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"Oh wonderful on the BBC highlights from the Games too. They're playing "Keep on Running" by the Spencer Davis Group in tribute to the marathon. Yeah, about the "running" bit...... "For balance..... https://youtu.be/SFEewD4EVwU I think one of the answers maybe simply time. Mainstream athletics has been around for years, prize money has grown with age. Disabled sports is relatively young, and doesn't yet have the same financial and audience numbers that able bodied sports has. I'd like the think the win purse has been growing over time from when they first stated, and would hope they eventually reach parity, or are at least the rewards are more representative of commitment and effort and cost of equipment and living. Winston *apologies if my clumsy phraseology is deemed offensive, it was not my intention | |||
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"Totally agree with this. There are lots of disparities when it comes to able bodied and people with extra needs and disabilities. A few weeks ago I was looking at glamping pods. A glamping pod was from £49 a night, A very similar looking glamping pod that had been adapted for disabilities was from £69 a night. Hotels don't charge extra normally for an accessible room, So we have booked an accessible room in a hotel and it's been the same price as a standard room, When we have booked a premium accessible room it has been the same price as a normal premium room. " A hotel we tried to book in Manchester for the last social did not offer accessible rooms in their lower two price brackets. You could only book a mid price or higher room there. We refused to book. In other countries, it is typical to have to pay either for dearer rooms or in more expensive hotels, hence the additional cost of travelling to international sports meets. We have often struggled to find genuinely accessible accommodation even in the "typical" holiday countries in the EU, let alone in places where attitudes to disability remain firmly in the 19th century! The cost of me going to Toledo in early July was increased by my need for accessible accomodation. The university residence being offered by the course organisers had no accessible option at all, so accommodation probably cost me about €200 more than my fellow course mates. | |||
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"Oh wonderful on the BBC highlights from the Games too. They're playing "Keep on Running" by the Spencer Davis Group in tribute to the marathon. Yeah, about the "running" bit......
For balance..... https://youtu.be/SFEewD4EVwU
I think one of the answers maybe simply time.
Mainstream athletics has been around for years, prize money has grown with age.
Disabled sports is relatively young, and doesn't yet have the same financial and audience numbers that able bodied sports has.
I'd like the think the win purse has been growing over time from when they first stated, and would hope they eventually reach parity, or are at least the rewards are more representative of commitment and effort and cost of equipment and living.
Winston
*apologies if my clumsy phraseology is deemed offensive, it was not my intention
"The Paralympic movement started in 1948, almost to the day (the anniversary was 29th July) 
So, that's quite a long time, no? There were other, perhaps less organised, competitions for various disability sports prior to that also. | |||
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"How about shagging? "Is it wheelchair accessible, please?  | |||
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"How about shagging?
Is it wheelchair accessible, please? "Yes, and it costs a pint of Carling. Cheap as chips  | |||
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"I'm not entirely certain that elite athletes in any sport do it for the money and even if they did, I'm not convinced that upping it will increase grass roots participation. I've run a number of marathons (to pick your example) and recieved nothing more than a tee shirt and a few bits of slate. Grass roots participation occurs for the love of the sport, I certainly don't run because I believe if I try hard enough I could beat Eliud and make a living from it. Even if it didn't, increasing the prize fund may well solve the additional financial burden for the medal winners and possibly all competing at an elite level but I really can't see how it will have an effect on grass roots participation. " Where do next decade's elite athletes come from? Grassroots. How do elite athletes manage to be elite? Usually by earning enough from the sport in question to not need to work in other jobs and therefore be able to devote their whole time to training and competing. How do we grow elite Para sports when to even get your child involved at beginner's level in wheelchair sports, you either need to fork out upwards of £1000 (and a child's chair will need to change as they grow) OR find a club with equipment to loan (becoming ever more difficult due to aforementioned lack of funding) OR find a charity to fund it for you (also not straightforward, not guaranteed and won't keep paying out every time the child grows). The next Jessica Ennis can simply be bought an inexpensive pair of trainers to start with, or basic spikes and can travel to their nearest athletics track on public transport, possibly by themselves if old enough. The next Hannah Cockcroft will be very limited in public transport options and more than likely will need a parent or carer to assist them. Are you understanding my meaning? I'm not suggesting that parity of prize fund and more funding overall is because disabled athletes want to become mega rich. It's because it's necessary to develop a truly professional sport with a deep level of international competition. | |||
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"Related comment/fact. Wheelchair tennis at Wimbledon was put on the small outside courts. Gordon Reid pointed out that while Courts 1 & 2 were not full with low seed matches during the day, his wheelchair tennis matches had people jostling for space and having to go away due to the lack of space for spectators. He asked why more wheelchair tennis matches couldn't be on the bigger courts when there's clearly interest there. No answer from the All England Club. " Serious answer for once (I know, I need to take a lie down)  could it not be that the wheelchairs damage the grass court and that the ‘All England Club’ don’t want their Centre courts damaged?? - I don’t know????? | |||
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"Related comment/fact. Wheelchair tennis at Wimbledon was put on the small outside courts. Gordon Reid pointed out that while Courts 1 & 2 were not full with low seed matches during the day, his wheelchair tennis matches had people jostling for space and having to go away due to the lack of space for spectators. He asked why more wheelchair tennis matches couldn't be on the bigger courts when there's clearly interest there. No answer from the All England Club. Serious answer for once (I know, I need to take a lie down) could it not be that the wheelchairs damage the grass court and that the ‘All England Club’ don’t want their Centre courts damaged?? - I don’t know????? "Seeing as the wheelchair final IS usually on one of the big courts and that the able bodied doubles finals often come straight after, would suggest that the damage can't be that bad? The tennis players use suitable tyres and castors to prevent them sinking in, otherwise they'd not be able to move round the court to play at all. | |||
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"Related comment/fact. Wheelchair tennis at Wimbledon was put on the small outside courts. Gordon Reid pointed out that while Courts 1 & 2 were not full with low seed matches during the day, his wheelchair tennis matches had people jostling for space and having to go away due to the lack of space for spectators. He asked why more wheelchair tennis matches couldn't be on the bigger courts when there's clearly interest there. No answer from the All England Club. Serious answer for once (I know, I need to take a lie down) could it not be that the wheelchairs damage the grass court and that the ‘All England Club’ don’t want their Centre courts damaged?? - I don’t know?????
Seeing as the wheelchair final IS usually on one of the big courts and that the able bodied doubles finals often come straight after, would suggest that the damage can't be that bad? The tennis players use suitable tyres and castors to prevent them sinking in, otherwise they'd not be able to move round the court to play at all. "This is the All England Club though that we are talking about. | |||
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"Oh wonderful on the BBC highlights from the Games too. They're playing "Keep on Running" by the Spencer Davis Group in tribute to the marathon. Yeah, about the "running" bit......
For balance..... https://youtu.be/SFEewD4EVwU
I think one of the answers maybe simply time.
Mainstream athletics has been around for years, prize money has grown with age.
Disabled sports is relatively young, and doesn't yet have the same financial and audience numbers that able bodied sports has.
I'd like the think the win purse has been growing over time from when they first stated, and would hope they eventually reach parity, or are at least the rewards are more representative of commitment and effort and cost of equipment and living.
Winston
*apologies if my clumsy phraseology is deemed offensive, it was not my intention
The Paralympic movement started in 1948, almost to the day (the anniversary was 29th July)
So, that's quite a long time, no? There were other, perhaps less organised, competitions for various disability sports prior to that also."Every day is a school day, I did not know that. Thank you. 
My thinking was wrong then.
Winston
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"Essentially athletes are paid not for performance, but by how many eyes they can get watching What’s the viewership numbers for abled bodies marathon runners and wheel chair runners? " Dunno but they do the same course as the AB runners, usually starting a wee bit earlier. At the London Marathon, if you see Eliud Kipchoge run, you probably also saw Johnboy Smith before that. Ditto at the Commonwealths yesterday, where Dave Weir made his comments. Same course, same day, slightly earlier start before the elite runners usually. Same race sponsors etc. | |||
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"Essentially athletes are paid not for performance, but by how many eyes they can get watching What’s the viewership numbers for abled bodies marathon runners and wheel chair runners? " This is the same argument as to why women don't attract the same prize pot despite pretty decent achievements being made in their fields. Guess it's a catch 22 though isn't it. Without the big sponsorship deals they don't get pushed in to the public eye but if they're not in the public eye they don't get big sponsorship deals. | |||
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"Essentially athletes are paid not for performance, but by how many eyes they can get watching What’s the viewership numbers for abled bodies marathon runners and wheel chair runners? This is the same argument as to why women don't attract the same prize pot despite pretty decent achievements being made in their fields. Guess it's a catch 22 though isn't it. Without the big sponsorship deals they don't get pushed in to the public eye but if they're not in the public eye they don't get big sponsorship deals. " Talking specifically about the Marathons, men and women elite runners get the same prize money. £45k apiece for winning London. The wheelchair elites (men and women) get £29k, despite having completed the same course, in front of the same crowd, in a race set with the same sponsors for the whole event. What more do the wheelchair competitors need to do?! | |||
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"Don't like the prize don't enter the competition.most enter for the competition not the winnings." Thank you, this is a really helpful comment 
I'm sure this comment will form the cornerstone of the future of professional disability sports. | |||
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"Don't like the prize don't enter the competition.most enter for the competition not the winnings. Thank you, this is a really helpful comment
I'm sure this comment will form the cornerstone of the future of professional disability sports. "that's fine without the elite there wouldn't be the sponsors so no prize money to share so why should it be shared equally. | |||
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"I'm not entirely certain that elite athletes in any sport do it for the money and even if they did, I'm not convinced that upping it will increase grass roots participation. I've run a number of marathons (to pick your example) and recieved nothing more than a tee shirt and a few bits of slate. Grass roots participation occurs for the love of the sport, I certainly don't run because I believe if I try hard enough I could beat Eliud and make a living from it. Even if it didn't, increasing the prize fund may well solve the additional financial burden for the medal winners and possibly all competing at an elite level but I really can't see how it will have an effect on grass roots participation. Where do next decade's elite athletes come from? Grassroots. How do elite athletes manage to be elite? Usually by earning enough from the sport in question to not need to work in other jobs and therefore be able to devote their whole time to training and competing. How do we grow elite Para sports when to even get your child involved at beginner's level in wheelchair sports, you either need to fork out upwards of £1000 (and a child's chair will need to change as they grow) OR find a club with equipment to loan (becoming ever more difficult due to aforementioned lack of funding) OR find a charity to fund it for you (also not straightforward, not guaranteed and won't keep paying out every time the child grows). The next Jessica Ennis can simply be bought an inexpensive pair of trainers to start with, or basic spikes and can travel to their nearest athletics track on public transport, possibly by themselves if old enough. The next Hannah Cockcroft will be very limited in public transport options and more than likely will need a parent or carer to assist them. Are you understanding my meaning? I'm not suggesting that parity of prize fund and more funding overall is because disabled athletes want to become mega rich. It's because it's necessary to develop a truly professional sport with a deep level of international competition. " I'm not disagreeing with you about the need to fund grass roots sport. I'm not disagreeing that more funding should be made available for clubs supporting para athletes or offering sports facilities for children with disabilities. I'm disagreeing that putting up prize money that only a handful of people win will achieve what you say - as I said in my first post I believe prize funds and funding for grassroots are two totally different issues for all but a tiny minority of athletes. I wonder if due to the relatively low number of participants in para sports we have a very different take on what works. When I think of funding for sports I really couldn't give a toss what people like Eliud or Bolt win because it is a million miles from anything I could ever hope to achieve. If (when I was younger) I had changed my job, got one where I had the time to train 5 or 6 times a week with a decent coach I may have been able to reach a level in athletics where I could run for a club, possibly at a regional level but I simply wouldn't have got anywhere near the level required to make a career out of it. If I compare this to my level in ultra running where, although it is a rapidly growing sport, the participation level is much much lower. As a result I am able to perform reasonably well at events that attract national and international level athletes. I recently ran an event that by its very length means only a tiny percentage of runners world wide are able to compete (I think the organisers said something like there being runners from 30 odd countries. I entered in an even smaller sub class that the organisers offer and despite being almost twice as slow as the overall winner I came away with a third place on my class - the only ever time I have achieved a placing in my life. This isn't to imply the winning standard is lower, just far far less people between the winners and me. In that race despite a field of very dedicated athletes there was a 65% drop out rate, at the longer main event the top athletes sponsored by major athletic brands all dropped out - it is a sport where luck determinstion and ability to not get injured pay off nearly as well as athletic ability. I wonder if your experience in para sports shows you a world where equipment is very expensive, getting sponsorship really difficult but once over these hurdles the prospect of competing at a regional, if not national level is feasible? The next Jennifer Ennis may well get started on a relatively cheap pair of trainers, but far more will be spent by parents of AB children on cheap trainers with absolutely no sign of athletic prowess beyond perhaps inter-school competitions than will be spent on all the racing wheelchairs ever made. Because of this the barriers I see to participation are always going to be different to those you see and I honestly don't believe that elite level prize money plays any part in finding the next Jennifer Ennis. I will have to accept your far greater knowledge of para sports leads you to believe in this area it would. Mr | |||
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"Essentially athletes are paid not for performance, but by how many eyes they can get watching What’s the viewership numbers for abled bodies marathon runners and wheel chair runners? This is the same argument as to why women don't attract the same prize pot despite pretty decent achievements being made in their fields. Guess it's a catch 22 though isn't it. Without the big sponsorship deals they don't get pushed in to the public eye but if they're not in the public eye they don't get big sponsorship deals. Talking specifically about the Marathons, men and women elite runners get the same prize money. £45k apiece for winning London. The wheelchair elites (men and women) get £29k, despite having completed the same course, in front of the same crowd, in a race set with the same sponsors for the whole event. What more do the wheelchair competitors need to do?!" Those sponsors didn't agree to sponsor the event because one or two semi well known wheelchair athletes are taking part | |||
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"I'm not sure the prize money increase would offer any real benefit to the marathon wheelchair participants, in the London marathon. The top 10 will always be in the hunt, the others will still be chasing the dream with the high costs still in place for the equipment. Maybe the taking part costs and equipment costs should be the focus. Scrap the £75 entry fee to encourage more wheelchair participants and once entered, a loan wheelchair scheme could be put in place to allow people to compete with out the costs, if they are starting out in the sport. (lottery funded) This may attract an increase in participants, which in turn could increase the prize money naturally? " The problem with wheelchairs is one size does not fit all. Depending on the type of disability, it's really important to have a properly fitting (often bespoke sized) chair. Someone with complete lower limb paralysis will start to develop pressure sores very quickly indeed and the wrong height of seat or distance to the wheel rim to push will render the person unable to propel it and possibly liable to tipping out backwards. Loan chairs are okay for trying out a sport but if someone wants to do the sport even semi seriously at local level, they need a bespoke chair. I use a loan chair for wheelchair basketball. It was originally designed for a man of 6ft 4ins and over 20 stone. I am 5ft 6in and nowhere near 20 stone. The seat is too high, the back is too high and I can't pick the ball up off the floor without causing myself physical pain. I sport horrendous bruising along my hips/waist for days after competitive matches because I often inbound the ball but I have to lean so far down that the steel side plates cut into me. I don't get wheelchair funding and I've not yet found a charity willing to support quasi middle aged women who are amateurs. This means I'm saving my money for my new bespoke day chair (£4,500) and have not yet sought to buy myself a bespoke basketball chair (minimum £3,500). There's almost no funding for disability sports clubs at grassroots. We spend our lives (volunteers) writing funding grants for £200 here and a free bag of bibs and cones there but we and many other clubs have no prospect of enough funding to buy lots of loan chairs. I've given up trying track racing because the only loan chair I fit in is excruciatingly painful to use and it's not worth it. | |||
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"I agree. For what is a relatively small amount to the organisers, it would send out a message that disability athletes are seen as on par with AB runners. " Thank you. Genuinely, thank you! | |||
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"Essentially athletes are paid not for performance, but by how many eyes they can get watching What’s the viewership numbers for abled bodies marathon runners and wheel chair runners? This is the same argument as to why women don't attract the same prize pot despite pretty decent achievements being made in their fields. Guess it's a catch 22 though isn't it. Without the big sponsorship deals they don't get pushed in to the public eye but if they're not in the public eye they don't get big sponsorship deals. Talking specifically about the Marathons, men and women elite runners get the same prize money. £45k apiece for winning London. The wheelchair elites (men and women) get £29k, despite having completed the same course, in front of the same crowd, in a race set with the same sponsors for the whole event. What more do the wheelchair competitors need to do?! Those sponsors didn't agree to sponsor the event because one or two semi well known wheelchair athletes are taking part " They sponsored The London Marathon. They didn't sponsor it because Dave from Droitwich is running it dressed as a dinosaur, but Dave is still part of The London Marathon and he gets the same "prize" as everyone else in the fun run (a medal, a t-shirt, some trinkets and the knowledge he's completed the course). Why not have the same prize money for all elite marathon athletes, whether they convey themselves round on foot or via shoulder power? | |||
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"Essentially athletes are paid not for performance, but by how many eyes they can get watching What’s the viewership numbers for abled bodies marathon runners and wheel chair runners? This is the same argument as to why women don't attract the same prize pot despite pretty decent achievements being made in their fields. Guess it's a catch 22 though isn't it. Without the big sponsorship deals they don't get pushed in to the public eye but if they're not in the public eye they don't get big sponsorship deals. Talking specifically about the Marathons, men and women elite runners get the same prize money. £45k apiece for winning London. The wheelchair elites (men and women) get £29k, despite having completed the same course, in front of the same crowd, in a race set with the same sponsors for the whole event. What more do the wheelchair competitors need to do?! Those sponsors didn't agree to sponsor the event because one or two semi well known wheelchair athletes are taking part They sponsored The London Marathon. They didn't sponsor it because Dave from Droitwich is running it dressed as a dinosaur, but Dave is still part of The London Marathon and he gets the same "prize" as everyone else in the fun run (a medal, a t-shirt, some trinkets and the knowledge he's completed the course). Why not have the same prize money for all elite marathon athletes, whether they convey themselves round on foot or via shoulder power? " They sponsored it because the elite male and female runners were signed up to take part and because it is an event seen the world over. If the wheelchair athletes weren't involved, that would not change unfortunately | |||
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" They sponsored it because the elite male and female runners were signed up to take part and because it is an event seen the world over. If the wheelchair athletes weren't involved, that would not change unfortunately " I get the impression if London Marathon stopped including the wheelchair category, the reputational hit would send sponsors for the hills. Wheelchairs are in and have been for a very long time, so start treating them the same as other elite athletes. | |||
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"I agree. For what is a relatively small amount to the organisers, it would send out a message that disability athletes are seen as on par with AB runners. Thank you. Genuinely, thank you! " Totally agree with this comment. Mr | |||
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"I agree. For what is a relatively small amount to the organisers, it would send out a message that disability athletes are seen as on par with AB runners. Thank you. Genuinely, thank you! " I’ve been to watch the London marathon for a number of years now and my respect for the disability athletes and visually impaired runners is on par with any of the elite athletes. I always enjoy seeing the wheelchair and visually impaired athletes come through before the elite men and women. | |||
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"Oh wonderful on the BBC highlights from the Games too. They're playing "Keep on Running" by the Spencer Davis Group in tribute to the marathon. Yeah, about the "running" bit...... "Maybe Limp Bizkit- Rollin would have been a better choice | |||
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"Oh wonderful on the BBC highlights from the Games too. They're playing "Keep on Running" by the Spencer Davis Group in tribute to the marathon. Yeah, about the "running" bit......
Maybe Limp Bizkit- Rollin would have been a better choice "Yeah | |||
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