FabSwingers.com forum: Hungary Children Booing the Knee

By *ssex_tom OP Man
over a year ago

Chelmsford

Reports that in a crowd were there are 90% children watching Hungary v England that the kids overwhelmingly booed England taking the knee and an England player targeted for not singing the English National Anthem.

What's going on here ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Racism is what’s going on here, Tom. Nothing new at all.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Kids being taught racism it’s nothing new

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Kids learn in the environment they’re in

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By *icolerobbieCouple
over a year ago

walsall

Is boo If I’d had nothing to eat…..

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By *icolerobbieCouple
over a year ago

walsall

"Is boo If I’d had nothing to eat….."

*I’d

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By *ixiePoisonWoman
over a year ago

Darlington

No one is born racist..

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I remember when people used to tell me ‘racism will die out’ and I was young and dumb enough to believe that shit

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Might have something to do with the 5 thousand adults that accompanied the kids I don't believe in the knee but each to there own way only expected racist no anty don't tell us what to do definitely

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By * and R cple4Couple
over a year ago

swansea

Sadly kids learn from the adults around them..

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By *wisted999Man
over a year ago

North Bucks

I’m no expert but perhaps having a despot at the reins empowers this way of thinking?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It’s always worth remembering that racism is rife in our own communities. If we all speak up when we see it, the better our communities will become.

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By *alandNitaCouple
over a year ago

Scunthorpe

Unfortunately, in times of hardship it is common for racism and other right-wing attitudes to grow. Blaming those who are different for everything that is bad in life is not unusual behaviour... "Immigrants claiming thousands in benefits, living in mansions, taking our jobs & women, blah, blah, blah." those who are looking for someone to blame are quick to believe it all.

Cal

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Bending the knee became big news mainly when George Floyd was killed.

Unfortunately George Floyd wasn't a saint so I personally wouldn't bend the knee for him.

Would I bend the knee for other important racial issues? Sure.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 05/06/22 13:16:06]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Bending the knee became big news mainly when George Floyd was killed.

Unfortunately George Floyd wasn't a saint so I personally wouldn't bend the knee for him.

Would I bend the knee for other important racial issues? Sure.

The bending of the knee is now seen as a peaceful protest to highlight injustices. The protest is beyond a single individual.

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By *ssex_tom OP Man
over a year ago

Chelmsford

Should all players sing the national anthem.. ?

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By *aliceWoman
over a year ago

Birmingham

As soon as you start qualifying the basis upon which you're prepared to be anti-racist, you're part of the problem.

And taking the knee was always a peaceful protest against racism. It predates any individual injustice.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Should all players sing the national anthem.. ?"

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By *ornLordMan
over a year ago

Wiltshire and London

"Should all players sing the national anthem.. ?"

Or indeed the royal anthem?

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By *ssex_tom OP Man
over a year ago

Chelmsford

"Should all players sing the national anthem.. ?

No"

You think there should be freedom of choice for those players lining up before the match?

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By *ssex_tom OP Man
over a year ago

Chelmsford

"As soon as you start qualifying the basis upon which you're prepared to be anti-racist, you're part of the problem.

And taking the knee was always a peaceful protest against racism. It predates any individual injustice."

Is the implication that if a does not take the knee then they are racist and if a player does not sing the national anthem that they are in some way anti monarchy?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"As soon as you start qualifying the basis upon which you're prepared to be anti-racist, you're part of the problem.

And taking the knee was always a peaceful protest against racism. It predates any individual injustice."

That's a ridiculous statement. Bending the knee was unfortunately brought in for George Floyd's death.

Bending the knee also means to show gratitude or submission. People have the right to choose whether they want to show that to a man with his criminal past. That has nothing to do with race it's about morals and putting yourself in the position of some of his victims.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Kneeling is an act of subservience which is something I will never do. Not kneeling does not make a person a racist, no matter what the bullies may say.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Kneeling is an act of subservience which is something I will never do. Not kneeling does not make a person a racist, no matter what the bullies may say."

Bullies: "we are fighting for injustice and freedom."

Also bullies: "But we will make your mind up for you or slander you."

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

" That's a ridiculous statement. Bending the knee was unfortunately brought in for George Floyd's death. "

Colin Kaepernick bent the knee in September 2016, 4 years before George Floyds murder.

He bent the knee to highlight injustices and police brutality. Please don’t try and double down and make yourself look foolish.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

" That's a ridiculous statement. Bending the knee was unfortunately brought in for George Floyd's death.

Colin Kaepernick bent the knee in September 2016, 4 years before George Floyds murder.

He bent the knee to highlight injustices and police brutality. Please don’t try and double down and make yourself look foolish. "

This is what left wing bullies do find a single piece of data that backs them up.

I'll do the same.

"The practice of taking the knee before football matches became widespread in 2020, following the murder of George Floyd in the US."

BBC News

Martin Luther King Jr did a bend the knee protest in 1965 also but now your pulling at straws.

We all know this has come from George Floyd so don't try deflect from what we all know is obvious.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

" That's a ridiculous statement. Bending the knee was unfortunately brought in for George Floyd's death.

Colin Kaepernick bent the knee in September 2016, 4 years before George Floyds murder.

He bent the knee to highlight injustices and police brutality. Please don’t try and double down and make yourself look foolish.

This is what left wing bullies do find a single piece of data that backs them up.

I'll do the same.

"The practice of taking the knee before football matches became widespread in 2020, following the murder of George Floyd in the US."

BBC News

Martin Luther King Jr did a bend the knee protest in 1965 also but now your pulling at straws.

We all know this has come from George Floyd so don't try deflect from what we all know is obvious."

Your own information reconfirms precisely what I said. Thank you. I’m sorry if my one single piece of data was factual. And doesn’t fit into your narrative.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

" That's a ridiculous statement. Bending the knee was unfortunately brought in for George Floyd's death.

Colin Kaepernick bent the knee in September 2016, 4 years before George Floyds murder.

He bent the knee to highlight injustices and police brutality. Please don’t try and double down and make yourself look foolish.

This is what left wing bullies do find a single piece of data that backs them up.

I'll do the same.

"The practice of taking the knee before football matches became widespread in 2020, following the murder of George Floyd in the US."

BBC News

Martin Luther King Jr did a bend the knee protest in 1965 also but now your pulling at straws.

We all know this has come from George Floyd so don't try deflect from what we all know is obvious.

Your own information reconfirms precisely what I said. Thank you. I’m sorry if my one single piece of data was factual. And doesn’t fit into your narrative. "

Bending the knee has been around since god knows when in medieval times so what's your point exactly?

I'm saying it became mainstream and popular with George Floyd. Are you denying that?

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By *aliceWoman
over a year ago

Birmingham

Taking the knee is an individual choice and that's fine. Choosing to boo someone else's choice to protest against racial injustice isn't fine.

And making a justification for police murdering a black man based on his character and saying 'it's about morals' is a wild take.

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By *ittle_brat_evie!!Woman
over a year ago

evesham

"Is boo If I’d had nothing to eat….."

Why didn't they have anything to eat?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Is boo If I’d had nothing to eat…..

Why didn't they have anything to eat?"

They were hungry.......

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 05/06/22 14:15:02]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

" That's a ridiculous statement. Bending the knee was unfortunately brought in for George Floyd's death.

Colin Kaepernick bent the knee in September 2016, 4 years before George Floyds murder.

He bent the knee to highlight injustices and police brutality. Please don’t try and double down and make yourself look foolish.

This is what left wing bullies do find a single piece of data that backs them up.

I'll do the same.

"The practice of taking the knee before football matches became widespread in 2020, following the murder of George Floyd in the US."

BBC News

Martin Luther King Jr did a bend the knee protest in 1965 also but now your pulling at straws.

We all know this has come from George Floyd so don't try deflect from what we all know is obvious.

Your own information reconfirms precisely what I said. Thank you. I’m sorry if my one single piece of data was factual. And doesn’t fit into your narrative.

Bending the knee has been around since god knows when in medieval times so what's your point exactly?

I'm saying it became mainstream and popular with George Floyd. Are you denying that?"

You are wanting to play funny buggers. Ok. I’ll give it a go : Bending the knee during medieval times was not to highlight the injustices and police brutality. I think we can both agree on that. So you using this example is void. And a failure of misdirection.

I agree that George Floyd’s murder made the issue of injustice and police brutality by peaceful protest of bending the knee common globally. As stated already Kaepernick first bent the knee in 2006, 4 years before Floyds murder.

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By *RANDMRSJAECouple
over a year ago

chester

"Should all players sing the national anthem.. ?"

Yes, 100%

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Kneeling is an act of subservience which is something I will never do. Not kneeling does not make a person a racist, no matter what the bullies may say.

Bullies: "we are fighting for injustice and freedom."

Also bullies: "But we will make your mind up for you or slander you."

We get it. You don’t like George Floyd and don’t support taking a knee. Just say that clearly? Rather than jumping through hoops to avoid saying that

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Should all players sing the national anthem.. ?

You think there should be freedom of choice for those players lining up before the match?"
not singing the National anthem won’t make them any less English. So why must they do it?

And I don’t think it’s as much to do with people’s opinion on the monarchy as you’re suggesting

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Should all players sing the national anthem.. ?

Yes, 100%"

Well, they are happy enough representing their national team.

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By *ittle_brat_evie!!Woman
over a year ago

evesham

"Bending the knee became big news mainly when George Floyd was killed.

Unfortunately George Floyd wasn't a saint so I personally wouldn't bend the knee for him.

Would I bend the knee for other important racial issues? Sure.

They're not bending the knee for him they're bending it for general racist issues, and it was very popular way before George Floyd was murdered.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Kneeling is an act of subservience which is something I will never do. Not kneeling does not make a person a racist, no matter what the bullies may say.

Bullies: "we are fighting for injustice and freedom."

Also bullies: "But we will make your mind up for you or slander you."

We get it. You don’t like George Floyd and don’t support taking a knee. Just say that clearly? Rather than jumping through hoops to avoid saying that

I don't know George Floyd, I've said in previous posts I wouldn't bend the knee for him.

You've come to that presumption. Which is often what left wing Bullys do. I'm just waiting for the R word to get thrown at me. Should be any minute now.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Kneeling is an act of subservience which is something I will never do. Not kneeling does not make a person a racist, no matter what the bullies may say.

Bullies: "we are fighting for injustice and freedom."

Also bullies: "But we will make your mind up for you or slander you."

We get it. You don’t like George Floyd and don’t support taking a knee. Just say that clearly? Rather than jumping through hoops to avoid saying that

I don't know George Floyd, I've said in previous posts I wouldn't bend the knee for him.

You've come to that presumption. Which is often what left wing Bullys do. I'm just waiting for the R word to get thrown at me. Should be any minute now."

If it looks like a cow, sounds like a cow and goes moo. I guess it is .

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yes

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Kneeling is an act of subservience which is something I will never do. Not kneeling does not make a person a racist, no matter what the bullies may say.

Bullies: "we are fighting for injustice and freedom."

Also bullies: "But we will make your mind up for you or slander you."

We get it. You don’t like George Floyd and don’t support taking a knee. Just say that clearly? Rather than jumping through hoops to avoid saying that

I don't know George Floyd, I've said in previous posts I wouldn't bend the knee for him.

You've come to that presumption. Which is often what left wing Bullys do. I'm just waiting for the R word to get thrown at me. Should be any minute now."

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Kneeling is an act of subservience which is something I will never do. Not kneeling does not make a person a racist, no matter what the bullies may say.

Bullies: "we are fighting for injustice and freedom."

Also bullies: "But we will make your mind up for you or slander you."

We get it. You don’t like George Floyd and don’t support taking a knee. Just say that clearly? Rather than jumping through hoops to avoid saying that

I don't know George Floyd, I've said in previous posts I wouldn't bend the knee for him.

You've come to that presumption. Which is often what left wing Bullys do. I'm just waiting for the R word to get thrown at me. Should be any minute now.

If it looks like a cow, sounds like a cow and goes moo. I guess it is . "

If it walk like an opp,

Talk like an opp,

Smell like an opp,

Then it must be a

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Bending the knee became big news mainly when George Floyd was killed.

Unfortunately George Floyd wasn't a saint so I personally wouldn't bend the knee for him.

Would I bend the knee for other important racial issues? Sure.

They're not bending the knee for him they're bending it for general racist issues, and it was very popular way before George Floyd was murdered. "

I agree with you and that’s precisely the point of the knee.

However, contrarians and those who have ideological reasons based on dividing people by skin colour will use misdirection and provide information that reinforces their narrative. Sad really.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Kneeling is an act of subservience which is something I will never do. Not kneeling does not make a person a racist, no matter what the bullies may say.

Bullies: "we are fighting for injustice and freedom."

Also bullies: "But we will make your mind up for you or slander you."

We get it. You don’t like George Floyd and don’t support taking a knee. Just say that clearly? Rather than jumping through hoops to avoid saying that

I don't know George Floyd, I've said in previous posts I wouldn't bend the knee for him.

You've come to that presumption. Which is often what left wing Bullys do. I'm just waiting for the R word to get thrown at me. Should be any minute now.

If it looks like a cow, sounds like a cow and goes moo. I guess it is . "

There's no more to say then really is there. If your not willing to bend the knee for a serious violent criminal your a racist?

The lefties never fail to amaze me.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think it's important that the kneeling is done very visibly at football matches, but it shouldn't stop there when there are so many injustices in the world.

I propose that the players also do star jumps against sexism, a couple of minutes of jazz-hands against transphobia, that Egyptian dance thing in protest about Ukraine, a bit of belly slapping to highlight obesity and on their hands and knees pretending to lap at a water bowl in protest against animal cruelty. Let's really attack the world's injustices with hollow symbolism.

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By *ora the explorerWoman
over a year ago

Paradise, Herts

"Bending the knee became big news mainly when George Floyd was killed.

Unfortunately George Floyd wasn't a saint so I personally wouldn't bend the knee for him.

Would I bend the knee for other important racial issues? Sure.

They're not bending the knee for him they're bending it for general racist issues, and it was very popular way before George Floyd was murdered. "

I agree. Of course they’re not. Not once do I ever think it’s just for him and I’m sure the majority of people don’t.

Lame reason.

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By *ryandseeMan
over a year ago

Yorkshire

The issue arises sometimes from the ambiguity of a gesture. I would like to think that no decent human being will object to a gesture, knee or otherwise, that supports the basic human principle of equality and justice for all. In my opinion it's a simple as that, no matter what you political affiliations, colour or cultural background might be. Being a decent human being and supporting what is right comes above anything else.

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By * and R cple4Couple
over a year ago

swansea

"Should all players sing the national anthem.. ?"
I get why Trent chooses not to sing it and I personally don’t see the issue with him not doing so..It’s about personal choice the same as players who choose not to take the knee ..

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I think it's important that the kneeling is done very visibly at football matches, but it shouldn't stop there when there are so many injustices in the world.

And of course, anybody disagreeing with my post must be a sexist, Russian loving, chubby chasing, animal hating transphobe. There can't possibly be any other reason.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I think it's important that the kneeling is done very visibly at football matches, but it shouldn't stop there when there are so many injustices in the world.

And of course, anybody disagreeing with my post must be a sexist, Russian loving, chubby chasing, animal hating transphobe. There can't possibly be any other reason.

Spiders are fuckers though!

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By *he_Last_TitanMan
over a year ago

Bristol

Unfortunately George Floyd wasn't a saint so I personally wouldn't bend the knee for him.

The guy was cruelly and excruciatingly slowly murdered by someone sworn to protect and serve him. Not sure being a saint has anything to do with this at all. It’s a straw man.

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By *ou only live onceMan
over a year ago

London

Unfortunately George Floyd wasn't a saint so I personally wouldn't bend the knee for him.

The guy was cruelly and excruciatingly slowly murdered by someone sworn to protect and serve him. Not sure being a saint has anything to do with this at all. It’s a straw man. "

Exactly. It's less the man (though you're absolutely right that no-one deserves to be treated in the way he was), and more what his death came to represent.

The contortions from some posters above are admirable. Players should be free to take the knee or not. You are free to agree they should or not. But don't deliberately misrepresent why they are doing so as if you're taking some kind of principled position against an individual!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I think it's important that the kneeling is done very visibly at football matches, but it shouldn't stop there when there are so many injustices in the world.

And of course, anybody disagreeing with my post must be a sexist, Russian loving, chubby chasing, animal hating transphobe. There can't possibly be any other reason.

Spiders are fuckers though! "

Come on now, don't be an arachnophobe. What about all those spiders who have fought for people's rights. Err - Spider-man, The Black Widow, Incy Wincy and Charlotte to name but a few. And even better, if other spiders want to show their support - they can take 7 knees

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West

"I think it's important that the kneeling is done very visibly at football matches, but it shouldn't stop there when there are so many injustices in the world.

And of course, anybody disagreeing with my post must be a sexist, Russian loving, chubby chasing, animal hating transphobe. There can't possibly be any other reason.

Spiders are fuckers though!

Fun fact. Spiders have 6 knees on each leg

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The issue arises sometimes from the ambiguity of a gesture. I would like to think that no decent human being will object to a gesture, knee or otherwise, that supports the basic human principle of equality and justice for all. In my opinion it's a simple as that, no matter what you political affiliations, colour or cultural background might be. Being a decent human being and supporting what is right comes above anything else."

I agree with your sentiment wholly.

Apparently taking the knee is an affront to many peoples basic human rights lol. Or perhaps, the life of people of colour isn’t that important.

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By *ryandseeMan
over a year ago

Yorkshire

Fun fact. Spiders have 6 knees on each leg

You started something now. Wait for the replies that spiders have no knees or spiders have 8 or 48 or indeed 56 knees or ...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I don't agree with this. I don't mind other people taking the knee. I personally feel that people who boo other people taking the knee are scum. At the same time, I hate groupthink and having to do some gestures to prove that I support a cause. For the same reason, I am not a big fan of national anthems too. At the same time I respect people who want to take the knee or sing the national anthem. But calling a gesture a basic human decency and calling anyone who doesn't do it as indecent is a bit far reaching.

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By *ryandseeMan
over a year ago

Yorkshire

This is why I don't usually comment on these threads as people just intetprete stuff as they wish. I said nothing of the sort and I am out. Good day to you.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Didn’t look hungry to me? Some were pretty fat.

Are you sure?

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By *andJane17Couple
over a year ago

York

"Bending the knee became big news mainly when George Floyd was killed.

Unfortunately George Floyd wasn't a saint so I personally wouldn't bend the knee for him.

Would I bend the knee for other important racial issues? Sure.

The bending of the knee is now seen as a peaceful protest to highlight injustices. The protest is beyond a single individual."

Why is it that only English teams do it and others don’t.

The message has been lost as it was coloured people taking the knee in reference to the injustice by police.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Not all that boo taking knee support racism, I for one hate the gesture. Having said that, I’ve a feeling the booing in Hungary will have been born of racism. I have no proof so only a feeling

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

This is why I don't usually comment on these threads as people just intetprete stuff as they wish. I said nothing of the sort and I am out. Good day to you. "

Apologies if I misunderstood. Now that I read your post again, it is not 100% clear what you mentioned. You said that no decent human being would object to the gesture. Did you mean objecting to other people doing a gesture or objecting to doing the gesture oneself? If it's the former, sorry about that.

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By *icolerobbieCouple
over a year ago

walsall

"Is boo If I’d had nothing to eat…..

Why didn't they have anything to eat?"

Hungry children…..

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I ain't rasist in the slightest but that "taking a knee" is a total waste of time.. pure n utter Shite .

No we don't meet Asians before the abusive messages start pouring in to our inbox. Just doesn't do anything for us

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

This is why I don't usually comment on these threads as people just intetprete stuff as they wish. I said nothing of the sort and I am out. Good day to you. "
.

Your previous comment was a contradiction and it’s unsurprising if people misinterpret your comments. Perhaps you could write with clarity and readers will understand you better

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Football wankers.

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By *ryandseeMan
over a year ago

Yorkshire

This is why I don't usually comment on these threads as people just intetprete stuff as they wish. I said nothing of the sort and I am out. Good day to you.

Thanks. What I actually meant to say, perhaps not so clearly so I aplogise, is that the gestures aren't as important as can often be surrounded by ambiguity. It's the belief in the basic human principles of right and wrong, equality and justice which can be expressed in lots of different ways but mostly by how we behave all the time and not just on the pitch or wherever else for that matter. How we express ir not those beliefs are up to each one of us.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I ain't rasist in the slightest but that "taking a knee" is a total waste of time.. pure n utter Shite .

No we don't meet Asians before the abusive messages start pouring in to our inbox. Just doesn't do anything for us

^^^ Not racist. Definitely.

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By *oan of DArcCouple
over a year ago

Glasgow

"I ain't rasist in the slightest but that "taking a knee" is a total waste of time.. pure n utter Shite .

No we don't meet Asians before the abusive messages start pouring in to our inbox. Just doesn't do anything for us

..................................

Well it clearly isn't shite to the people who support it, just as your dislike of Asians isn't shite to you.

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By *ou only live onceMan
over a year ago

London

"I ain't rasist in the slightest but that "taking a knee" is a total waste of time.. pure n utter Shite .

No we don't meet Asians before the abusive messages start pouring in to our inbox. Just doesn't do anything for us

^^^ Not racist. Definitely. "

Can't be what you can't spell!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

This is why I don't usually comment on these threads as people just intetprete stuff as they wish. I said nothing of the sort and I am out. Good day to you.

Agreed

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By *os19Man
over a year ago

Edmonton

Before the game Gareth Southgate had talked about educating the next generation that racism is not acceptable then yesterday young children booing the players for taking the knee. I think the children yesterday must have been told , taught encouraged to do what they did by there parents or so called role models

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Before the game Gareth Southgate had talked about educating the next generation that racism is not acceptable then yesterday young children booing the players for taking the knee. I think the children yesterday must have been told , taught encouraged to do what they did by there parents or so called role models "

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By *os19Man
over a year ago

Edmonton

It will take more than a few generations for a change in attitude in Eastern Europe. They are more protective of their identity and culture than Western Europe. So tend to be resistant of outside ideas. As for the UK, I think the battle is being won and one day, racism will be nigh on non-existent. Maybe then we will concentrate on the things that are killing people in this country such as inner city gang violence, finding a cure for cancer, etc."
. I agree in Eastern Europe it may take longer for attitudes to change as for the UK it seems that from face to face racism we have moved to online racism but racism does seem to be less acceptable especially in the work place.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It will take more than a few generations for a change in attitude in Eastern Europe. They are more protective of their identity and culture than Western Europe. So tend to be resistant of outside ideas. As for the UK, I think the battle is being won and one day, racism will be nigh on non-existent. Maybe then we will concentrate on the things that are killing people in this country such as inner city gang violence, finding a cure for cancer, etc.. I agree in Eastern Europe it may take longer for attitudes to change as for the UK it seems that from face to face racism we have moved to online racism but racism does seem to be less acceptable especially in the work place."

Yes, online offers anonymity for the cowardly to engage in their racist trolling. Education is the best way to defeat and I don’t mean Diversity lessons or anti- racist teachings. An education that encourages all to make judgements one person at a time. Kids do it better than adults, kids will jog on someone they consider not worthy of their time and will engage in interacting with those they consider friends. Their choices are devoid of the cynicism we learn as adults, they either like you or not. I still think Dr King’s message carries more weight than the whole of the BLM movement combined.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Racism is not going to be nigh on non existent any time soon. And also racism is invariably linked to issues like class which is a serious cause of things like inner city gang violence. Dealing with racism is a bigger fight than I think people realise. And also racism is a public health issue. The cause of both physical and symbolic violence that is [redacted] people in minoritised communities. It’s not going anywhere on an individual level or on an institutional level. Different forms, same consequences.

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By *ou only live onceMan
over a year ago

London

It will take more than a few generations for a change in attitude in Eastern Europe. They are more protective of their identity and culture than Western Europe. So tend to be resistant of outside ideas. As for the UK, I think the battle is being won and one day, racism will be nigh on non-existent. Maybe then we will concentrate on the things that are killing people in this country such as inner city gang violence, finding a cure for cancer, etc.. I agree in Eastern Europe it may take longer for attitudes to change as for the UK it seems that from face to face racism we have moved to online racism but racism does seem to be less acceptable especially in the work place.

I think we can all buy into MLK's message. But, and I'm not black of course, I guess it must be frustrating that 50+ years after his assassination his dream is still pretty far off being realised. How long do people have to wait? Waiting for every racist to die off so that racism becomes "nigh on non-existent" by itself doesn't seem to be working, from what I observe, which is I guess why 'movements' like BLM are still necessary.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I understand the pessimism Steve but attitudes are softening as time goes by. I remember racism being casually doled out in the 70’s and 80’s but our generation (or most of our generation) didn’t buy into it. I have zero interest in someone’s colour, it is important to them but bears no relevance in my interaction with them, they are either good people or not. My daughter will be taught to make her judgements based on character. I firmly believe there are millions of households the same. As for class and gang warfare, I agree to some extent that poverty plays a part but there are thousands of kids brought up in poverty stricken circumstances but rise above it all. The best example would be Damilola Taylor and the little cunt that killed him. Damilola’s family were poor and the kid made the most of school and utilised the library in Peckham. The piece of filth that killed him was rotten and beyond saving. Not an issue of class but character. Damilola would have made a contribution to society despite his circumstances, the oxygen thief that murdered him would not have contributed a thing other than misery for the Taylors. Character, not class.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Agree with you completely. For me, how someone turns out depends a lot on parenting. It's not just poverty that makes someone get into gang warfare. But poverty has major correlation with broken families. It's those broken families and families where there isn't anyone to monitor and steer them in the right direction which causes the children to indulge in gangs.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Racism is not going to be nigh on non existent any time soon. And also racism is invariably linked to issues like class which is a serious cause of things like inner city gang violence. Dealing with racism is a bigger fight than I think people realise. And also racism is a public health issue. The cause of both physical and symbolic violence that is [redacted] people in minoritised communities. It’s not going anywhere on an individual level or on an institutional level. Different forms, same consequences.

I hear you. Things may seem better and it’s not for me to say they’re not. I didn’t live then. And I know how horrible by family’s experiences have been with it. But I’m not going to pretend that it’s not as common. Only undergrad diss research but when I did that on racism at unis every single black student I spoke to talked about having experiences of racism before or during university and they weren’t just someone sent me monkey emojis. Hell I had my own really traumatising experiences at uni with racism and the ways it effects you is the same as it always has been. I may seem a pessimist but tackling racism and cutting it out is a greater task than people are generally willing to accept and so therefore it’s not something I expect to properly deal with. Especially when people are constantly wanting to water down anti racism to make everyone feel more comfortable about what racism is and how it has historically and still violently ruins lives and communities.

And Damilola’s murder was awful. Funny enough Caleb Femi writes about it in his book ‘Poor’. I think class is more a factor than you think especially in the sense that class is more than just material deprivation and equally about social exclusion. It will lead people and communities down different paths especially when mixed in with other experiences like racism which uniquely intersect.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Sorry for ranting anyway- I’m out of this topic.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Sorry for ranting anyway- I’m out of this topic.

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West

"Sorry for ranting anyway- I’m out of this topic.

You aren't ranting. You are sharing your lived experience, which no-one can dispute because they've not lived it.

I don't have personal experience of racism, but I'm often disbelieved when I share my experience of being a disabled person. I'm told I should appreciate that things are better now than 20 years ago etc. Whilst that might be true, it doesn't help me feel part of society. I'm sure it's exactly the same for you and others who experience racism, Steve.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

As there are rants, I’ve kind of wrote this essay. Happy to stand corrected if anyone wants to read.

If anyone thinks Class effects inner city families, you’re not seeing it right. Poverty is what effects the poorest of society. Government policies supporting the richest in society whilst marking the poorest of society poorer.

Racism is rife at the working class population. It’s this ‘class’ of people who get fooled into thinking their fellow working class ethic minority groups are to blame for their difficulties.

Instead of looking at those in power, they in turn blame their neighbours. A white poor person has more in common with a black poor person then a Eton toff. Yet it’s the Eton toffs that’s the hero of the white working class.

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By *os19Man
over a year ago

Edmonton

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Sorry for ranting anyway- I’m out of this topic.

You aren't ranting. You are sharing your lived experience, which no-one can dispute because they've not lived it.

I appreciate you

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"As there are rants, I’ve kind of wrote this essay. Happy to stand corrected if anyone wants to read.

Racism is rife at the working class population. It’s this ‘class’ of people who get fooled into thinking their fellow working class ethic minority groups are to blame for their difficulties.

I mostly agree with this although I think some of the roots of inner city gang crime, for example, are not race specific, just that minoritised groups are more likely to live in poverty. The perpetrators of gang crime in Glasgow and London might look different but lots of the causes are the same. The communities are just made up differently.

And working class people that are invested in racism or upholding white supremacy, however you want to describe it, do so because it benefits them. Same reason White women too have historically been key to racism/ white supremacy continuing to exist- there’s benefit. And same why men of colour seek to uphold the patriarchy. There’s benefit. Etc.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Duly noted

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

That's the parents teaching them to do this

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"As there are rants, I’ve kind of wrote this essay. Happy to stand corrected if anyone wants to read.

Racism is rife at the working class population. It’s this ‘class’ of people who get fooled into thinking their fellow working class ethic minority groups are to blame for their difficulties.

Eton toffs the heroes of working class people? Are you sure. No one in my circle holds Boris, David Cameron, etc as heroes. Ian Botham, Daley Thompson, Mick Jagger yes, but not the Eton toffs.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"As there are rants, I’ve kind of wrote this essay. Happy to stand corrected if anyone wants to read.

Racism is rife at the working class population. It’s this ‘class’ of people who get fooled into thinking their fellow working class ethic minority groups are to blame for their difficulties.

I agree with your London / Glasgow gang issue not being about race but about poverty.

I would disagree white poor class are invested in white supremacy. I would state the system has failed them and like crabs in the bucket, they take down people in their community in a failed thought it’s their fault .

Please can you explain more about: White women too have historically been key to racism/ white supremacy continuing to exist- there’s benefit.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Please can you explain more about: White women too have historically been key to racism/ white supremacy continuing to exist- there’s benefit.

Same as everything really, white supremacy is upheld and protected by both men and women. Not just in terms of complicity but in action as well. Particularly in an American context but worth noting that white supremacy is a pretty global issue that affects people of colour across their diasporas. In an American context there’s far more examples including opposition from white women to Black suffrage to Emmet Till. In Britain although these relations are more recent it’s wrong to pretend that racism divides communities on a gendered basis. It doesn’t. Arguably, in some communities, racism is unifying. It’s just, to me, as simple as acknowledging that to maintain oppressive structures or dominance, it requires subtle, unknowing support and reproduction just as much as it does the overt, deliberate.

And this is true of most groups that benefit in some way from dominant ideas and their place in society.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

don't mind celebs/sports stars supporting anti racism but i do find the knee bit very half hearted, might due to it being a popular phrase on game of thrones. it comes across a bit tacky, wouldn't be the right word but close.

national anthem, no you don't have to sing it, standing respectfully will do, if it irks a player that much they could turn down playing for England, try their luck in the Scots team

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Please can you explain more about: White women too have historically been key to racism/ white supremacy continuing to exist- there’s benefit.

And this is true of most groups that benefit in some way from dominant ideas and their place in society. "

I’m sorry you said white women were key. You’ve not actually specially addressed this point. Please let’s not play politics where a direct question is filled with bluster. Concise examples where white women were key to continuing white supremacy to exist.

Otherwise this comment is baseless and misogynistic.

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By *oan of DArcCouple
over a year ago

Glasgow

It will take more than a few generations for a change in attitude in Eastern Europe. They are more protective of their identity and culture than Western Europe. So tend to be resistant of outside ideas. As for the UK, I think the battle is being won and one day, racism will be nigh on non-existent. Maybe then we will concentrate on the things that are killing people in this country such as inner city gang violence, finding a cure for cancer, etc.. I agree in Eastern Europe it may take longer for attitudes to change as for the UK it seems that from face to face racism we have moved to online racism but racism does seem to be less acceptable especially in the work place.

.................................

Excellent post and makes the significant point. Martin Luther King died over 50 yards, preaching a message of peace, equality and reconciliation, it's unbelievable racism is still even a 'thing'.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Please can you explain more about: White women too have historically been key to racism/ white supremacy continuing to exist- there’s benefit.

And this is true of most groups that benefit in some way from dominant ideas and their place in society.

Otherwise this comment is baseless and misogynistic. "

I hope this doesn’t come across as patronising but I’ve enjoyed the discussion between you two, both of you appear considered in your responses. Long May that continue

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By *oan of DArcCouple
over a year ago

Glasgow

It will take more than a few generations for a change in attitude in Eastern Europe. They are more protective of their identity and culture than Western Europe. So tend to be resistant of outside ideas. As for the UK, I think the battle is being won and one day, racism will be nigh on non-existent. Maybe then we will concentrate on the things that are killing people in this country such as inner city gang violence, finding a cure for cancer, etc.. I agree in Eastern Europe it may take longer for attitudes to change as for the UK it seems that from face to face racism we have moved to online racism but racism does seem to be less acceptable especially in the work place.

.................................

Excellent post and makes the significant point. Martin Luther King died over 50 yards, preaching a message of peace, equality and reconciliation, it's unbelievable racism is still even a 'thing'."

...................

*years!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

People get walked on for varieties of reasons. Nasty people will always find something wrong with you. Whether that's your skin colour, weight, height, hair colour, where your from, what car you drive, your accent. Anything.

Racism is just the one where there is money to be made. Through BLM and other organizations making massive profits.

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By *agneto.Man
over a year ago

Bham

I'm not white. I don't like the taking of the knee. If I was a pro footballer, I wouldn't take the knee.

I wish football stayed non political.

I watch football, F1 as escapism and enjoyment. Not for symbolism and political messages.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm not white. I don't like the taking of the knee. If I was a pro footballer, I wouldn't take the knee.

I wish football stayed non political.

I watch football, F1 as escapism and enjoyment. Not for symbolism and political messages.

Well then your racist according to some of these in here

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

1 adult per 10 kids acting like conductors most likely

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"People get walked on for varieties of reasons. Nasty people will always find something wrong with you. Whether that's your skin colour, weight, height, hair colour, where your from, what car you drive, your accent. Anything.

Racism is just the one where there is money to be made. Through BLM and other organizations making massive profits. "

Racism is a thing for profit lol

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm not white. I don't like the taking of the knee. If I was a pro footballer, I wouldn't take the knee.

I wish football stayed non political.

I watch football, F1 as escapism and enjoyment. Not for symbolism and political messages.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Please can you explain more about: White women too have historically been key to racism/ white supremacy continuing to exist- there’s benefit.

And this is true of most groups that benefit in some way from dominant ideas and their place in society.

Otherwise this comment is baseless and misogynistic. "

Is prominent members of the American women’s suffrage movement opposing Black suffrage not an example? Angela Davis had a chapter on it in women race and class. Or Emmet Till? Who was not an isolated incident in history? Davis also has a chapter on myth of the black r*pist which calls out specific racist white women including Susan Brownmiller.

To say that white women have been key to the continuation of white supremacy isn’t baseless and how ahistorical of anyone to suggest it is. It’s pretty obvious in fact. Might I suggest the works of Black feminists that speak on white women’s racism. The opinion like most of mine on race are ones I have formed through reading and studying these things.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Racism is just the one where there is money to be made. Through BLM and other organizations making massive profits.

Racism is a thing for profit lol "

Racism exists in all corners of the world but is rarely spoke about unless it's within the agenda of mainstream media.

What about Indian Vs Pakistani racism which is absolutely rife and causing mass deaths all in pretty recent years? Nobody seems to care about that.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm not white. I don't like the taking of the knee. If I was a pro footballer, I wouldn't take the knee.

I wish football stayed non political.

I watch football, F1 as escapism and enjoyment. Not for symbolism and political messages.

Well then your racist according to some of these in here

Not taking the knee is not racist. Booing taking the knee is a clear indication that you probably are racist. I hope this helps.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm not white. I don't like the taking of the knee. If I was a pro footballer, I wouldn't take the knee.

I wish football stayed non political.

I watch football, F1 as escapism and enjoyment. Not for symbolism and political messages.

It’s fair to not like it but these responses are agreed responses from participating members of the sport? (I may be wrong on that). For instance Zaha doesn’t take a knee and has been very vocal on his reasons why many of which I agree with.

And also in F1 like half the grid don’t take a knee. But I don’t see why Lewis Hamilton or Seb Vettel who speak on these issues and one that might be directly affected by them, shouldn’t take a knee? Highlighting injustice with a platform like that is huge. It’s important. And I commend them for doing so even if I myself don’t find it particularly radical

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm not white. I don't like the taking of the knee. If I was a pro footballer, I wouldn't take the knee.

I wish football stayed non political.

I watch football, F1 as escapism and enjoyment. Not for symbolism and political messages.

Well then your racist according to some of these in here

Not taking the knee is not racist. Booing taking the knee is a clear indication that you probably are racist. I hope this helps."

I disagree on booing of the gesture as a sign of racism. What drew you to that conclusion? No hostility from me, a genuine enquiry to discuss our opposing views - Bob

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Please can you explain more about: White women too have historically been key to racism/ white supremacy continuing to exist- there’s benefit.

And this is true of most groups that benefit in some way from dominant ideas and their place in society.

Otherwise this comment is baseless and misogynistic.

Might I add that to suggest that the claim is baseless, considering how many Black women have written on their experiences of racism of white women feels a bit… yeah.

Hazel Carby, Audre Lorde and countless other really famous women have spoken on these issues. I see the examples they give as nothing other than upholding systems of dominance, specifically White supremacy. But read their work anyway.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm not white. I don't like the taking of the knee. If I was a pro footballer, I wouldn't take the knee.

I wish football stayed non political.

I watch football, F1 as escapism and enjoyment. Not for symbolism and political messages.

Well then your racist according to some of these in here

Not taking the knee is not racist. Booing taking the knee is a clear indication that you probably are racist. I hope this helps.

I disagree on booing of the gesture as a sign of racism. What drew you to that conclusion? No hostility from me, a genuine enquiry to discuss our opposing views - Bob"

They’re booing an anti-racist gesture. What else would you call anti-anti-racist?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm not white. I don't like the taking of the knee. If I was a pro footballer, I wouldn't take the knee.

I wish football stayed non political.

I watch football, F1 as escapism and enjoyment. Not for symbolism and political messages.

Well then your racist according to some of these in here

Not taking the knee is not racist. Booing taking the knee is a clear indication that you probably are racist. I hope this helps.

I disagree on booing of the gesture as a sign of racism. What drew you to that conclusion? No hostility from me, a genuine enquiry to discuss our opposing views - Bob

They’re booing an anti-racist gesture. What else would you call anti-anti-racist?"

I agree anti-anti-racist but not a sign of racism. Many oppose aspects of anti-racism but also oppose racism. I don’t like racism (illogical, spiteful and pointless) but I don’t buy into anti-racism. The gesture itself is heavily attached to BLM who are seen as toxic in some quarters (not just those who put a pointy white hood and burn crosses).

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Please can you explain more about: White women too have historically been key to racism/ white supremacy continuing to exist- there’s benefit.

And this is true of most groups that benefit in some way from dominant ideas and their place in society.

Otherwise this comment is baseless and misogynistic.

Might I add that to suggest that the claim is baseless, considering how many Black women have written on their experiences of racism of white women feels a bit… yeah.

You stated: white women were key to white supremacy to exist. You’ve not answered this but just listed some authors. So you’re not able to substantiate your claim.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm not white. I don't like the taking of the knee. If I was a pro footballer, I wouldn't take the knee.

I wish football stayed non political.

I watch football, F1 as escapism and enjoyment. Not for symbolism and political messages.

Well then your racist according to some of these in here

Not taking the knee is not racist. Booing taking the knee is a clear indication that you probably are racist. I hope this helps.

I disagree on booing of the gesture as a sign of racism. What drew you to that conclusion? No hostility from me, a genuine enquiry to discuss our opposing views - Bob

They’re booing an anti-racist gesture. What else would you call anti-anti-racist?

It has been stated many times by many footballers that they aren’t kneeling for BLM.

Anti anti racism is racism. Anti BLM is not.

Also the children at the match were only there because the adults are banned for being racist. I think that makes it pretty obvious they were booing because they are racist.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Please can you explain more about: White women too have historically been key to racism/ white supremacy continuing to exist- there’s benefit.

And this is true of most groups that benefit in some way from dominant ideas and their place in society.

Otherwise this comment is baseless and misogynistic.

Might I add that to suggest that the claim is baseless, considering how many Black women have written on their experiences of racism of white women feels a bit… yeah.

You stated: white women were key to white supremacy to exist. You’ve not answered this but just listed some authors. So you’re not able to substantiate your claim. "

I’ve given examples and I’ve given you the works of academics that you should read on this issue. I mean if you think I am not substantiating my claim of that it’s still baseless or that I’m misogynistic then good for you lol. I’ll still sleep fine tonight. And as I suggested, ironically, your refusal to accept these as good enough evidence or sources of evidence feels like misogynoir. But I’m personally not going to say that about you because I don’t know you.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm not white. I don't like the taking of the knee. If I was a pro footballer, I wouldn't take the knee.

I wish football stayed non political.

I watch football, F1 as escapism and enjoyment. Not for symbolism and political messages.

Well then your racist according to some of these in here

Not taking the knee is not racist. Booing taking the knee is a clear indication that you probably are racist. I hope this helps.

I disagree on booing of the gesture as a sign of racism. What drew you to that conclusion? No hostility from me, a genuine enquiry to discuss our opposing views - Bob

They’re booing an anti-racist gesture. What else would you call anti-anti-racist?

I can understand how racists will have a problem with BLM, But please can you help me understand how BLM is affecting your life ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Please can you explain more about: White women too have historically been key to racism/ white supremacy continuing to exist- there’s benefit.

And this is true of most groups that benefit in some way from dominant ideas and their place in society.

Otherwise this comment is baseless and misogynistic.

Might I add that to suggest that the claim is baseless, considering how many Black women have written on their experiences of racism of white women feels a bit… yeah.

You stated: white women were key to white supremacy to exist. You’ve not answered this but just listed some authors. So you’re not able to substantiate your claim.

. "

Man wants me to paste pages of this stuff, quotes etc on a thread on fab. Bro you got me all the way fucked up

As I said, it’s an opinion I’ve formed from reading and studying.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I want more to be done about the racism in India and Pakistan nobody seems to care about.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 05/06/22 20:03:28]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Please can you explain more about: White women too have historically been key to racism/ white supremacy continuing to exist- there’s benefit.

And this is true of most groups that benefit in some way from dominant ideas and their place in society.

Otherwise this comment is baseless and misogynistic.

Might I add that to suggest that the claim is baseless, considering how many Black women have written on their experiences of racism of white women feels a bit… yeah.

You stated: white women were key to white supremacy to exist. You’ve not answered this but just listed some authors. So you’re not able to substantiate your claim.

. "

I’m not sure you used the word ironically in its correct way, as there is no irony in my replies to you. You claimed I said your statement was baseless, on the the basis you were not able to substantiate your claims. You share a list of authors, yet unable to describe specific examples . That’s like me saying - well I said xyz and if you don’t believe me, check the internet lol .

You’ve stifled the debate because you’re unable to provide evidence or examples but a list of authors lol.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I want more to be done about the racism in India and Pakistan nobody seems to care about. "

Who is nobody by the way? Are you suggesting that nothing is being done? So there’s no resistance to this? Or groups working towards stopping this?

Also (genuine question) is what you’re describing racism? Or is it more xenophobia/ religious conflict? Again correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t it a direct result of White western intervention and European Empire?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I want more to be done about the racism in India and Pakistan nobody seems to care about. "

Do you? Or is this your way of justifying half the stuff you’ve said in this thread?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I want more to be done about the racism in India and Pakistan nobody seems to care about. "

You’re getting desperate haha.

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By *inky-MinxWoman
over a year ago

Grantham

"I’m no expert but perhaps having a despot at the reins empowers this way of thinking?"

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I want more to be done about the racism in India and Pakistan nobody seems to care about.

Who is nobody by the way? Are you suggesting that nothing is being done? So there’s no resistance to this? Or groups working towards stopping this?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I want more to be done about the racism in India and Pakistan nobody seems to care about.

You’re getting desperate haha. "

Touched a nerve? What did you say about cows earlier haha

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm not white. I don't like the taking of the knee. If I was a pro footballer, I wouldn't take the knee.

I wish football stayed non political.

I watch football, F1 as escapism and enjoyment. Not for symbolism and political messages.

Well then your racist according to some of these in here

Not taking the knee is not racist. Booing taking the knee is a clear indication that you probably are racist. I hope this helps.

I disagree on booing of the gesture as a sign of racism. What drew you to that conclusion? No hostility from me, a genuine enquiry to discuss our opposing views - Bob

They’re booing an anti-racist gesture. What else would you call anti-anti-racist?

It has been stated many times by many footballers that they aren’t kneeling for BLM.

Anti anti racism is racism. Anti BLM is not.

Also the children at the match were only there because the adults are banned for being racist. I think that makes it pretty obvious they were booing because they are racist."

I would boo the gesture, and despite footballers distancing the gesture from BLM, it is still associated with BLM. Another gesture could be used and would be less divisive. I am against anti-racism as some of it suggests people are racist solely based on their colour, I’m dead against that line of thought.

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West

Why boo it? If you don't agree with taking a knee for whatever reason, why not just stay quiet? Is there a need to be actively and outwardly negative?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm not white. I don't like the taking of the knee. If I was a pro footballer, I wouldn't take the knee.

I wish football stayed non political.

I watch football, F1 as escapism and enjoyment. Not for symbolism and political messages.

Well then your racist according to some of these in here

Not taking the knee is not racist. Booing taking the knee is a clear indication that you probably are racist. I hope this helps.

I disagree on booing of the gesture as a sign of racism. What drew you to that conclusion? No hostility from me, a genuine enquiry to discuss our opposing views - Bob

They’re booing an anti-racist gesture. What else would you call anti-anti-racist?

It has been stated many times by many footballers that they aren’t kneeling for BLM.

Anti anti racism is racism. Anti BLM is not.

Also the children at the match were only there because the adults are banned for being racist. I think that makes it pretty obvious they were booing because they are racist.

That last sentence describes racism. So your view is anti racist. So you’re anti your own views?

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

" I’m not sure you used the word ironically in its correct way, as there is no irony in my replies to you. You claimed I said your statement was baseless, on the the basis you were not able to substantiate your claims. You share a list of authors, yet unable to describe specific examples . That’s like me saying - well I said xyz and if you don’t believe me, check the internet lol .

You’ve stifled the debate because you’re unable to provide evidence or examples but a list of authors lol."

First of all the irony is in you suggesting my comments were misogynistic then going on to display misogynoir.

Second of all, as I said above, you got me all the way fucked up if you think I’m some kind of free tutor on fab on a Sunday evening. I gave examples, didn’t quote from the texts because that’s extremely long but gave examples and was specific enough about them that you can either research them yourself or not. I suggested you read more on it because, not gonna lie, it looks like you haven’t read anything on the things I’ve said hence why you’re just saying they’re ‘some authors’ and you’re not actually challenging their work or their claims. You’re not challenging the role of women like Elizabeth Cady Stanton in the opposition to Black suffrage or the role of women like Susan Brownmiller in spreading racist white supremacist anti black myths about Black men. You’re not challenging anything that Carby or Lorde have written about the racism of white women- which is as key to the upholding of white supremacy as anything else. In fact you’re just saying that my mentioning of them and not reciting their entire arguments is evidence I can’t back up my point. Failing to do so, didn’t you say was to suggest my initial claim was baseless and misogynistic? Forgive my frustration at your suggestion that it’s me stifling the debate but I don’t what exactly you want from me on a FAB forum thread. You can even access some or lots of this stuff for free on the internet if you search correctly.

Anyway roll safe pal

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I want more to be done about the racism in India and Pakistan nobody seems to care about.

Who is nobody by the way? Are you suggesting that nothing is being done? So there’s no resistance to this? Or groups working towards stopping this?

India or Pakistan only has to win the other at cricket and it leads to death in masses and extreme racism. This never gets even mentioned in the news. I'm highlighting the fact that most people only care for what their news spoon feeds them with BLM etc. It's about proportion and they are being manipulated massively. "
again, is what you’re describing racism? Or is it more xenophobia/ religious conflict? correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t it a direct result of White western intervention and European Empire?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm not white. I don't like the taking of the knee. If I was a pro footballer, I wouldn't take the knee.

I wish football stayed non political.

I watch football, F1 as escapism and enjoyment. Not for symbolism and political messages.

Well then your racist according to some of these in here

Not taking the knee is not racist. Booing taking the knee is a clear indication that you probably are racist. I hope this helps.

I disagree on booing of the gesture as a sign of racism. What drew you to that conclusion? No hostility from me, a genuine enquiry to discuss our opposing views - Bob

They’re booing an anti-racist gesture. What else would you call anti-anti-racist?

It has been stated many times by many footballers that they aren’t kneeling for BLM.

Anti anti racism is racism. Anti BLM is not.

Also the children at the match were only there because the adults are banned for being racist. I think that makes it pretty obvious they were booing because they are racist.

That last sentence describes racism. So your view is anti racist. So you’re anti your own views?"

Your twisting what he's said massively. It's racist to say things like white priveledge, which BLM throws everywhere. Whether your left wing brain thinks it's ok or not. Let's defeat racism by being racist

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm not white. I don't like the taking of the knee. If I was a pro footballer, I wouldn't take the knee.

I wish football stayed non political.

I watch football, F1 as escapism and enjoyment. Not for symbolism and political messages.

Well then your racist according to some of these in here

Not taking the knee is not racist. Booing taking the knee is a clear indication that you probably are racist. I hope this helps.

I disagree on booing of the gesture as a sign of racism. What drew you to that conclusion? No hostility from me, a genuine enquiry to discuss our opposing views - Bob

They’re booing an anti-racist gesture. What else would you call anti-anti-racist?

It has been stated many times by many footballers that they aren’t kneeling for BLM.

Anti anti racism is racism. Anti BLM is not.

Also the children at the match were only there because the adults are banned for being racist. I think that makes it pretty obvious they were booing because they are racist.

That last sentence describes racism. So your view is anti racist. So you’re anti your own views?

White privilege does exist. If you want I can tell you exactly how I know this.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I want more to be done about the racism in India and Pakistan nobody seems to care about.

Who is nobody by the way? Are you suggesting that nothing is being done? So there’s no resistance to this? Or groups working towards stopping this?

India or Pakistan only has to win the other at cricket and it leads to death in masses and extreme racism. This never gets even mentioned in the news. I'm highlighting the fact that most people only care for what their news spoon feeds them with BLM etc. It's about proportion and they are being manipulated massively. again, is what you’re describing racism? Or is it more xenophobia/ religious conflict? correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t it a direct result of White western intervention and European Empire? "

To me it’s typical of his type. He is distracting the conversation / debate using ‘what-about-ism’. A common tactic used by people that want stifle the real debate.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I want more to be done about the racism in India and Pakistan nobody seems to care about.

Who is nobody by the way? Are you suggesting that nothing is being done? So there’s no resistance to this? Or groups working towards stopping this?

India or Pakistan only has to win the other at cricket and it leads to death in masses and extreme racism. This never gets even mentioned in the news. I'm highlighting the fact that most people only care for what their news spoon feeds them with BLM etc. It's about proportion and they are being manipulated massively. again, is what you’re describing racism? Or is it more xenophobia/ religious conflict? correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t it a direct result of White western intervention and European Empire? "

It feels like because it's not white people being racist your making excuses and pondering to the only white people can be racist story. Which backs up my point.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I want more to be done about the racism in India and Pakistan nobody seems to care about.

Who is nobody by the way? Are you suggesting that nothing is being done? So there’s no resistance to this? Or groups working towards stopping this?

India or Pakistan only has to win the other at cricket and it leads to death in masses and extreme racism. This never gets even mentioned in the news. I'm highlighting the fact that most people only care for what their news spoon feeds them with BLM etc. It's about proportion and they are being manipulated massively. again, is what you’re describing racism? Or is it more xenophobia/ religious conflict? correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t it a direct result of White western intervention and European Empire?

To me it’s typical of his type. He is distracting the conversation / debate using ‘what-about-ism’. A common tactic used by people that want stifle the real debate."

Or maybe it's an ism which your quite fond of? Maybe you don't want that ism bringing up? Maybe you pick your ism's to suit you? Seems to be a common topic in the UK.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm not white. I don't like the taking of the knee. If I was a pro footballer, I wouldn't take the knee.

I wish football stayed non political.

I watch football, F1 as escapism and enjoyment. Not for symbolism and political messages.

Well then your racist according to some of these in here

Not taking the knee is not racist. Booing taking the knee is a clear indication that you probably are racist. I hope this helps.

I disagree on booing of the gesture as a sign of racism. What drew you to that conclusion? No hostility from me, a genuine enquiry to discuss our opposing views - Bob

They’re booing an anti-racist gesture. What else would you call anti-anti-racist?

It has been stated many times by many footballers that they aren’t kneeling for BLM.

Anti anti racism is racism. Anti BLM is not.

Also the children at the match were only there because the adults are banned for being racist. I think that makes it pretty obvious they were booing because they are racist.

That last sentence describes racism. So your view is anti racist. So you’re anti your own views?

Let’s defeat racism through education. And the hopelessly lost and confused will rest their brains in a pasture moo moo .

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Unfortunately, in times of hardship it is common for racism and other right-wing attitudes to grow. Blaming those who are different for everything that is bad in life is not unusual behaviour... "Immigrants claiming thousands in benefits, living in mansions, taking our jobs & women, blah, blah, blah." those who are looking for someone to blame are quick to believe it all.

Cal"

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm not white. I don't like the taking of the knee. If I was a pro footballer, I wouldn't take the knee.

I wish football stayed non political.

I watch football, F1 as escapism and enjoyment. Not for symbolism and political messages.

Well then your racist according to some of these in here

Not taking the knee is not racist. Booing taking the knee is a clear indication that you probably are racist. I hope this helps.

I disagree on booing of the gesture as a sign of racism. What drew you to that conclusion? No hostility from me, a genuine enquiry to discuss our opposing views - Bob

They’re booing an anti-racist gesture. What else would you call anti-anti-racist?

It has been stated many times by many footballers that they aren’t kneeling for BLM.

Anti anti racism is racism. Anti BLM is not.

Also the children at the match were only there because the adults are banned for being racist. I think that makes it pretty obvious they were booing because they are racist.

That last sentence describes racism. So your view is anti racist. So you’re anti your own views?

Let’s defeat racism through education. And the hopelessly lost and confused will rest their brains in a pasture moo moo .

Love how you won't comment on India and Pakistan... Doesn't suit your narrative

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By *ust RachelTV/TS
over a year ago

Horsham

" That's a ridiculous statement. Bending the knee was unfortunately brought in for George Floyd's death.

Colin Kaepernick bent the knee in September 2016, 4 years before George Floyds murder.

He bent the knee to highlight injustices and police brutality. Please don’t try and double down and make yourself look foolish. "

I found this article about a similar event where he took the knee, apologies for the length but it saves you looking for it yourself.

The Psychology of Taking a Knee

The backlash against protests by Colin Kaepernick and other athletes raises all sorts of scientific questions

By Jeremy Adam Smith, Dacher Keltner on September 29, 2017

The Psychology of Taking a Knee

Players for the Kansas City Chiefs take a knee before a game against the L.A. Chargers on Sept. 24, 2017.

Editor's note: This piece first appeared several months ago. We're running it again in light of the NFL's declaration that teams will face fines from now on if players kneel during the National Anthem.

What does it mean to kneel? What emotions and beliefs does this action communicate? Does your culture or group membership affect how you see gestures like kneeling?

Those are some of the scientific questions raised when San Francisco 49ers quarterback Colin Kaepernick decided last year to kneel, instead of stand, for “The Star-Spangled Banner” before a preseason game. Teammate Eric Reid joined him. Their cause? Police violence against unarmed black people.

His knee unleashed a movement—and triggered a chain of events that culminated last week in the president of the United States calling a player who kneels a “son of a bitch.” Over the following days, dozens of NFL players—including entire teams—“took the knee” before their games. In response, crowds booed.

To some, Kaepernick and the players who kneel with him are “unpatriotic,” “ungrateful,” “disrespectful,” “degenerate,” to quote just a few of the descriptions hurled their way. To others, Kaepernick’s act—for which he may have paid dearly, as he is now unsigned—makes him a hero.

What’s going on?

At first glance, research into emotion and nonverbal communication suggests that there is nothing threatening about kneeling. Instead, kneeling is almost always deployed as a sign of deference and respect. We once kneeled before kings and queens and altars; we kneel to ask someone to marry, or at least men did in the old days. We kneel to get down to a child's level; we kneel to beg.

While we can’t know for sure, kneeling probably derives from a core principle in mammalian nonverbal behavior: make the body smaller and look up to show respect, esteem, and deference. This is seen, for example, in dogs and chimps, who reduce their height to show submissiveness. Kneeling can also be a posture of mourning and sadness. It makes the one who kneels more vulnerable. In some situations, kneeling can be seen as a request for protection—which is completely appropriate in Kaepernick’s case, given the motive of his protest.

As sports protests go, taking the knee might not seem nearly as subversive or dangerous as thrusting a black-power fist into the air, as Tommie Smith and John Carlos did during their medal ceremony at the 1968 Summer Olympics in Mexico City. Researchers David Matsumoto and Jess Tracy show that even blind athletes from over 20 countries thrust their arms in the air in triumph after winning, which reveals the deep-seated urge to signal power with that body-expanding gesture. You can also find power in the fist. In the Darwinian sense, the fist is the antithesis of the affiliative, open hand, but when we combine a raised arm with a fist it becomes something more communicative—a rallying cry. It’s a gesture that seeks to bring one group together while warning another away.

None of that should be too surprising. But there is an important point of similarity in the raised black-power fist—which makes bodies bigger—and the bended knee, which makes us smaller. Both Carlos and Smith bowed their heads in Mexico City, in a sign of respect and humility that accompanies their social signal of strength and triumph. That mix of messages makes the black-power salute one of the most famous, complex, effective nonverbal protests in our lifetimes—one that we can see echoed on today’s football field.

Which returns us to the kneel. Kneeling is a sign of reverence, submissiveness, deference—and sometimes mourning and vulnerability. But with a single, graceful act, Kaepernick invested it with a double meaning. He didn’t turn his back as the anthem was played, which would have been a true sign of disrespect. Nor did he rely on the now-conventionalized black-power fist.

Rather, he transformed a collective ritual—the playing of the national anthem—into something somber, a reminder of how far we still have to go to realize the high ideal of equal protection under the law that the flag represents. The athletes who followed him are showing reverence for the song and the flag, but they are simultaneously deviating from cultural norms at the moment their knees hit the grass.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I want more to be done about the racism in India and Pakistan nobody seems to care about.

Who is nobody by the way? Are you suggesting that nothing is being done? So there’s no resistance to this? Or groups working towards stopping this?

India or Pakistan only has to win the other at cricket and it leads to death in masses and extreme racism. This never gets even mentioned in the news. I'm highlighting the fact that most people only care for what their news spoon feeds them with BLM etc. It's about proportion and they are being manipulated massively. again, is what you’re describing racism? Or is it more xenophobia/ religious conflict? correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t it a direct result of White western intervention and European Empire? "

It is a religious conflict. I am not an expert in those statements either. But it's not really because of direct intervention of Western intervention. There is a long history to it. We could probably blame Britain for rushing the partition process that resulted in one of the most horrible violence in the country's history and also the Kashmir situation. But what happened before and after that is purely the result of people and the Indian/Pakistan governments.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Is this a good time to remind people that England fans, children and adults, were racially abusing some of their own players after the Euros last summer?

Let who is without sin cast the first stone.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I want more to be done about the racism in India and Pakistan nobody seems to care about.

Who is nobody by the way? Are you suggesting that nothing is being done? So there’s no resistance to this? Or groups working towards stopping this?

India or Pakistan only has to win the other at cricket and it leads to death in masses and extreme racism. This never gets even mentioned in the news. I'm highlighting the fact that most people only care for what their news spoon feeds them with BLM etc. It's about proportion and they are being manipulated massively. again, is what you’re describing racism? Or is it more xenophobia/ religious conflict? correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t it a direct result of White western intervention and European Empire?

I’m no expert on the situation but isn’t it similar to Russia/Ukraine. 2 countries got independence and they’ve been fighting ever since?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I ain't rasist in the slightest but that "taking a knee" is a total waste of time.. pure n utter Shite .

No we don't meet Asians before the abusive messages start pouring in to our inbox. Just doesn't do anything for us

..................................

Well it clearly isn't shite to the people who support it, just as your dislike of Asians isn't shite to you."

Bravo bravo!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Why boo it? If you don't agree with taking a knee for whatever reason, why not just stay quiet? Is there a need to be actively and outwardly negative? "

A fair point but it is a form of protest, how else would people show their dissatisfaction with something under those circumstances. Also, we all have the right to project negatively, otherwise you would have just a supportive mob and a passive mob.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm not white. I don't like the taking of the knee. If I was a pro footballer, I wouldn't take the knee.

I wish football stayed non political.

I watch football, F1 as escapism and enjoyment. Not for symbolism and political messages.

Well then your racist according to some of these in here

Not taking the knee is not racist. Booing taking the knee is a clear indication that you probably are racist. I hope this helps.

I disagree on booing of the gesture as a sign of racism. What drew you to that conclusion? No hostility from me, a genuine enquiry to discuss our opposing views - Bob

They’re booing an anti-racist gesture. What else would you call anti-anti-racist?

It has been stated many times by many footballers that they aren’t kneeling for BLM.

Anti anti racism is racism. Anti BLM is not.

Also the children at the match were only there because the adults are banned for being racist. I think that makes it pretty obvious they were booing because they are racist.

That last sentence describes racism. So your view is anti racist. So you’re anti your own views?"

Suggestions have been made that whites are racist, lock stock and barrel. No nuance, born that way. Condemned as racists just for being white. That line has been proposed by Xendi Abrams, I don’t buy into it. I have no time for anti-racist theory. I’m on board with getting rid of discrimination (with the exception of personal discrimination as I think people should make choices that impact them directly).

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I want more to be done about the racism in India and Pakistan nobody seems to care about.

Who is nobody by the way? Are you suggesting that nothing is being done? So there’s no resistance to this? Or groups working towards stopping this?

India or Pakistan only has to win the other at cricket and it leads to death in masses and extreme racism. This never gets even mentioned in the news. I'm highlighting the fact that most people only care for what their news spoon feeds them with BLM etc. It's about proportion and they are being manipulated massively. again, is what you’re describing racism? Or is it more xenophobia/ religious conflict? correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t it a direct result of White western intervention and European Empire?

It feels like because it's not white people being racist your making excuses and pondering to the only white people can be racist story. Which backs up my point.

No i asked you of you’re describing racism or xenophobia or a religious conflict. Nobody said or suggested only white people can be racist lol. You’re forcing something to prove that I’m someone you desperately want me to be. Just relax.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I want more to be done about the racism in India and Pakistan nobody seems to care about.

Who is nobody by the way? Are you suggesting that nothing is being done? So there’s no resistance to this? Or groups working towards stopping this?

India or Pakistan only has to win the other at cricket and it leads to death in masses and extreme racism. This never gets even mentioned in the news. I'm highlighting the fact that most people only care for what their news spoon feeds them with BLM etc. It's about proportion and they are being manipulated massively. again, is what you’re describing racism? Or is it more xenophobia/ religious conflict? correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t it a direct result of White western intervention and European Empire?

Thanks for this. I don’t know much about it other than a few videos I’ve watched on it a few years back.

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I want more to be done about the racism in India and Pakistan nobody seems to care about.

Who is nobody by the way? Are you suggesting that nothing is being done? So there’s no resistance to this? Or groups working towards stopping this?

India or Pakistan only has to win the other at cricket and it leads to death in masses and extreme racism. This never gets even mentioned in the news. I'm highlighting the fact that most people only care for what their news spoon feeds them with BLM etc. It's about proportion and they are being manipulated massively. again, is what you’re describing racism? Or is it more xenophobia/ religious conflict? correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t it a direct result of White western intervention and European Empire?

I’m no expert on the situation but isn’t it similar to Russia/Ukraine. 2 countries got independence and they’ve been fighting ever since?"

Partly yes. On one side, the countries are fighting over Kashmir. On the other side, there is a very small Hindu population in Pakistan which is a Muslim state and a good percentage of Muslims in India which is a secular state but with majority Hindu population and the minorities in both the countries face certain issues. I can't talk much about Pakistan because I have never been there. But Muslims in India have mostly leading a peaceful life except a couple of specific states where the tensions have been rife for a long time due to politics and religious history (a temple being replaced by mosque in the past or vice-versa). Otherwise, both the communities are in friendly terms in other states.

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By *en_Dover79Man
over a year ago

Oswaldtwistle

"Is boo If I’d had nothing to eat….."

what has nothing to eat got to do with it?

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By *he_Last_TitanMan
over a year ago

Bristol

"Bending the knee became big news mainly when George Floyd was killed.

Unfortunately George Floyd wasn't a saint so I personally wouldn't bend the knee for him.

Would I bend the knee for other important racial issues? Sure.

The bending of the knee is now seen as a peaceful protest to highlight injustices. The protest is beyond a single individual.

Why is it that only English teams do it and others don’t.

The message has been lost as it was coloured people taking the knee in reference to the injustice by police. "

Coloured people?

…1970s is on the phone. They’re asking for you to return…

The message has only been lost on the ignorant. But just in case you’re confused:

Taking the knee is a protesting racial injustice - wherever, however, whenever.

Amazing how many people find this offensive but obviously not the conduct it seeks to challenge.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Is boo If I’d had nothing to eat…..

what has nothing to eat got to do with it?"

It’s a joke about ‘Hungary children’

(closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I want more to be done about the racism in India and Pakistan nobody seems to care about.

Who is nobody by the way? Are you suggesting that nothing is being done? So there’s no resistance to this? Or groups working towards stopping this?

India or Pakistan only has to win the other at cricket and it leads to death in masses and extreme racism. This never gets even mentioned in the news. I'm highlighting the fact that most people only care for what their news spoon feeds them with BLM etc. It's about proportion and they are being manipulated massively. again, is what you’re describing racism? Or is it more xenophobia/ religious conflict? correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t it a direct result of White western intervention and European Empire?

I’m no expert on the situation but isn’t it similar to Russia/Ukraine. 2 countries got independence and they’ve been fighting ever since?

Indeed the building of the Babri Masjid Mosque caused quite a flashpoint

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm not white. I don't like the taking of the knee. If I was a pro footballer, I wouldn't take the knee.

I wish football stayed non political.

I watch football, F1 as escapism and enjoyment. Not for symbolism and political messages.

Well then your racist according to some of these in here

Not taking the knee is not racist. Booing taking the knee is a clear indication that you probably are racist. I hope this helps.

I disagree on booing of the gesture as a sign of racism. What drew you to that conclusion? No hostility from me, a genuine enquiry to discuss our opposing views - Bob

They’re booing an anti-racist gesture. What else would you call anti-anti-racist?

It has been stated many times by many footballers that they aren’t kneeling for BLM.

Anti anti racism is racism. Anti BLM is not.

Also the children at the match were only there because the adults are banned for being racist. I think that makes it pretty obvious they were booing because they are racist.

That last sentence describes racism. So your view is anti racist. So you’re anti your own views?

Your bored of racism. People of colour are also bored with racism . It’s 2022, and racism clearly lives on because some people are upset with a bent knee . Lol

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By *en_Dover79Man
over a year ago

Oswaldtwistle

"Is boo If I’d had nothing to eat…..

what has nothing to eat got to do with it?

It’s a joke about ‘Hungary children’

ah a joke I wondered if it was that or they were just being a bit numpty... cant tell nowadays haha

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm not white. I don't like the taking of the knee. If I was a pro footballer, I wouldn't take the knee.

I wish football stayed non political.

I watch football, F1 as escapism and enjoyment. Not for symbolism and political messages.

Well then your racist according to some of these in here

Not taking the knee is not racist. Booing taking the knee is a clear indication that you probably are racist. I hope this helps.

I disagree on booing of the gesture as a sign of racism. What drew you to that conclusion? No hostility from me, a genuine enquiry to discuss our opposing views - Bob

They’re booing an anti-racist gesture. What else would you call anti-anti-racist?

It has been stated many times by many footballers that they aren’t kneeling for BLM.

Anti anti racism is racism. Anti BLM is not.

Also the children at the match were only there because the adults are banned for being racist. I think that makes it pretty obvious they were booing because they are racist.

That last sentence describes racism. So your view is anti racist. So you’re anti your own views?

Your bored of racism. People of colour are also bored with racism . It’s 2022, and racism clearly lives on because some people are upset with a bent knee . Lol "

That’s unfair Sammy, I didn’t suggest I was bored of the issue and such a comment has been far below your previous contributions on this thread which have been well considered. Of course racism exists, there are enough people who can cite personal experiences of it . My issue is with the gesture, not the sentiment attached.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Is this a good time to remind people that England fans, children and adults, were racially abusing some of their own players after the Euros last summer?

Let who is without sin cast the first stone."

You mean some England fans are racist too, and would be upset seeing our players bend the knee.

Ever see a meat eater protest outside a butchers !

Ever see a racist support a bent knee !

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I want more to be done about the racism in India and Pakistan nobody seems to care about.

Who is nobody by the way? Are you suggesting that nothing is being done? So there’s no resistance to this? Or groups working towards stopping this?

India or Pakistan only has to win the other at cricket and it leads to death in masses and extreme racism. This never gets even mentioned in the news. I'm highlighting the fact that most people only care for what their news spoon feeds them with BLM etc. It's about proportion and they are being manipulated massively. again, is what you’re describing racism? Or is it more xenophobia/ religious conflict? correct me if I’m wrong but isn’t it a direct result of White western intervention and European Empire?

I’m no expert on the situation but isn’t it similar to Russia/Ukraine. 2 countries got independence and they’ve been fighting ever since?

Indeed the building of the Babri Masjid Mosque caused quite a flashpoint"

Indeed

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm not white. I don't like the taking of the knee. If I was a pro footballer, I wouldn't take the knee.

I wish football stayed non political.

I watch football, F1 as escapism and enjoyment. Not for symbolism and political messages.

Well then your racist according to some of these in here

Not taking the knee is not racist. Booing taking the knee is a clear indication that you probably are racist. I hope this helps.

I disagree on booing of the gesture as a sign of racism. What drew you to that conclusion? No hostility from me, a genuine enquiry to discuss our opposing views - Bob

They’re booing an anti-racist gesture. What else would you call anti-anti-racist?

It has been stated many times by many footballers that they aren’t kneeling for BLM.

Anti anti racism is racism. Anti BLM is not.

Also the children at the match were only there because the adults are banned for being racist. I think that makes it pretty obvious they were booing because they are racist.

That last sentence describes racism. So your view is anti racist. So you’re anti your own views?

Your bored of racism. People of colour are also bored with racism . It’s 2022, and racism clearly lives on because some people are upset with a bent knee . Lol

When is a campaign to raise awareness to rid racism more then a gesture ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm not white. I don't like the taking of the knee. If I was a pro footballer, I wouldn't take the knee.

I wish football stayed non political.

I watch football, F1 as escapism and enjoyment. Not for symbolism and political messages.

Well then your racist according to some of these in here

Not taking the knee is not racist. Booing taking the knee is a clear indication that you probably are racist. I hope this helps.

I disagree on booing of the gesture as a sign of racism. What drew you to that conclusion? No hostility from me, a genuine enquiry to discuss our opposing views - Bob

They’re booing an anti-racist gesture. What else would you call anti-anti-racist?

It has been stated many times by many footballers that they aren’t kneeling for BLM.

Anti anti racism is racism. Anti BLM is not.

Also the children at the match were only there because the adults are banned for being racist. I think that makes it pretty obvious they were booing because they are racist.

That last sentence describes racism. So your view is anti racist. So you’re anti your own views?

Your bored of racism. People of colour are also bored with racism . It’s 2022, and racism clearly lives on because some people are upset with a bent knee . Lol

When is a campaign to raise awareness to rid racism more then a gesture ? "

I concede the campaign is bigger than the gesture and certainly more important, however I don’t like the gesture, I’m not going to relent on that. Having said that, I’m ready to defend myself against any accusations that might be made that I’m racist, as that doesn’t meet what my idea of a racist is

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I’m out, thank you to those I conversed with on here, I appreciate your time - Bob

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 05/06/22 21:09:18]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm not white. I don't like the taking of the knee. If I was a pro footballer, I wouldn't take the knee.

I wish football stayed non political.

I watch football, F1 as escapism and enjoyment. Not for symbolism and political messages.

Well then your racist according to some of these in here

Not taking the knee is not racist. Booing taking the knee is a clear indication that you probably are racist. I hope this helps.

I disagree on booing of the gesture as a sign of racism. What drew you to that conclusion? No hostility from me, a genuine enquiry to discuss our opposing views - Bob

They’re booing an anti-racist gesture. What else would you call anti-anti-racist?

It has been stated many times by many footballers that they aren’t kneeling for BLM.

Anti anti racism is racism. Anti BLM is not.

Also the children at the match were only there because the adults are banned for being racist. I think that makes it pretty obvious they were booing because they are racist.

That last sentence describes racism. So your view is anti racist. So you’re anti your own views?

Your bored of racism. People of colour are also bored with racism . It’s 2022, and racism clearly lives on because some people are upset with a bent knee . Lol

When is a campaign to raise awareness to rid racism more then a gesture ?

Your idea of racism and what racism means to people of colour … don’t you see what’s wrong in this statement ?

I don’t believe you are.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I’m out, thank you to those I conversed with on here, I appreciate your time - Bob"

I wish us people of colour could checkout as easily.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 05/06/22 21:15:57]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I’m out, thank you to those I conversed with on here, I appreciate your time - Bob

I wish us people of colour could checkout as easily. "

Apologies, will continue another day, not disinterest or indifference on my part, sorry if it appeared that way

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I’m out, thank you to those I conversed with on here, I appreciate your time - Bob

I wish us people of colour could checkout as easily. "

This is us/them is the problem, racism happens to ALL people in various forms like it or not. Do some people get the blunt end of it? Sure. But pardon the pun it's not black and white. Denying this only adds fuel to fire.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm not white. I don't like the taking of the knee. If I was a pro footballer, I wouldn't take the knee.

I wish football stayed non political.

I watch football, F1 as escapism and enjoyment. Not for symbolism and political messages.

Well then your racist according to some of these in here

Not taking the knee is not racist. Booing taking the knee is a clear indication that you probably are racist. I hope this helps.

I disagree on booing of the gesture as a sign of racism. What drew you to that conclusion? No hostility from me, a genuine enquiry to discuss our opposing views - Bob

They’re booing an anti-racist gesture. What else would you call anti-anti-racist?

It has been stated many times by many footballers that they aren’t kneeling for BLM.

Anti anti racism is racism. Anti BLM is not.

Also the children at the match were only there because the adults are banned for being racist. I think that makes it pretty obvious they were booing because they are racist.

That last sentence describes racism. So your view is anti racist. So you’re anti your own views?

Maybe me and you have different views on what anti-racism is. You see it as a movement, I see it as don’t be racist. And by racist I mean discriminating against ANYONE for the colour of their skin/race.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Is this a good time to remind people that England fans, children and adults, were racially abusing some of their own players after the Euros last summer?

Let who is without sin cast the first stone.

You mean some England fans are racist too, and would be upset seeing our players bend the knee.

Ever see a meat eater protest outside a butchers !

Ever see a racist support a bent knee ! "

They didn't just boo them for taking the knee. They attacked them on social media because of the result.

Racism is never acceptable, but pointing the finger at Hungarian fans is hypocritical, given the actions of your own fans.

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By *ssex_tom OP Man
over a year ago

Chelmsford

And what about singing the National Anthem?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Suggestions have been made that whites are racist, lock stock and barrel. No nuance, born that way. Condemned as racists just for being white. That line has been proposed by Xendi Abrams, I don’t buy into it. I have no time for anti-racist theory. I’m on board with getting rid of discrimination (with the exception of personal discrimination as I think people should make choices that impact them directly)."
did he say that? I read something that many took that way that he clarified. He clarified he doesn’t believe white people to be inherently racist. I’ve not read his work to be honest but yeah. Just wanted to clarify this.

And also lots of anti racism does tend to use language that makes white people uncomfortable in that it highlights the power dynamics or domination involved in racism. That’s not to say white people are the only racist people at all which I think people take it as but I read it as looking at the differences in consequence of said racism because of said racism. Long to explain on a fab thread but I don’t think anti racism literature or theories should be dismissed. It’s important and I think key to any effective anti racism that stands a chance of improving the conditions and experiences of people of colour around the world.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"And what about singing the National Anthem?"

I don't even know the national anthem. I don't care who sings it or doesn't personally.

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West

"And what about singing the National Anthem?"

Knowing the second verse should be a prerequisite to get a passport

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By *ssex_tom OP Man
over a year ago

Chelmsford

"And what about singing the National Anthem?

I don't even know the national anthem. I don't care who sings it or doesn't personally. "

You do not know that the National Anthem of England is God Save the Queen?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"And what about singing the National Anthem?"

What about it? It’s not that deep, Tom.

Belonging to a nation has nothing to do with singing a song or believing in a monarchy (which not singing the anthem is not really all about). So what if an England player doesn’t sing it?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Suggestions have been made that whites are racist, lock stock and barrel. No nuance, born that way. Condemned as racists just for being white. That line has been proposed by Xendi Abrams, I don’t buy into it. I have no time for anti-racist theory. I’m on board with getting rid of discrimination (with the exception of personal discrimination as I think people should make choices that impact them directly). did he say that? I read something that many took that way that he clarified. He clarified he doesn’t believe white people to be inherently racist. I’ve not read his work to be honest but yeah. Just wanted to clarify this.

Sounded ok til that last bit. Can you agree it should be people of all colour? That doesn't mean some people don't have it harder but the key has to be ALL people are equal.

I've heard people say white priveledge this and that but on the other hand are happy to receive a job given to them to create a diverse workforce and not on merit? Which is actually racist to everyone involved however surely the aim should be everyone is treated equal? Why do you keep segmenting people of colour? We all have our own issues currently. We should all be one team!

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