" Good idea but seeing the end of the NHS as most of us know it ! and they've been itching to do it for years and years and years and jeremy Hunt even wrote more than afew articles about it ...
People love the idea of the nhs myth. And "it" still at times does some stuff really well. But.. It hasn't been fit for purpose for a long long time. Yes that included it's funding, but it includes the people who abuse it, some of the incompetent staff (who for just one example think it's OK to discharge an elderly and frail patient with none of her medications, no transport to her home and no care even if she were to arrive there, and no contact with family and just leave her on a cold corridor unattended), it's ridiculous processes and dreadful admin systems... Change is needed not just a shit load of cash. So yes bring in the army and do the job professionally and efficiently."The uk isn’t ready for a private healthcare system like other countries. What people don’t realise is just how bad the NHS is compared to other countries , they have just gotten used to a terrible service that’s free and don’t want to pay for a better one. For me healthcare is important , it’s like a mortgage, it’s cones at a high cost but is a great actually an essential investment. I wouldn’t work for any company that doesn’t provide private world class global healthcare | |||
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" Good idea but seeing the end of the NHS as most of us know it ! and they've been itching to do it for years and years and years and jeremy Hunt even wrote more than afew articles about it ...
People love the idea of the nhs myth. And "it" still at times does some stuff really well. But.. It hasn't been fit for purpose for a long long time. Yes that included it's funding, but it includes the people who abuse it, some of the incompetent staff (who for just one example think it's OK to discharge an elderly and frail patient with none of her medications, no transport to her home and no care even if she were to arrive there, and no contact with family and just leave her on a cold corridor unattended), it's ridiculous processes and dreadful admin systems... Change is needed not just a shit load of cash. So yes bring in the army and do the job professionally and efficiently.
The uk isn’t ready for a private healthcare system
like other countries. What people don’t realise is just how bad the NHS is compared to other countries , they have just gotten used to a terrible service that’s free and don’t want to pay for a better one.
For me healthcare is important , it’s like a mortgage, it’s cones at a high cost but is a great actually an essential investment. I wouldn’t work for any company that doesn’t provide private world class global healthcare
"Well... Quite. Trouble is if you say a word against the sacred nhs you're a traitor. This out dated out moded colossal organisation must be maintained at all cost and nobody is allowed to make any changes to it.... Bonkers. To use an analogy oft used... Its in pain and we think it would be best if... Well you know the rest | |||
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"The whole idea of 111 is you always get an outcome that is appropriate for your problem. We live in a world where everyone expects something same day. Well that may not be clinically appropriate. A and e is for accidents and emergencies everything else can wait. There are so many other options. Econcults, 111, walk in centeretc. The reason the NHS is broken is from everybody thinking they are the priority. Call 111, get an assessment then get the help right for you." The person who is still waiting for a call back from 111 ( they told her they they would call her back three months ago )took herself off to A&E for treatment which resulted in her having an op and a hospital stay of 6 days There was no sense of entitlement ,just asking for help which failed so could be some of the reasons people end up in A&E It seems even Dr's are advising the same. Which brings me full circle,if everything else fails and you need a doctor, there isn't any other option for some people | |||
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"Evie saves Tom again. The army are called the Senior Service for a reason. The govt will not let them carry rifles in the ambulances but they should carry pick elves. If anybody kicks off then they will crack a few skulls.. " Won't that cause more work? | |||
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"The army have been used before during strikes. They'll always be used as a fallback when needed. It won't do anything ti help the long term failings of the NHS but that's a totally different story which requires everyone to do their bit. A log of people could start by not using the A & E departments for non emergencies. I know it can be difficult to get a GP appointment but using your local A & E instead simply adds to the pressures in the system. That is the issue though isn't it, I agree the A&E shouldn't be used for anything but emergancies, but if you have not been able to get a GP's appointment and you have no WIC then where are you meant to go for help? 111 Yeah I knew someone would pick up that I hadn't mentioned 111 So will clarify, once everything is exhausted, which includes Doctors/ 111, no WIC , the only place left is A&E Before anyone picks up that 111 you may get an answer, you may not either. A relative is still waiting for a call back from a Doc from three months ago. They ended up in A&E Dsiclaimer, I am not dissing the NHS or "most" of their staff but we have to face reality, it seems to be broken If you ring 111, they'll tellyou to go to A&E anyway.. " The last time I rang 111, for someone else, having been directed there by the 999 service, an automated voice told me there was at least a 45 minute wait to be answered!.. | |||
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"If ambulances go on strike then there are plans to send in the army to drive and staff hospitals. The army would be brilliant at this but does it really help the long term plight of NHS" Military are not blue light trained. In covid they basically were glorified ambulance cleaners. Not their fault. Also they cannot attend calls as not paramedics. 22 months in Ambulance Service so far. | |||
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