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"I have just seen footage of protesters lying on the floor on the mall today, blocking the route of the queens guards. The police literally dragged them off the road and out of the way it seconds. How come when they block roads like the M25, the police sit and watch and allow it to happen?" Cos it only affects the plebs, not the self appointed special ones  | |||
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"I have just seen footage of protesters lying on the floor on the mall today, blocking the route of the queens guards. The police literally dragged them off the road and out of the way it seconds. How come when they block roads like the M25, the police sit and watch and allow it to happen? Cos it only affects the plebs, not the self appointed special ones "How did the Queen appoint herself Queen ? | |||
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"You know Tom covered this about 12 hours ago… https://m.fabswingers.com/forum/politics/1310894 "Sorry, didn’t see it. | |||
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LvM | |||
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"They’re not really helping themselves" What were they protesting against? | |||
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"Were they not dragged away for their own safety? The Guards aren't going to march around them are they? Imagine the outcry if the Police left them there to get trampled on? " Probably should have. | |||
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"Were they not dragged away for their own safety? The Guards aren't going to march around them are they? Imagine the outcry if the Police left them there to get trampled on? " Maybe, but I don’t think that was the case. It was a swift and no nonsense approach. | |||
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"Were they not dragged away for their own safety? The Guards aren't going to march around them are they? Imagine the outcry if the Police left them there to get trampled on? " I was just going to say this. I don’t think the guards would have stopped. Because stopping could endanger the lives of royalty. There is probably some very ancient law that says that Sovereignty and those escorting them are allowed to trample citizens who get in front of their carriage or something. | |||
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"Were they not dragged away for their own safety? The Guards aren't going to march around them are they? Imagine the outcry if the Police left them there to get trampled on? Maybe, but I don’t think that was the case. It was a swift and no nonsense approach. " So what should the Police have done in that circumstance? | |||
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"I have just seen footage of protesters lying on the floor on the mall today, blocking the route of the queens guards. The police literally dragged them off the road and out of the way it seconds. How come when they block roads like the M25, the police sit and watch and allow it to happen?" Maybe because the police were already there? I'm mean, if you're actually standing there it really doesn't take long to respond. 
As opposed to being God knows how many messages away on the M25 and having to fight your way through traffic due to the motorway being blocked by idiots.
Thats my theory.
Winston | |||
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"Were they not dragged away for their own safety? The Guards aren't going to march around them are they? Imagine the outcry if the Police left them there to get trampled on? Maybe, but I don’t think that was the case. It was a swift and no nonsense approach. So what should the Police have done in that circumstance? " Personally, I think they did exactly the right thing. And should do the same with other protesters who feel that they can illegally interfere with peoples day to day lives. | |||
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"I have just seen footage of protesters lying on the floor on the mall today, blocking the route of the queens guards. The police literally dragged them off the road and out of the way it seconds. How come when they block roads like the M25, the police sit and watch and allow it to happen? Maybe because the police were already there? I'm mean, if you're actually standing there it really doesn't take long to respond.
As opposed to being God knows how many messages away on the M25 and having to fight your way through traffic due to the motorway being blocked by idiots.
Thats my theory.
Winston"Think that your right. It’s easier to nip in the bud when they are already on the scene. | |||
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"Personally, I think they did exactly the right thing. And should do the same with other protesters who feel that they can illegally interfere with peoples day to day lives. " The tolerance of peaceful protest is a sign of a healthy democracy. Don't have to agree with them to allow them to have their say. I think we have it about right. 'You've made made your point, now move along sunshine'  | |||
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"Personally, I think they did exactly the right thing. And should do the same with other protesters who feel that they can illegally interfere with peoples day to day lives. The tolerance of peaceful protest is a sign of a healthy democracy. Don't have to agree with them to allow them to have their say. I think we have it about right. 'You've made made your point, now move along sunshine' "I agree, people have the right to protest. But protesters who think that they are above the law should be dealt with accordingly. | |||
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"Were they not dragged away for their own safety? The Guards aren't going to march around them are they? Imagine the outcry if the Police left them there to get trampled on? Maybe, but I don’t think that was the case. It was a swift and no nonsense approach. So what should the Police have done in that circumstance? Personally, I think they did exactly the right thing. And should do the same with other protesters who feel that they can illegally interfere with peoples day to day lives. " Absolutely they should... Each situation needs assessing on it's own merit, environment, level of threat, location and Police deployment all factor in I guess | |||
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"...But protesters who think that they are above the law should be dealt with accordingly." I'd question what is the difference between disagreeing with a law, and thinking you are above the law? Were the kinder scout trespassers protesting the law, or considering themselves above it? How about the Tolpuddle Martyrs? It's only really long after an event that these decisions can be made I think. Sometimes it's just which side of history did you fall on. | |||
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"...But protesters who think that they are above the law should be dealt with accordingly. I'd question what is the difference between disagreeing with a law, and thinking you are above the law? Were the kinder scout trespassers protesting the law, or considering themselves above it? How about the Tolpuddle Martyrs? It's only really long after an event that these decisions can be made I think. Sometimes it's just which side of history did you fall on." This is a very good point. Kinder scout was a mass tresspass and I believe no real harm was done other than defiance. The tolpuddle is very interesting. People standing up against unfair work conditions was believed to be the original trade union. Again, people standing up for their rights. Now compare this to people blockading a petrol station and vandalising the pumps so that nobody can use them. Or people vandalising 4x4 vehicles. I have more sympathy for the two cases that you mentioned than the behaviour of vandals, even if their cause is valid. | |||
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"...This is a very good point... Kinder scout was a mass tresspass and I believe no real harm was done other than defiance. " It was a mass trespass onto what was at the time private land, kept in tip top condition. The trespass ultimately led to the mass erosion that has caused significant damage to our outdoor spaces and the wildlife that lives there. "...I have more sympathy for the two cases that you mentioned than the behaviour of vandals, even if their cause is valid." Open up the countryside to free access has caused more damage to our landscape than a few vandals attacking 4x4s...which themselves cause a lot of damage to the environment, e.g. go scuba diving on the great barrier reef, a huge proportion of it is dead, 4x4s are not directly responsible, but they're part of the problem. Ultimately I don't come down on a side, I'm simply saying that this isn't as black and white as everyone should obey every law without question or protest. | |||
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"...This is a very good point... Kinder scout was a mass tresspass and I believe no real harm was done other than defiance. It was a mass trespass onto what was at the time private land, kept in tip top condition. The trespass ultimately led to the mass erosion that has caused significant damage to our outdoor spaces and the wildlife that lives there. ...I have more sympathy for the two cases that you mentioned than the behaviour of vandals, even if their cause is valid. Open up the countryside to free access has caused more damage to our landscape than a few vandals attacking 4x4s...which themselves cause a lot of damage to the environment, e.g. go scuba diving on the great barrier reef, a huge proportion of it is dead, 4x4s are not directly responsible, but they're part of the problem. Ultimately I don't come down on a side, I'm simply saying that this isn't as black and white as everyone should obey every law without question or protest." Again, a good point, the law of unintended consequences is very real. But breaking laws and protesting against them are different. I agree with one, but not the other. | |||
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"...But breaking laws and protesting against them are different. I agree with one, but not the other." Trespassing on kinder scout was definitely breaking laws, not just protesting against them. An interesting discussion, hopefully we can have some more, but I'm afraid I have a long bike ride and a run tomorrow, so sadly time for me to duck out, night | |||
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"...This is a very good point... Kinder scout was a mass tresspass and I believe no real harm was done other than defiance. It was a mass trespass onto what was at the time private land, kept in tip top condition. The trespass ultimately led to the mass erosion that has caused significant damage to our outdoor spaces and the wildlife that lives there. ...I have more sympathy for the two cases that you mentioned than the behaviour of vandals, even if their cause is valid. Open up the countryside to free access has caused more damage to our landscape than a few vandals attacking 4x4s...which themselves cause a lot of damage to the environment, e.g. go scuba diving on the great barrier reef, a huge proportion of it is dead, 4x4s are not directly responsible, but they're part of the problem. Ultimately I don't come down on a side, I'm simply saying that this isn't as black and white as everyone should obey every law without question or protest." Don't bring us 4x4 drivers into it, I think you'll find Prius drivers do far more damage to the planet than us for a number of reasons. | |||
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"They’re not really helping themselves What were they protesting against?" Reclaim royal land for the people. | |||
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"I have just seen footage of protesters lying on the floor on the mall today, blocking the route of the queens guards. The police literally dragged them off the road and out of the way it seconds. How come when they block roads like the M25, the police sit and watch and allow it to happen? Cos it only affects the plebs, not the self appointed special ones
How did the Queen appoint herself Queen ? "Perhaps not self appointed , but if one is in anyway interested in positions being awarded on merit then it’s hypocritical to celebrate someone ‘achieving’ the pinnacle of our public life through who gave birth to them. the Monarchy props up an entire class system which works against this very idea. Look at where a succession of prime ministers studied. With the Queen at the top, a shining beacon of privilege of birth, it is always going to be more difficult to have a society where people achieve positions on the basis of merit. It was an important driver for me leaving a nation which operates on a borderline ‘caste’ system. As for royals bringing tourists in , well those buildings will still be there if the monarchy is abolished. | |||
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"I have just seen footage of protesters lying on the floor on the mall today, blocking the route of the queens guards. The police literally dragged them off the road and out of the way it seconds. How come when they block roads like the M25, the police sit and watch and allow it to happen?" You're always going to get idiots like Extinction rebellion. Now they want to throw themselves at the mall. If it was up to me I'd throw them in the Thames estuary. | |||
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