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Am I a xenophobic racist?

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By *ebjonnson OP   Man
over a year ago

Maldon

Just saw the news clip of the RNLI boat bringing in another group of mainly young men , rescued from the channel.

It irritated me. Im also irritated by the decades long inability of the UK or French authorities to get to grips with this issue.

I like to think of myself as a caring , moderate, man of the world. Love and peace to all etc.

I’m also very irritated at my recent restrictions post Brexit to not spend as much time as I like anywhere in Europe. Just a bad morning perhaps?

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex

You're irritated both by your inability to go anywhere you please and other people's attempts to do the same?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

What does "get to grips with" mean to you?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"You're irritated both by your inability to go anywhere you please and other people's attempts to do the same?"

Awesome reply.

Mr

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By *elkieWoman
over a year ago

Durham


"Just saw the news clip of the RNLI boat bringing in another group of mainly young men , rescued from the channel.

It irritated me. Im also irritated by the decades long inability of the UK or French authorities to get to grips with this issue.

I like to think of myself as a caring , moderate, man of the world. Love and peace to all etc.

I’m also very irritated at my recent restrictions post Brexit to not spend as much time as I like anywhere in Europe. Just a bad morning perhaps? "

Have you considered being a bleeding heart liberal instead? Far more scope to complain about people, and you get to knit hats for refugees as well.

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By *yron69Man
over a year ago

Fareham

Those people will eventually pay the tax that will ensure you’re looked after in your old age.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

i can understand people fleeing unsafe countries but cant understand them risking their life crossing from france a safe western country to get here what is it about here they need to risk death to cross from a already safe country they are in??? partic when we are so bad and racist and backward compared to rest of europe apparently

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

On one hand I understand your frustration OP. I too am extremely upset that a privilege I was born with has just been stripped away from me without my control. However to retain your compassion just give a thought to the glaring difference between floating here on a dingy and freely moving the continent.

Most of these people are running from hell. They are not risking their lives for a house in a country that hates them just to spite us. If we don't want to see foreigners being rescued from our shoreline then we need to address the reasons why they make these perilous journeys in the first place. Our wars abroad, our foreign policy and economic plans for the rest of the world are destroying their homes so they come here. We are all victims of the abuses thrust upon this world by greed, fear and hate but trust me, we have more in common with those poor than we do our wealthy.

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By *tstillworksMan
over a year ago

Darlington


"i can understand people fleeing unsafe countries but cant understand them risking their life crossing from france a safe western country to get here what is it about here they need to risk death to cross from a already safe country they are in??? partic when we are so bad and racist and backward compared to rest of europe apparently

"

Well said

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By *melia DominaTV/TS
over a year ago

Edinburgh (She/Her)

This is one of these posts where I can watch and fill up my block list with relative ease...

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By *hrista BellendWoman
over a year ago

surrounded by twinkly lights

Tbf it would probably irritate them if you were that desperate man risking his life to find a safe place where he won't get killed...

The whole world is severely lacking in equality and I don't see it changing in my lifetime

As Howard Stark said "I am ahead of my time but limited by my technology"

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By *annaBeStrongMan
over a year ago

wokingham


"Just saw the news clip of the RNLI boat bringing in another group of mainly young men , rescued from the channel.

It irritated me. Im also irritated by the decades long inability of the UK or French authorities to get to grips with this issue.

I like to think of myself as a caring , moderate, man of the world. Love and peace to all etc.

I’m also very irritated at my recent restrictions post Brexit to not spend as much time as I like anywhere in Europe. Just a bad morning perhaps? "

There’s nothing wrong with wanting proper boarder control.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *inkyInkedBiWoman
over a year ago

.

This popped up on my Facebook memories today.

‘My parents voted to leave to ‘stop all these immigrants’ They have both subsequently died in the past 3 years. We watched, as each in turn were nursed to a dignified and comfortable death by nursing and care staff from the European Union. The irony was not lost on us’

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex

https://www.bbc.com/news/explainers-53734793

This makes for quite interesting reading

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By *orkswatcherMan
over a year ago

Wakefield

Having spent quite a lot of time in Northern France pre covid, the French don't really care. They just want rid of them. The people don't want to be in France for whatever reason the UK is seen as the place to be. Despite traveling across a number of better countries

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I don't know for sure why they are risking their life to get here. Bit given they are, my first reaction is they have a fucking good reason. Who here would risk their life just to get benefits?

I genuinely can't imagine what they must be feeling to get in a dinghy to face that stretch of water. Maybe if we spent a few moments to ponder we would have a different view.

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By *assConductorMan
over a year ago

the wild


"You're irritated both by your inability to go anywhere you please and other people's attempts to do the same?"

Truly a conundrum.

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By *ranny-CrumpetWoman
over a year ago

The Town by The Cross

Being irritated doesn't make you racist Seb....

Your thoughts and reasons that made you irritated could do but it's not a certainty.

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By *ranny-CrumpetWoman
over a year ago

The Town by The Cross


"This is one of these posts where I can watch and fill up my block list with relative ease... "

What ever is important in your life.

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By *elkieWoman
over a year ago

Durham


"i can understand people fleeing unsafe countries but cant understand them risking their life crossing from france a safe western country to get here what is it about here they need to risk death to cross from a already safe country they are in??? partic when we are so bad and racist and backward compared to rest of europe apparently

"

It’s probably totally unrelated to the fact that they saw our soldiers in their home country for years and so they think we’re trustworthy.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"i can understand people fleeing unsafe countries but cant understand them risking their life crossing from france a safe western country to get here what is it about here they need to risk death to cross from a already safe country they are in??? partic when we are so bad and racist and backward compared to rest of europe apparently

It’s probably totally unrelated to the fact that they saw our soldiers in their home country for years and so they think we’re trustworthy. "

the french were there too?

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By *itsAndTangentsCouple
over a year ago

Plymouth

I mean the answer is clear then right, get on a cramped boat that probably has a 50/50 chance of sinking with 75 other desperate people and sail towards Spain, free holiday woooo

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By *imi_RougeWoman
over a year ago

Portsmouth


"i can understand people fleeing unsafe countries but cant understand them risking their life crossing from france a safe western country to get here what is it about here they need to risk death to cross from a already safe country they are in??? partic when we are so bad and racist and backward compared to rest of europe apparently

"

This is what I don't understand

What is the rest of Europe doing to help? Went are they so intent on risking their lives to get here? What's wrong with Germany, France, Spain... Or do those countries have help in place for these people?

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By *yron69Man
over a year ago

Fareham

Does Ireland have this issue out of interest?

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By *andsome HandMan
over a year ago

roundabout

I've always thought that for people to leave their home and risk their lives by making that crossing they must be trying to escape something horrific and who am I to judge.

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex

The UK receives 1/3rd of the asylum applications that France does and a tiny fraction of the numbers of refugees that Turkey does

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

My dad set up a charity and has worked for years dealing with asylum seekers from Syria, Iraq, Darfur etc and some of the stories he's told me are horrific. He's even written a book about it and you can't even begin to understand the desperation that causes these people to risk life in a flimsy dinghy. These are people that can't stay in their own country through fear of death due to the regime they live under.

What a lot of people struggle with is differentiating between political asylum and illegal immigration and everyone then gets tarred with the same brush. As a so-called civilised society I believe we (and other nations) have a duty of care to help to anyone fleeing persecution.

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex


"My dad set up a charity and has worked for years dealing with asylum seekers from Syria, Iraq, Darfur etc and some of the stories he's told me are horrific. He's even written a book about it and you can't even begin to understand the desperation that causes these people to risk life in a flimsy dinghy. These are people that can't stay in their own country through fear of death due to the regime they live under.

What a lot of people struggle with is differentiating between political asylum and illegal immigration and everyone then gets tarred with the same brush. As a so-called civilised society I believe we (and other nations) have a duty of care to help to anyone fleeing persecution."

Your dad must be a very interesting man to talk to

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By *mateur100Man
over a year ago

nr faversham


"My dad set up a charity and has worked for years dealing with asylum seekers from Syria, Iraq, Darfur etc and some of the stories he's told me are horrific. He's even written a book about it and you can't even begin to understand the desperation that causes these people to risk life in a flimsy dinghy. These are people that can't stay in their own country through fear of death due to the regime they live under.

What a lot of people struggle with is differentiating between political asylum and illegal immigration and everyone then gets tarred with the same brush. As a so-called civilised society I believe we (and other nations) have a duty of care to help to anyone fleeing persecution."

You're absolutely right. I certainly have no issue with anyone entering the UK legally. It's the illegal entrants that I have an issue with and paying thousands to a people smuggling operation can't be anything other than illegal.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Just saw the news clip of the RNLI boat bringing in another group of mainly young men , rescued from the channel.

It irritated me. Im also irritated by the decades long inability of the UK or French authorities to get to grips with this issue.

I like to think of myself as a caring , moderate, man of the world. Love and peace to all etc.

I’m also very irritated at my recent restrictions post Brexit to not spend as much time as I like anywhere in Europe. Just a bad morning perhaps?

There’s nothing wrong with wanting proper boarder control. "

Comedy Gold...lol

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"On one hand I understand your frustration OP. I too am extremely upset that a privilege I was born with has just been stripped away from me without my control. However to retain your compassion just give a thought to the glaring difference between floating here on a dingy and freely moving the continent.

Most of these people are running from hell. They are not risking their lives for a house in a country that hates them just to spite us. If we don't want to see foreigners being rescued from our shoreline then we need to address the reasons why they make these perilous journeys in the first place. Our wars abroad, our foreign policy and economic plans for the rest of the world are destroying their homes so they come here. We are all victims of the abuses thrust upon this world by greed, fear and hate but trust me, we have more in common with those poor than we do our wealthy. "

Totally

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"My dad set up a charity and has worked for years dealing with asylum seekers from Syria, Iraq, Darfur etc and some of the stories he's told me are horrific. He's even written a book about it and you can't even begin to understand the desperation that causes these people to risk life in a flimsy dinghy. These are people that can't stay in their own country through fear of death due to the regime they live under.

What a lot of people struggle with is differentiating between political asylum and illegal immigration and everyone then gets tarred with the same brush. As a so-called civilised society I believe we (and other nations) have a duty of care to help to anyone fleeing persecution.

You're absolutely right. I certainly have no issue with anyone entering the UK legally. It's the illegal entrants that I have an issue with and paying thousands to a people smuggling operation can't be anything other than illegal. "
afaik anyone seeking asylum are legal regardless of how they arrive in the UK.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"You're irritated both by your inability to go anywhere you please and other people's attempts to do the same?"

Excellent

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By *ervent_fervourMan
over a year ago

Halifax


"You're irritated both by your inability to go anywhere you please and other people's attempts to do the same?"

Wittiest thing I've read in any kind of media all week.

Perfect.

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By *mateur100Man
over a year ago

nr faversham


"My dad set up a charity and has worked for years dealing with asylum seekers from Syria, Iraq, Darfur etc and some of the stories he's told me are horrific. He's even written a book about it and you can't even begin to understand the desperation that causes these people to risk life in a flimsy dinghy. These are people that can't stay in their own country through fear of death due to the regime they live under.

What a lot of people struggle with is differentiating between political asylum and illegal immigration and everyone then gets tarred with the same brush. As a so-called civilised society I believe we (and other nations) have a duty of care to help to anyone fleeing persecution.

You're absolutely right. I certainly have no issue with anyone entering the UK legally. It's the illegal entrants that I have an issue with and paying thousands to a people smuggling operation can't be anything other than illegal. afaik anyone seeking asylum are legal regardless of how they arrive in the UK. "

If they notify the authorities of the presence and have good reason for their claim.

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By *otMe66Man
over a year ago

Terra Firma


"https://www.bbc.com/news/explainers-53734793

This makes for quite interesting reading"

That link is great and led me to some actual figures that put a lot of this into perspective.

I was surprised to read that illegal crossings in 2019 were only 1% of all asylum requests and that the UK have far fewer asylum seekers than France and Germany.

Our news headlines paint a very different picture to this....

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

What the Germans didn't want to do is now being achieved by Dinghy!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"What the Germans didn't want to do is now being achieved by Dinghy! "
Britain now has its assets in the air (ass in the air?) and the sea is long gone!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Isn't it internationa maritime law that people stranded at sea are picked up? As far as I can recall, there's no clauses that say "yeah but apart from those guys"

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman
over a year ago

On a mooch


"https://www.bbc.com/news/explainers-53734793

This makes for quite interesting reading

That link is great and led me to some actual figures that put a lot of this into perspective.

I was surprised to read that illegal crossings in 2019 were only 1% of all asylum requests and that the UK have far fewer asylum seekers than France and Germany.

Our news headlines paint a very different picture to this.... "

Always good to look past the headline, we take some but no where near what other European countries do.

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By *awpleasureMan
over a year ago

Sutton Coldfield

Whenever I see the dinghys they're full of young men. Going to be a gender imbalance in the future.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Whenever I see the dinghys they're full of young men. Going to be a gender imbalance in the future. "

Bit like Fab then.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Alot of people have some form of family in the UK which is the first requirement for asylum

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By *mateur100Man
over a year ago

nr faversham


"Isn't it internationa maritime law that people stranded at sea are picked up? As far as I can recall, there's no clauses that say "yeah but apart from those guys""

International maritime law states that the boats should meet a whole raft ( ) of standards which are conveniently ignored by the French I believe

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By *iamondCougarWoman
over a year ago

Norfuck! / Lincolnshire

It’s not their fault for seeking a better life….

It’s our fault for not managing it properly. Australia/Canada/USA manage it successfully…. Why can’t we!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Isn't it internationa maritime law that people stranded at sea are picked up? As far as I can recall, there's no clauses that say "yeah but apart from those guys"

International maritime law states that the boats should meet a whole raft ( ) of standards which are conveniently ignored by the French I believe "

Quote the standards oar do one.

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By *EW4UMRSMan
over a year ago

close 2U

You should all be upset and pissed we’re not controlling our boarders.you don’t have a clue who’s coming in what crimes they’ve vomited in other countries. Rapist. Nonces. Drug dealers. Suppose I’m a racist then

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By *mateur100Man
over a year ago

nr faversham


"Isn't it internationa maritime law that people stranded at sea are picked up? As far as I can recall, there's no clauses that say "yeah but apart from those guys"

International maritime law states that the boats should meet a whole raft ( ) of standards which are conveniently ignored by the French I believe

Quote the standards oar do one."

All vessels with a 6 horse power + engine must have a licensed skipper, foghorn, lifejackets for all, a certain level of buoyancy, flares, torch, baler and compass...as I understand it

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By *asmeenTV/TS
over a year ago

STOKE ON TRENT


"You should all be upset and pissed we’re not controlling our boarders.you don’t have a clue who’s coming in what crimes they’ve vomited in other countries. Rapist. Nonces. Drug dealers. Suppose I’m a racist then"

Upset no

Sympathetic yes

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By *inkyInkedBiWoman
over a year ago

.


"You should all be upset and pissed we’re not controlling our boarders.you don’t have a clue who’s coming in what crimes they’ve vomited in other countries. Rapist. Nonces. Drug dealers. Suppose I’m a racist then"

Yeah because our country has none of them

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By *yron69Man
over a year ago

Fareham


"It’s not their fault for seeking a better life….

It’s our fault for not managing it properly. Australia/Canada/USA manage it successfully…. Why can’t we! "

…due to a wider sea I suspect?

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By *topthepressMan
over a year ago

MANCHESTER

No one mentions that the French take thousands of migrants also

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"You should all be upset and pissed we’re not controlling our boarders.you don’t have a clue who’s coming in what crimes they’ve vomited in other countries. Rapist. Nonces. Drug dealers. Suppose I’m a racist then"

We have never had ‘control ‘ of our borders, it’s naive to think we ever will

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"You should all be upset and pissed we’re not controlling our boarders.you don’t have a clue who’s coming in what crimes they’ve vomited in other countries. Rapist. Nonces. Drug dealers. Suppose I’m a racist then

We have never had ‘control ‘ of our borders, it’s naive to think we ever will "

Nonsense. We always did. Smugglers will smuggle, but if anyone truly believes the UK was powerless to remove foreign nationals, inc EU citizens, they're wrong and probably read lies spread by people who stand to gain from having no European Court of Human Rights, employment laws, etc.

Everybody does know that people without residential status can't claim benefits or use the NHS right? Schroedinger's immigrant; illegal but coming over here and getting benefits. Stealing our jobs and also coming over here and getting benefits.

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By *inkywife1981Couple
over a year ago

A town near you

Is it safe to say that if people are crossing to England in dinghys that they have come through much of Western Europe already.

So not exactly fleeing for their lives unless France is really that bad.

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By *EW4UMRSMan
over a year ago

close 2U


"You should all be upset and pissed we’re not controlling our boarders.you don’t have a clue who’s coming in what crimes they’ve vomited in other countries. Rapist. Nonces. Drug dealers. Suppose I’m a racist then

Yeah because our country has none of them "
so let’s not police boarders. Give free range to all. Last time I looked France was a safe country. They are coming for economic reasons.

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By *topthepressMan
over a year ago

MANCHESTER

Maybe it's because they speak good English easier for them to find work when they get here

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By *mateur100Man
over a year ago

nr faversham


"Is it safe to say that if people are crossing to England in dinghys that they have come through much of Western Europe already.

So not exactly fleeing for their lives unless France is really that bad. "

Exactly

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By *andsome HandMan
over a year ago

roundabout


"You should all be upset and pissed we’re not controlling our boarders.you don’t have a clue who’s coming in what crimes they’ve vomited in other countries. Rapist. Nonces. Drug dealers. Suppose I’m a racist then

We have never had ‘control ‘ of our borders, it’s naive to think we ever will

Nonsense. We always did. Smugglers will smuggle, but if anyone truly believes the UK was powerless to remove foreign nationals, inc EU citizens, they're wrong and probably read lies spread by people who stand to gain from having no European Court of Human Rights, employment laws, etc.

Everybody does know that people without residential status can't claim benefits or use the NHS right? Schroedinger's immigrant; illegal but coming over here and getting benefits. Stealing our jobs and also coming over here and getting benefits. "

Love that analogy

At any rate jobs can't be stolen, nobody has ever woke one morning to find their job pilfered. Generally I find that the people crying about job theft are claiming benefits.

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By *inkyInkedBiWoman
over a year ago

.

Just on Instagram and came across a Brian bilston poem.

PENGUINS

They were sighted off the Dover coast,

drifting in towards the port;

their boat, a snapped-off block of ice,

melting slowly in the warmth.

By the docks, a crowd had formed itself

and congealed into a mob.

Placards were thrust. A chant began.

GO BACK TO WHERE YOU’RE FROM!

‘Don’t fall for it – they’re not displaced,’

declared a spokesman for the right.

‘They’re only here to take our jobs.

It’s as clear as black and white.’

‘Tragic,’ said the Home Secretary,

as she tried to hide her smirk.

‘We’d let them stay but here’s the rub –

they lack the paperwork.’

‘They’ll undermine our way of life,’

said a warning post on Twitter.

‘They stink of fish.’ ‘They’ll r8pe your wife.’

‘They got bombs beneath their flippers.’

“BUT WE HAVE NO HOME CLAIMS PENGUIN”,

The Sun had printed in disgust.

‘And whose fault’s THAT - except THEIR OWN?

What’s that to do with US?’

The ice had now completely gone.

The penguins battled through the foam,

swimming, swimming, from land to land,

searching for a home.

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By *ebjonnson OP   Man
over a year ago

Maldon


"Those people will eventually pay the tax that will ensure you’re looked after in your old age."

Rubbish. I’ve paid plenty of my own tax.

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By *ervent_fervourMan
over a year ago

Halifax


"https://www.bbc.com/news/explainers-53734793

This makes for quite interesting reading

That link is great and led me to some actual figures that put a lot of this into perspective.

I was surprised to read that illegal crossings in 2019 were only 1% of all asylum requests and that the UK have far fewer asylum seekers than France and Germany.

Our news headlines paint a very different picture to this....

Always good to look past the headline, we take some but no where near what other European countries do. "

Yeah. It's almost like they're whipping up xenophobia to generate sales, and reaffirm that narrative in the minds of their readers in order to perpetuate those sales.

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By *yron69Man
over a year ago

Fareham


"Those people will eventually pay the tax that will ensure you’re looked after in your old age.

Rubbish. I’ve paid plenty of my own tax."

The new social care tax!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Those people will eventually pay the tax that will ensure you’re looked after in your old age.

Rubbish. I’ve paid plenty of my own tax."
that's not how tax works tho. What you have paid in has been spent. Someone needs to pay tax in the future to support us.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I cannot imagine how fucking desperate I would have to be, to put my children on a boat that has a massive chance of sinking, and of one or more of us dying.

They aren’t sailing in for fun.

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By *drianukMan
over a year ago

Spain, Lancs

There's nothing wrong with wanting proper border controls.

We've built a welfare state and made a country we can be proud of.

You can't have a welfare state AND open borders

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"There's nothing wrong with wanting proper border controls.

We've built a welfare state and made a country we can be proud of.

You can't have a welfare state AND open borders"

Why?

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By *izzy.miss.lizzyCouple
over a year ago

Pembrokeshire

Just heard on the radio that the government here will be turning boats back mid crossing in some situations.

There will be blood on their hands before long.

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By *EW4UMRSMan
over a year ago

close 2U


"This popped up on my Facebook memories today.

‘My parents voted to leave to ‘stop all these immigrants’ They have both subsequently died in the past 3 years. We watched, as each in turn were nursed to a dignified and comfortable death by nursing and care staff from the European Union. The irony twas not lost on us’ "
parents looked after by hard working people that went through proper procedures. Not smuggled over by criminals. Everyone gets exploited.

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By *drianukMan
over a year ago

Spain, Lancs


"There's nothing wrong with wanting proper border controls.

We've built a welfare state and made a country we can be proud of.

You can't have a welfare state AND open borders

Why?"

Because we have so many people paying in and so many people taking out. They should roughly balance. That is the social contract.

What would happen if millions of people arrive with open borders?

Who would pay benefits? Who would pay for extra school places? Extra hospital places? More road space? Housing?

A lot of virtue signalling going on but people aren't addressing the issues.

It's like your household, set up to run, presumably, with a rough balance between income, mouths to feed etc. What would happen if more people just turned up uninvited?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"There's nothing wrong with wanting proper border controls.

We've built a welfare state and made a country we can be proud of.

You can't have a welfare state AND open borders

Why?

Because we have so many people paying in and so many people taking out. They should roughly balance. That is the social contract.

What would happen if millions of people arrive with open borders?

Who would pay benefits? Who would pay for extra school places? Extra hospital places? More road space? Housing?

A lot of virtue signalling going on but people aren't addressing the issues.

It's like your household, set up to run, presumably, with a rough balance between income, mouths to feed etc. What would happen if more people just turned up uninvited?"
suspect you both may be debating what we mean by open borders. You'll need to agree that definition first!

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By *drianukMan
over a year ago

Spain, Lancs


"There's nothing wrong with wanting proper border controls.

We've built a welfare state and made a country we can be proud of.

You can't have a welfare state AND open borders

Why?

Because we have so many people paying in and so many people taking out. They should roughly balance. That is the social contract.

What would happen if millions of people arrive with open borders?

Who would pay benefits? Who would pay for extra school places? Extra hospital places? More road space? Housing?

A lot of virtue signalling going on but people aren't addressing the issues.

It's like your household, set up to run, presumably, with a rough balance between income, mouths to feed etc. What would happen if more people just turned up uninvited?suspect you both may be debating what we mean by open borders. You'll need to agree that definition first!"

Open borders means anyone who wants to come can do so

Unsustainable

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"This popped up on my Facebook memories today.

‘My parents voted to leave to ‘stop all these immigrants’ They have both subsequently died in the past 3 years. We watched, as each in turn were nursed to a dignified and comfortable death by nursing and care staff from the European Union. The irony twas not lost on us’ parents looked after by hard working people that went through proper procedures. Not smuggled over by criminals. Everyone gets exploited. "
there are two types of immigrants being discussed. Those coming over by boat may be legally coming over to seek asylum. If successful they will have gone thru the proper procedures.

Then there are those who will disappear into the underworld and, I agree, will likely be exploited.

We don't know which type thsoe on boats are. But they aren't illegal just because they are on a boat.

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By *amelhunterMan
over a year ago

newcastle


"Just saw the news clip of the RNLI boat bringing in another group of mainly young men , rescued from the channel.

It irritated me. Im also irritated by the decades long inability of the UK or French authorities to get to grips with this issue.

I like to think of myself as a caring , moderate, man of the world. Love and peace to all etc.

I’m also very irritated at my recent restrictions post Brexit to not spend as much time as I like anywhere in Europe. Just a bad morning perhaps?

There’s nothing wrong with wanting proper boarder control. "

yes, i love to have full control of lodgers!

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By *drianukMan
over a year ago

Spain, Lancs


"This popped up on my Facebook memories today.

‘My parents voted to leave to ‘stop all these immigrants’ They have both subsequently died in the past 3 years. We watched, as each in turn were nursed to a dignified and comfortable death by nursing and care staff from the European Union. The irony twas not lost on us’ parents looked after by hard working people that went through proper procedures. Not smuggled over by criminals. Everyone gets exploited. there are two types of immigrants being discussed. Those coming over by boat may be legally coming over to seek asylum. If successful they will have gone thru the proper procedures.

Then there are those who will disappear into the underworld and, I agree, will likely be exploited.

We don't know which type thsoe on boats are. But they aren't illegal just because they are on a boat. "

Very clearly most aren't fleeing oppression because they are coming from France.

Mainly economic immigration...and the country's labour markets, housing, schools, hospitals etc can't support that

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"There's nothing wrong with wanting proper border controls.

We've built a welfare state and made a country we can be proud of.

You can't have a welfare state AND open borders

Why?

Because we have so many people paying in and so many people taking out. They should roughly balance. That is the social contract.

What would happen if millions of people arrive with open borders?

Who would pay benefits? Who would pay for extra school places? Extra hospital places? More road space? Housing?

A lot of virtue signalling going on but people aren't addressing the issues.

It's like your household, set up to run, presumably, with a rough balance between income, mouths to feed etc. What would happen if more people just turned up uninvited?"

1. That isn't how national economies work. You don't "balance" books like a household budget.

2. Where are these millions coming from? Currently there are as many foreign born nationals living in the UK as there are british ex pats living abroad.

3. Stop calling anything vaguely socially democratic "virtue signalling". Are people who wear poppies and are vocal about doing so virtue signallers?

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By *drianukMan
over a year ago

Spain, Lancs


"There's nothing wrong with wanting proper border controls.

We've built a welfare state and made a country we can be proud of.

You can't have a welfare state AND open borders

Why?

Because we have so many people paying in and so many people taking out. They should roughly balance. That is the social contract.

What would happen if millions of people arrive with open borders?

Who would pay benefits? Who would pay for extra school places? Extra hospital places? More road space? Housing?

A lot of virtue signalling going on but people aren't addressing the issues.

It's like your household, set up to run, presumably, with a rough balance between income, mouths to feed etc. What would happen if more people just turned up uninvited?

1. That isn't how national economies work. You don't "balance" books like a household budget.

2. Where are these millions coming from? Currently there are as many foreign born nationals living in the UK as there are british ex pats living abroad.

3. Stop calling anything vaguely socially democratic "virtue signalling". Are people who wear poppies and are vocal about doing so virtue signallers? "

Not so. In the EU referendum the Remainers claimed there were as many UK ex-pats living abroad as there were vice-versa.

The UK and EU countries are now asking each others citizens to register there presence.

It has been found that 6m EU citizens were, after all, in the UK. There are 1.75m (it might be 2.75m...can't remember) UK citizens living elsewhere.

The effect on house prices, wages etc has been entirely predictable

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"There's nothing wrong with wanting proper border controls.

We've built a welfare state and made a country we can be proud of.

You can't have a welfare state AND open borders

Why?

Because we have so many people paying in and so many people taking out. They should roughly balance. That is the social contract.

What would happen if millions of people arrive with open borders?

Who would pay benefits? Who would pay for extra school places? Extra hospital places? More road space? Housing?

A lot of virtue signalling going on but people aren't addressing the issues.

It's like your household, set up to run, presumably, with a rough balance between income, mouths to feed etc. What would happen if more people just turned up uninvited?

1. That isn't how national economies work. You don't "balance" books like a household budget.

2. Where are these millions coming from? Currently there are as many foreign born nationals living in the UK as there are british ex pats living abroad.

3. Stop calling anything vaguely socially democratic "virtue signalling". Are people who wear poppies and are vocal about doing so virtue signallers?

Not so. In the EU referendum the Remainers claimed there were as many UK ex-pats living abroad as there were vice-versa.

The UK and EU countries are now asking each others citizens to register there presence.

It has been found that 6m EU citizens were, after all, in the UK. There are 1.75m (it might be 2.75m...can't remember) UK citizens living elsewhere.

The effect on house prices, wages etc has been entirely predictable"

You think every 12th person living in the UK was a foreign born EU national? I highly doubt that.

What about points 1 and 3?

Also 4:

The entire premise of the argument seems to be based around foreign people being a drain on national resources. From an employers perspective I have only ever seen hard workers. Actual, reliable, dependable and solid. Not afraid of a hard days graft. I'm gutted I lost my Poles and Slovaks. They were highly skilled and worked a darn sight harder than the locals.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

There are a lot of interesting views on this. Like others, I’m puzzled as to why the people fleeing persecution from their home country, choose to pass through several other safe countries to get to the UK. Surely you’d be grateful at the first safe place you come to that you’re no longer looking over your shoulder scared for your life..

Not to then carry on in an unsafe overloaded dinghy or through the channel tunnel just to reach our shores…

Just screams out benefit claimants to me…

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By *ora the explorerWoman
over a year ago

Paradise, Herts

interesting read

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By *inkywife1981Couple
over a year ago

A town near you


"You should all be upset and pissed we’re not controlling our boarders.you don’t have a clue who’s coming in what crimes they’ve vomited in other countries. Rapist. Nonces. Drug dealers. Suppose I’m a racist then"

All countries unfortunately have enough home grown bad apples so the last thing any one wants is more bad apples hence proper checks should be taken to see who is coming in and out of a country.

But if boat people tear up their passports and don't have ID how does anyone know they ain't ISIS or criminals of some kind.

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By *ad NannaWoman
over a year ago

East London


"There's nothing wrong with wanting proper border controls.

We've built a welfare state and made a country we can be proud of.

You can't have a welfare state AND open borders

Why?

Because we have so many people paying in and so many people taking out. They should roughly balance. That is the social contract.

What would happen if millions of people arrive with open borders?

Who would pay benefits? Who would pay for extra school places? Extra hospital places? More road space? Housing?

A lot of virtue signalling going on but people aren't addressing the issues.

It's like your household, set up to run, presumably, with a rough balance between income, mouths to feed etc. What would happen if more people just turned up uninvited?

1. That isn't how national economies work. You don't "balance" books like a household budget.

2. Where are these millions coming from? Currently there are as many foreign born nationals living in the UK as there are british ex pats living abroad.

3. Stop calling anything vaguely socially democratic "virtue signalling". Are people who wear poppies and are vocal about doing so virtue signallers?

Not so. In the EU referendum the Remainers claimed there were as many UK ex-pats living abroad as there were vice-versa.

The UK and EU countries are now asking each others citizens to register there presence.

It has been found that 6m EU citizens were, after all, in the UK. There are 1.75m (it might be 2.75m...can't remember) UK citizens living elsewhere.

The effect on house prices, wages etc has been entirely predictable

You think every 12th person living in the UK was a foreign born EU national? I highly doubt that.

What about points 1 and 3?

Also 4:

The entire premise of the argument seems to be based around foreign people being a drain on national resources. From an employers perspective I have only ever seen hard workers. Actual, reliable, dependable and solid. Not afraid of a hard days graft. I'm gutted I lost my Poles and Slovaks. They were highly skilled and worked a darn sight harder than the locals. "

May I ask if you were paying them the going rate or more for the work they did?

In my experience foreign born/immigrant workers from Poland, Bulgaria etc were, and possibly are,being paid much less than their counterparts.

That meant they had to work their bollocks off to earn enough to pay their extortionate rent, live and send money home.

I know of one company who only employed Eastern Europeans as they worked for much less money.

My family's business gained a lot of contacts putting right the shoddy work they sometimes did too, from rushing or being poorly skilled.

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By *icecouple561Couple
Forum Mod
over a year ago

East Sussex


"There are a lot of interesting views on this. Like others, I’m puzzled as to why the people fleeing persecution from their home country, choose to pass through several other safe countries to get to the UK. Surely you’d be grateful at the first safe place you come to that you’re no longer looking over your shoulder scared for your life..

Not to then carry on in an unsafe overloaded dinghy or through the channel tunnel just to reach our shores…

Just screams out benefit claimants to me… "

Many of them do stay in Europe. The number of refugees who attempt the channel crossing are a fraction of the people seeking asylum outside their own country

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"i can understand people fleeing unsafe countries but cant understand them risking their life crossing from france a safe western country to get here what is it about here they need to risk death to cross from a already safe country they are in??? partic when we are so bad and racist and backward compared to rest of europe apparently

"

Often it’s because these particular people have family in the UK already and are seeking to join them, which seems a legitimate enough reason.

Another may be that they can speak English so feel that the UK might be a sensible place to try to start again.

Perhaps it’s also literally as far away from the hell they’ve escaped as they can legitimately get.

It’s worth noting that it’s only a very small percentage of overall refugees who seek to make the journey all the way to the UK, despite the contrary view reported in much of the UK press. Much of mainland Europe houses far more refugees than Britain, including France itself, Germany and others.

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By *drianukMan
over a year ago

Spain, Lancs


"There's nothing wrong with wanting proper border controls.

We've built a welfare state and made a country we can be proud of.

You can't have a welfare state AND open borders

Why?

Because we have so many people paying in and so many people taking out. They should roughly balance. That is the social contract.

What would happen if millions of people arrive with open borders?

Who would pay benefits? Who would pay for extra school places? Extra hospital places? More road space? Housing?

A lot of virtue signalling going on but people aren't addressing the issues.

It's like your household, set up to run, presumably, with a rough balance between income, mouths to feed etc. What would happen if more people just turned up uninvited?

1. That isn't how national economies work. You don't "balance" books like a household budget.

2. Where are these millions coming from? Currently there are as many foreign born nationals living in the UK as there are british ex pats living abroad.

3. Stop calling anything vaguely socially democratic "virtue signalling". Are people who wear poppies and are vocal about doing so virtue signallers?

Not so. In the EU referendum the Remainers claimed there were as many UK ex-pats living abroad as there were vice-versa.

The UK and EU countries are now asking each others citizens to register there presence.

It has been found that 6m EU citizens were, after all, in the UK. There are 1.75m (it might be 2.75m...can't remember) UK citizens living elsewhere.

The effect on house prices, wages etc has been entirely predictable

You think every 12th person living in the UK was a foreign born EU national? I highly doubt that.

What about points 1 and 3?

Also 4:

The entire premise of the argument seems to be based around foreign people being a drain on national resources. From an employers perspective I have only ever seen hard workers. Actual, reliable, dependable and solid. Not afraid of a hard days graft. I'm gutted I lost my Poles and Slovaks. They were highly skilled and worked a darn sight harder than the locals. "

Points 1 and 3 ..I simply haven't got all day but... you're wrong

Yes, employers like open borders.

It's supply and demand. If the supply of labour increases then it's price ..wages. .will fall.

We're seeing that deliberate employer-backed over-supply unwind now in the transport and leisure industries

Working people know these truths and have, over the decades, built up reasonable wages and living standards.

Uncontrolled immigration adversely affects wages, house prices, schools, hospitals etc.

It is not racist to say that

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"There's nothing wrong with wanting proper border controls.

We've built a welfare state and made a country we can be proud of.

You can't have a welfare state AND open borders

Why?

Because we have so many people paying in and so many people taking out. They should roughly balance. That is the social contract.

What would happen if millions of people arrive with open borders?

Who would pay benefits? Who would pay for extra school places? Extra hospital places? More road space? Housing?

A lot of virtue signalling going on but people aren't addressing the issues.

It's like your household, set up to run, presumably, with a rough balance between income, mouths to feed etc. What would happen if more people just turned up uninvited?

1. That isn't how national economies work. You don't "balance" books like a household budget.

2. Where are these millions coming from? Currently there are as many foreign born nationals living in the UK as there are british ex pats living abroad.

3. Stop calling anything vaguely socially democratic "virtue signalling". Are people who wear poppies and are vocal about doing so virtue signallers?

Not so. In the EU referendum the Remainers claimed there were as many UK ex-pats living abroad as there were vice-versa.

The UK and EU countries are now asking each others citizens to register there presence.

It has been found that 6m EU citizens were, after all, in the UK. There are 1.75m (it might be 2.75m...can't remember) UK citizens living elsewhere.

The effect on house prices, wages etc has been entirely predictable

You think every 12th person living in the UK was a foreign born EU national? I highly doubt that.

What about points 1 and 3?

Also 4:

The entire premise of the argument seems to be based around foreign people being a drain on national resources. From an employers perspective I have only ever seen hard workers. Actual, reliable, dependable and solid. Not afraid of a hard days graft. I'm gutted I lost my Poles and Slovaks. They were highly skilled and worked a darn sight harder than the locals.

Points 1 and 3 ..I simply haven't got all day but... you're wrong

Yes, employers like open borders.

It's supply and demand. If the supply of labour increases then it's price ..wages. .will fall.

We're seeing that deliberate employer-backed over-supply unwind now in the transport and leisure industries

Working people know these truths and have, over the decades, built up reasonable wages and living standards.

Uncontrolled immigration adversely affects wages, house prices, schools, hospitals etc.

It is not racist to say that"

I didn't call you racist buddy. Healthy debate I thought. Not mudslinging.

The idea that immigration was uncontrolled is a myth. Sorry. Even EU nationals could be booted out within 12 weeks had they not found gainful employment. Even with free movement within the EU. Which I, inconveniently, don t have anymore.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ervent_fervourMan
over a year ago

Halifax


"Those people will eventually pay the tax that will ensure you’re looked after in your old age.

Rubbish. I’ve paid plenty of my own tax."

Yeah. But. We need more. Otherwise you ain't gonna be seen for an operation for months.

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By *annaBeStrongMan
over a year ago

wokingham


"There's nothing wrong with wanting proper border controls.

We've built a welfare state and made a country we can be proud of.

You can't have a welfare state AND open borders

Why?

Because we have so many people paying in and so many people taking out. They should roughly balance. That is the social contract.

What would happen if millions of people arrive with open borders?

Who would pay benefits? Who would pay for extra school places? Extra hospital places? More road space? Housing?

A lot of virtue signalling going on but people aren't addressing the issues.

It's like your household, set up to run, presumably, with a rough balance between income, mouths to feed etc. What would happen if more people just turned up uninvited?

1. That isn't how national economies work. You don't "balance" books like a household budget.

2. Where are these millions coming from? Currently there are as many foreign born nationals living in the UK as there are british ex pats living abroad.

3. Stop calling anything vaguely socially democratic "virtue signalling". Are people who wear poppies and are vocal about doing so virtue signallers?

Not so. In the EU referendum the Remainers claimed there were as many UK ex-pats living abroad as there were vice-versa.

The UK and EU countries are now asking each others citizens to register there presence.

It has been found that 6m EU citizens were, after all, in the UK. There are 1.75m (it might be 2.75m...can't remember) UK citizens living elsewhere.

The effect on house prices, wages etc has been entirely predictable

You think every 12th person living in the UK was a foreign born EU national? I highly doubt that.

What about points 1 and 3?

Also 4:

The entire premise of the argument seems to be based around foreign people being a drain on national resources. From an employers perspective I have only ever seen hard workers. Actual, reliable, dependable and solid. Not afraid of a hard days graft. I'm gutted I lost my Poles and Slovaks. They were highly skilled and worked a darn sight harder than the locals.

Points 1 and 3 ..I simply haven't got all day but... you're wrong

Yes, employers like open borders.

It's supply and demand. If the supply of labour increases then it's price ..wages. .will fall.

We're seeing that deliberate employer-backed over-supply unwind now in the transport and leisure industries

Working people know these truths and have, over the decades, built up reasonable wages and living standards.

Uncontrolled immigration adversely affects wages, house prices, schools, hospitals etc.

It is not racist to say that"

It’s no surprise that big corporations are always in favour of less control on immigration

Of course people like Jeff bezo wants uncontrolled immigration

He wants foreigners that will price you out of the job. He wants people that will work for nothing with no benefits because they know no better

He basically wants to export 3rd work labour into the 1st world but not give them any benefits that exist on the 1st world.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I don't know for sure why they are risking their life to get here. Bit given they are, my first reaction is they have a fucking good reason. Who here would risk their life just to get benefits?

I genuinely can't imagine what they must be feeling to get in a dinghy to face that stretch of water. Maybe if we spent a few moments to ponder we would have a different view. "

Exactly and contrary to popular belief they don't get benefits and many want to work.

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By *ervent_fervourMan
over a year ago

Halifax


"You should all be upset and pissed we’re not controlling our boarders.you don’t have a clue who’s coming in what crimes they’ve vomited in other countries. Rapist. Nonces. Drug dealers. Suppose I’m a racist then

All countries unfortunately have enough home grown bad apples so the last thing any one wants is more bad apples hence proper checks should be taken to see who is coming in and out of a country.

But if boat people tear up their passports and don't have ID how does anyone know they ain't ISIS or criminals of some kind.

"

I think that's a specious argument. Plus, let's face it, continually going to war to 'help' America, or supposedly help downtrodden countries, or to attack (ha, the irony) terrorists may be fuelling(I understate) some extremist's need to take vengeance after being manipulated to think so via their own political/religious leaders/groups.

I think we need Ed to look closer to home first and identify thee source. Without an action there's no reaction.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"There's nothing wrong with wanting proper border controls.

We've built a welfare state and made a country we can be proud of.

You can't have a welfare state AND open borders

Why?

Because we have so many people paying in and so many people taking out. They should roughly balance. That is the social contract.

What would happen if millions of people arrive with open borders?

Who would pay benefits? Who would pay for extra school places? Extra hospital places? More road space? Housing?

A lot of virtue signalling going on but people aren't addressing the issues.

It's like your household, set up to run, presumably, with a rough balance between income, mouths to feed etc. What would happen if more people just turned up uninvited?

1. That isn't how national economies work. You don't "balance" books like a household budget.

2. Where are these millions coming from? Currently there are as many foreign born nationals living in the UK as there are british ex pats living abroad.

3. Stop calling anything vaguely socially democratic "virtue signalling". Are people who wear poppies and are vocal about doing so virtue signallers?

Not so. In the EU referendum the Remainers claimed there were as many UK ex-pats living abroad as there were vice-versa.

The UK and EU countries are now asking each others citizens to register there presence.

It has been found that 6m EU citizens were, after all, in the UK. There are 1.75m (it might be 2.75m...can't remember) UK citizens living elsewhere.

The effect on house prices, wages etc has been entirely predictable

You think every 12th person living in the UK was a foreign born EU national? I highly doubt that.

What about points 1 and 3?

Also 4:

The entire premise of the argument seems to be based around foreign people being a drain on national resources. From an employers perspective I have only ever seen hard workers. Actual, reliable, dependable and solid. Not afraid of a hard days graft. I'm gutted I lost my Poles and Slovaks. They were highly skilled and worked a darn sight harder than the locals.

Points 1 and 3 ..I simply haven't got all day but... you're wrong

Yes, employers like open borders.

It's supply and demand. If the supply of labour increases then it's price ..wages. .will fall.

We're seeing that deliberate employer-backed over-supply unwind now in the transport and leisure industries

Working people know these truths and have, over the decades, built up reasonable wages and living standards.

Uncontrolled immigration adversely affects wages, house prices, schools, hospitals etc.

It is not racist to say that

It’s no surprise that big corporations are always in favour of less control on immigration

Of course people like Jeff bezo wants uncontrolled immigration

He wants foreigners that will price you out of the job. He wants people that will work for nothing with no benefits because they know no better

He basically wants to export 3rd work labour into the 1st world but not give them any benefits that exist on the 1st world. "

I'm talking about small businesses that pay all their taxes and pay decent wages, but yes you make a valid point.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"i can understand people fleeing unsafe countries but cant understand them risking their life crossing from france a safe western country to get here what is it about here they need to risk death to cross from a already safe country they are in??? partic when we are so bad and racist and backward compared to rest of europe apparently

It’s probably totally unrelated to the fact that they saw our soldiers in their home country for years and so they think we’re trustworthy.

the french were there too? "

The majority the the trying to get here cannot do so through legal means but usually have family members or friends here the only way to claim asylum is to get to this country or stay in a refuge camp for years on end.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"i can understand people fleeing unsafe countries but cant understand them risking their life crossing from france a safe western country to get here what is it about here they need to risk death to cross from a already safe country they are in??? partic when we are so bad and racist and backward compared to rest of europe apparently

This is what I don't understand

What is the rest of Europe doing to help? Went are they so intent on risking their lives to get here? What's wrong with Germany, France, Spain... Or do those countries have help in place for these people?"

You are aware the countries you have just listed have taken in triple the amount of asylum seekers and refugees than we have a right?

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By *ervent_fervourMan
over a year ago

Halifax


"There's nothing wrong with wanting proper border controls.

We've built a welfare state and made a country we can be proud of.

You can't have a welfare state AND open borders

Why?

Because we have so many people paying in and so many people taking out. They should roughly balance. That is the social contract.

What would happen if millions of people arrive with open borders?

Who would pay benefits? Who would pay for extra school places? Extra hospital places? More road space? Housing?

A lot of virtue signalling going on but people aren't addressing the issues.

It's like your household, set up to run, presumably, with a rough balance between income, mouths to feed etc. What would happen if more people just turned up uninvited?

1. That isn't how national economies work. You don't "balance" books like a household budget.

2. Where are these millions coming from? Currently there are as many foreign born nationals living in the UK as there are british ex pats living abroad.

3. Stop calling anything vaguely socially democratic "virtue signalling". Are people who wear poppies and are vocal about doing so virtue signallers?

Not so. In the EU referendum the Remainers claimed there were as many UK ex-pats living abroad as there were vice-versa.

The UK and EU countries are now asking each others citizens to register there presence.

It has been found that 6m EU citizens were, after all, in the UK. There are 1.75m (it might be 2.75m...can't remember) UK citizens living elsewhere.

The effect on house prices, wages etc has been entirely predictable

You think every 12th person living in the UK was a foreign born EU national? I highly doubt that.

What about points 1 and 3?

Also 4:

The entire premise of the argument seems to be based around foreign people being a drain on national resources. From an employers perspective I have only ever seen hard workers. Actual, reliable, dependable and solid. Not afraid of a hard days graft. I'm gutted I lost my Poles and Slovaks. They were highly skilled and worked a darn sight harder than the locals.

Points 1 and 3 ..I simply haven't got all day but... you're wrong

Yes, employers like open borders.

It's supply and demand. If the supply of labour increases then it's price ..wages. .will fall.

We're seeing that deliberate employer-backed over-supply unwind now in the transport and leisure industries

Working people know these truths and have, over the decades, built up reasonable wages and living standards.

Uncontrolled immigration adversely affects wages, house prices, schools, hospitals etc.

It is not racist to say that"

There should be more than enough money in the pot. Just needs fairer taxation. Plus fairer redistribution to the councils who most need it. Unfortunately they're mostly Tory led. Which is funny. It's almost like there's aa conspiracy with deliberate underfunding in order to gain votes and stoke dogwhistle racism.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Is it safe to say that if people are crossing to England in dinghys that they have come through much of Western Europe already.

So not exactly fleeing for their lives unless France is really that bad. "

So let's not take any responsibility then and leave it for others to deal with?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

This thread has made me realise there’s a bunch of low intellectual. Some of the points I’ve read here are gob smackingly stupid. I won’t say much on it but just look at there perspective, not from a privileged perspective…

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By *otMe66Man
over a year ago

Terra Firma


"Just saw the news clip of the RNLI boat bringing in another group of mainly young men , rescued from the channel.

It irritated me. Im also irritated by the decades long inability of the UK or French authorities to get to grips with this issue.

I like to think of myself as a caring , moderate, man of the world. Love and peace to all etc.

I’m also very irritated at my recent restrictions post Brexit to not spend as much time as I like anywhere in Europe. Just a bad morning perhaps? "

I think you show potential

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By *ilburnladMan
over a year ago

Hatton


"You're irritated both by your inability to go anywhere you please and other people's attempts to do the same?"

Ones legal the other isn't

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"There's nothing wrong with wanting proper border controls.

We've built a welfare state and made a country we can be proud of.

You can't have a welfare state AND open borders

Why?

Because we have so many people paying in and so many people taking out. They should roughly balance. That is the social contract.

What would happen if millions of people arrive with open borders?

Who would pay benefits? Who would pay for extra school places? Extra hospital places? More road space? Housing?

A lot of virtue signalling going on but people aren't addressing the issues.

It's like your household, set up to run, presumably, with a rough balance between income, mouths to feed etc. What would happen if more people just turned up uninvited?

1. That isn't how national economies work. You don't "balance" books like a household budget.

2. Where are these millions coming from? Currently there are as many foreign born nationals living in the UK as there are british ex pats living abroad.

3. Stop calling anything vaguely socially democratic "virtue signalling". Are people who wear poppies and are vocal about doing so virtue signallers?

Not so. In the EU referendum the Remainers claimed there were as many UK ex-pats living abroad as there were vice-versa.

The UK and EU countries are now asking each others citizens to register there presence.

It has been found that 6m EU citizens were, after all, in the UK. There are 1.75m (it might be 2.75m...can't remember) UK citizens living elsewhere.

The effect on house prices, wages etc has been entirely predictable"

6.2m ppl living in teh UK have a nationality of a different country od which 3.7m are EU. (the 6m EU you use include those who are no longer in the UK)

Source: house of commons 2021

Brits abroad less easy to find. 5-6m looks to be the number.

Source : BBC and others.

Brits seek to look to the commonwealth rather than EU when going abroad. Oz being top.

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By *EW4UMRSMan
over a year ago

close 2U

Exactly made point. 100% correct

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"You're irritated both by your inability to go anywhere you please and other people's attempts to do the same?

Ones legal the other isn't "

Actually I think you will find it is completely legal as long as they declare themselves as asylum seekers or refugees the minutes they reach our shores.

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By *ilburnladMan
over a year ago

Hatton


"You're irritated both by your inability to go anywhere you please and other people's attempts to do the same?

Ones legal the other isn't

Actually I think you will find it is completely legal as long as they declare themselves as asylum seekers or refugees the minutes they reach our shores."

In the first safe country they landed in? Which would not have been the UK.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Just saw the news clip of the RNLI boat bringing in another group of mainly young men , rescued from the channel.

It irritated me. Im also irritated by the decades long inability of the UK or French authorities to get to grips with this issue.

I like to think of myself as a caring , moderate, man of the world. Love and peace to all etc.

I’m also very irritated at my recent restrictions post Brexit to not spend as much time as I like anywhere in Europe. Just a bad morning perhaps? "

Get to grips with what?

If human beings are so desperate that they should want to even consider throwing themselves into the water with nothing but a flimsily-built rowing Boat between then and the peril of the deep blue sea, what on earth do you expect the British or french authorities to do ? Shoot them on sight?

You’re surely not suggesting we try and sort out the human rights issues and domestic policies of other countries, so that their people no longer have a desire to flee at all, do you?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"You're irritated both by your inability to go anywhere you please and other people's attempts to do the same?

Ones legal the other isn't

Actually I think you will find it is completely legal as long as they declare themselves as asylum seekers or refugees the minutes they reach our shores.

In the first safe country they landed in? Which would not have been the UK. "

Not actually the law just best practice. Look it up.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Ahhh the usual “shouldn’t take care of other countries problems” didn’t America help the UK when… ohh right, that point only matters when it’s a minority at stake humanity really is going downhill

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By *andyfloss2000Woman
over a year ago

ashford


"On one hand I understand your frustration OP. I too am extremely upset that a privilege I was born with has just been stripped away from me without my control. However to retain your compassion just give a thought to the glaring difference between floating here on a dingy and freely moving the continent.

Most of these people are running from hell. They are not risking their lives for a house in a country that hates them just to spite us. If we don't want to see foreigners being rescued from our shoreline then we need to address the reasons why they make these perilous journeys in the first place. Our wars abroad, our foreign policy and economic plans for the rest of the world are destroying their homes so they come here. We are all victims of the abuses thrust upon this world by greed, fear and hate but trust me, we have more in common with those poor than we do our wealthy. "

Totally agree! We are so privileged to be born here! these poor souls have come from hell! X

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By *drianukMan
over a year ago

Spain, Lancs


"There's nothing wrong with wanting proper border controls.

We've built a welfare state and made a country we can be proud of.

You can't have a welfare state AND open borders

Why?

Because we have so many people paying in and so many people taking out. They should roughly balance. That is the social contract.

What would happen if millions of people arrive with open borders?

Who would pay benefits? Who would pay for extra school places? Extra hospital places? More road space? Housing?

A lot of virtue signalling going on but people aren't addressing the issues.

It's like your household, set up to run, presumably, with a rough balance between income, mouths to feed etc. What would happen if more people just turned up uninvited?

1. That isn't how national economies work. You don't "balance" books like a household budget.

2. Where are these millions coming from? Currently there are as many foreign born nationals living in the UK as there are british ex pats living abroad.

3. Stop calling anything vaguely socially democratic "virtue signalling". Are people who wear poppies and are vocal about doing so virtue signallers?

Not so. In the EU referendum the Remainers claimed there were as many UK ex-pats living abroad as there were vice-versa.

The UK and EU countries are now asking each others citizens to register there presence.

It has been found that 6m EU citizens were, after all, in the UK. There are 1.75m (it might be 2.75m...can't remember) UK citizens living elsewhere.

The effect on house prices, wages etc has been entirely predictable

You think every 12th person living in the UK was a foreign born EU national? I highly doubt that.

What about points 1 and 3?

Also 4:

The entire premise of the argument seems to be based around foreign people being a drain on national resources. From an employers perspective I have only ever seen hard workers. Actual, reliable, dependable and solid. Not afraid of a hard days graft. I'm gutted I lost my Poles and Slovaks. They were highly skilled and worked a darn sight harder than the locals.

Points 1 and 3 ..I simply haven't got all day but... you're wrong

Yes, employers like open borders.

It's supply and demand. If the supply of labour increases then it's price ..wages. .will fall.

We're seeing that deliberate employer-backed over-supply unwind now in the transport and leisure industries

Working people know these truths and have, over the decades, built up reasonable wages and living standards.

Uncontrolled immigration adversely affects wages, house prices, schools, hospitals etc.

It is not racist to say that

I didn't call you racist buddy. Healthy debate I thought. Not mudslinging.

The idea that immigration was uncontrolled is a myth. Sorry. Even EU nationals could be booted out within 12 weeks had they not found gainful employment. Even with free movement within the EU. Which I, inconveniently, don t have anymore. "

I didn't say you had called me racist. I was answering the OP's point, matey

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"On one hand I understand your frustration OP. I too am extremely upset that a privilege I was born with has just been stripped away from me without my control. However to retain your compassion just give a thought to the glaring difference between floating here on a dingy and freely moving the continent.

Most of these people are running from hell. They are not risking their lives for a house in a country that hates them just to spite us. If we don't want to see foreigners being rescued from our shoreline then we need to address the reasons why they make these perilous journeys in the first place. Our wars abroad, our foreign policy and economic plans for the rest of the world are destroying their homes so they come here. We are all victims of the abuses thrust upon this world by greed, fear and hate but trust me, we have more in common with those poor than we do our wealthy.

Totally agree! We are so privileged to be born here! these poor souls have come from hell! X"

You’ve never been to Redditch , have you?

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By *andyfloss2000Woman
over a year ago

ashford


"On one hand I understand your frustration OP. I too am extremely upset that a privilege I was born with has just been stripped away from me without my control. However to retain your compassion just give a thought to the glaring difference between floating here on a dingy and freely moving the continent.

Most of these people are running from hell. They are not risking their lives for a house in a country that hates them just to spite us. If we don't want to see foreigners being rescued from our shoreline then we need to address the reasons why they make these perilous journeys in the first place. Our wars abroad, our foreign policy and economic plans for the rest of the world are destroying their homes so they come here. We are all victims of the abuses thrust upon this world by greed, fear and hate but trust me, we have more in common with those poor than we do our wealthy.

Totally agree! We are so privileged to be born here! these poor souls have come from hell! X

You’ve never been to Redditch , have you? "

Your point????x

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *drianukMan
over a year ago

Spain, Lancs


"There's nothing wrong with wanting proper border controls.

We've built a welfare state and made a country we can be proud of.

You can't have a welfare state AND open borders

Why?

Because we have so many people paying in and so many people taking out. They should roughly balance. That is the social contract.

What would happen if millions of people arrive with open borders?

Who would pay benefits? Who would pay for extra school places? Extra hospital places? More road space? Housing?

A lot of virtue signalling going on but people aren't addressing the issues.

It's like your household, set up to run, presumably, with a rough balance between income, mouths to feed etc. What would happen if more people just turned up uninvited?

1. That isn't how national economies work. You don't "balance" books like a household budget.

2. Where are these millions coming from? Currently there are as many foreign born nationals living in the UK as there are british ex pats living abroad.

3. Stop calling anything vaguely socially democratic "virtue signalling". Are people who wear poppies and are vocal about doing so virtue signallers?

Not so. In the EU referendum the Remainers claimed there were as many UK ex-pats living abroad as there were vice-versa.

The UK and EU countries are now asking each others citizens to register there presence.

It has been found that 6m EU citizens were, after all, in the UK. There are 1.75m (it might be 2.75m...can't remember) UK citizens living elsewhere.

The effect on house prices, wages etc has been entirely predictable

You think every 12th person living in the UK was a foreign born EU national? I highly doubt that.

What about points 1 and 3?

Also 4:

The entire premise of the argument seems to be based around foreign people being a drain on national resources. From an employers perspective I have only ever seen hard workers. Actual, reliable, dependable and solid. Not afraid of a hard days graft. I'm gutted I lost my Poles and Slovaks. They were highly skilled and worked a darn sight harder than the locals.

Points 1 and 3 ..I simply haven't got all day but... you're wrong

Yes, employers like open borders.

It's supply and demand. If the supply of labour increases then it's price ..wages. .will fall.

We're seeing that deliberate employer-backed over-supply unwind now in the transport and leisure industries

Working people know these truths and have, over the decades, built up reasonable wages and living standards.

Uncontrolled immigration adversely affects wages, house prices, schools, hospitals etc.

It is not racist to say that

There should be more than enough money in the pot. Just needs fairer taxation. Plus fairer redistribution to the councils who most need it. Unfortunately they're mostly Tory led. Which is funny. It's almost like there's aa conspiracy with deliberate underfunding in order to gain votes and stoke dogwhistle racism."

In what way is it 'dogwhistlr racism' to oppose open borders?

Do you support downward pressure on wages, upward pressure on house prices, schools, hospitals etc?

In what way is it 'racist' to point that out?

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"On one hand I understand your frustration OP. I too am extremely upset that a privilege I was born with has just been stripped away from me without my control. However to retain your compassion just give a thought to the glaring difference between floating here on a dingy and freely moving the continent.

Most of these people are running from hell. They are not risking their lives for a house in a country that hates them just to spite us. If we don't want to see foreigners being rescued from our shoreline then we need to address the reasons why they make these perilous journeys in the first place. Our wars abroad, our foreign policy and economic plans for the rest of the world are destroying their homes so they come here. We are all victims of the abuses thrust upon this world by greed, fear and hate but trust me, we have more in common with those poor than we do our wealthy.

Totally agree! We are so privileged to be born here! these poor souls have come from hell! X

You’ve never been to Redditch , have you?

Your point????x"

I think you will find its a joke!

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *andyfloss2000Woman
over a year ago

ashford


"On one hand I understand your frustration OP. I too am extremely upset that a privilege I was born with has just been stripped away from me without my control. However to retain your compassion just give a thought to the glaring difference between floating here on a dingy and freely moving the continent.

Most of these people are running from hell. They are not risking their lives for a house in a country that hates them just to spite us. If we don't want to see foreigners being rescued from our shoreline then we need to address the reasons why they make these perilous journeys in the first place. Our wars abroad, our foreign policy and economic plans for the rest of the world are destroying their homes so they come here. We are all victims of the abuses thrust upon this world by greed, fear and hate but trust me, we have more in common with those poor than we do our wealthy.

Totally agree! We are so privileged to be born here! these poor souls have come from hell! X

You’ve never been to Redditch , have you?

Your point????x

I think you will find its a joke!"

Ha bloody ha!!!x

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Isn't it internationa maritime law that people stranded at sea are picked up? As far as I can recall, there's no clauses that say "yeah but apart from those guys"

International maritime law states that the boats should meet a whole raft ( ) of standards which are conveniently ignored by the French I believe

Quote the standards oar do one.

All vessels with a 6 horse power + engine must have a licensed skipper, foghorn, lifejackets for all, a certain level of buoyancy, flares, torch, baler and compass...as I understand it"

That looks great apart from it having zero relevance to this discussion, also you need to provide an actual link.

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By *ebjonnson OP   Man
over a year ago

Maldon


"On one hand I understand your frustration OP. I too am extremely upset that a privilege I was born with has just been stripped away from me without my control. However to retain your compassion just give a thought to the glaring difference between floating here on a dingy and freely moving the continent.

Most of these people are running from hell. They are not risking their lives for a house in a country that hates them just to spite us. If we don't want to see foreigners being rescued from our shoreline then we need to address the reasons why they make these perilous journeys in the first place. Our wars abroad, our foreign policy and economic plans for the rest of the world are destroying their homes so they come here. We are all victims of the abuses thrust upon this world by greed, fear and hate but trust me, we have more in common with those poor than we do our wealthy.

Totally agree! We are so privileged to be born here! these poor souls have come from hell! X"

It’s that hellish that they leave the old, the females, the young, behind. In most cases.

I’m not uncaring and I do accept the basic human need to seek a better life. This has been going on for thirty years or so now. Look at Calais and the security around the motorway and of course the tunnel. I’m sure that if those that arrive were housed in Hampstead, Cheyenne Walk, Guildford, Gerrards Cross, Mill Hill etc, it would have stopped decades back.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

i have no problems with those coming as long as processed properly so we dont end up with the rotten ones ie really bad criminals ... we are a rich enought nation to take these people in but it is a bizzar picture when its all young men ?? where are all the women and children ???? surely they should be priority

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"i have no problems with those coming as long as processed properly so we dont end up with the rotten ones ie really bad criminals ... we are a rich enought nation to take these people in but it is a bizzar picture when its all young men ?? where are all the women and children ???? surely they should be priority "

Sorry but how should children and women be a priority to risk their lives on an unsafe and overcrowded inflatable boat?

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By *andyfloss2000Woman
over a year ago

ashford


"On one hand I understand your frustration OP. I too am extremely upset that a privilege I was born with has just been stripped away from me without my control. However to retain your compassion just give a thought to the glaring difference between floating here on a dingy and freely moving the continent.

Most of these people are running from hell. They are not risking their lives for a house in a country that hates them just to spite us. If we don't want to see foreigners being rescued from our shoreline then we need to address the reasons why they make these perilous journeys in the first place. Our wars abroad, our foreign policy and economic plans for the rest of the world are destroying their homes so they come here. We are all victims of the abuses thrust upon this world by greed, fear and hate but trust me, we have more in common with those poor than we do our wealthy.

Totally agree! We are so privileged to be born here! these poor souls have come from hell! X

It’s that hellish that they leave the old, the females, the young, behind. In most cases.

I’m not uncaring and I do accept the basic human need to seek a better life. This has been going on for thirty years or so now. Look at Calais and the security around the motorway and of course the tunnel. I’m sure that if those that arrive were housed in Hampstead, Cheyenne Walk, Guildford, Gerrards Cross, Mill Hill etc, it would have stopped decades back."

All ages arrive! Do u not recall the young child that drowned last year??

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"On one hand I understand your frustration OP. I too am extremely upset that a privilege I was born with has just been stripped away from me without my control. However to retain your compassion just give a thought to the glaring difference between floating here on a dingy and freely moving the continent.

Most of these people are running from hell. They are not risking their lives for a house in a country that hates them just to spite us. If we don't want to see foreigners being rescued from our shoreline then we need to address the reasons why they make these perilous journeys in the first place. Our wars abroad, our foreign policy and economic plans for the rest of the world are destroying their homes so they come here. We are all victims of the abuses thrust upon this world by greed, fear and hate but trust me, we have more in common with those poor than we do our wealthy.

Totally agree! We are so privileged to be born here! these poor souls have come from hell! X

It’s that hellish that they leave the old, the females, the young, behind. In most cases.

I’m not uncaring and I do accept the basic human need to seek a better life. This has been going on for thirty years or so now. Look at Calais and the security around the motorway and of course the tunnel. I’m sure that if those that arrive were housed in Hampstead, Cheyenne Walk, Guildford, Gerrards Cross, Mill Hill etc, it would have stopped decades back."

Tell me how exactly you expect the very people you have just mentioned to cross countries and seas? they hope if one of them at can get here they can safely get the others here.

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By *ebjonnson OP   Man
over a year ago

Maldon


"On one hand I understand your frustration OP. I too am extremely upset that a privilege I was born with has just been stripped away from me without my control. However to retain your compassion just give a thought to the glaring difference between floating here on a dingy and freely moving the continent.

Most of these people are running from hell. They are not risking their lives for a house in a country that hates them just to spite us. If we don't want to see foreigners being rescued from our shoreline then we need to address the reasons why they make these perilous journeys in the first place. Our wars abroad, our foreign policy and economic plans for the rest of the world are destroying their homes so they come here. We are all victims of the abuses thrust upon this world by greed, fear and hate but trust me, we have more in common with those poor than we do our wealthy.

Totally agree! We are so privileged to be born here! these poor souls have come from hell! X

It’s that hellish that they leave the old, the females, the young, behind. In most cases.

I’m not uncaring and I do accept the basic human need to seek a better life. This has been going on for thirty years or so now. Look at Calais and the security around the motorway and of course the tunnel. I’m sure that if those that arrive were housed in Hampstead, Cheyenne Walk, Guildford, Gerrards Cross, Mill Hill etc, it would have stopped decades back.

All ages arrive! Do u not recall the young child that drowned last year?? "

In most cases it’s young men.

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By *olly_chromaticTV/TS
over a year ago

Stockport


"Just saw the news clip of the RNLI boat bringing in another group of mainly young men , rescued from the channel.

It irritated me. Im also irritated by the decades long inability of the UK or French authorities to get to grips with this issue.

I like to think of myself as a caring , moderate, man of the world. Love and peace to all etc.

I’m also very irritated at my recent restrictions post Brexit to not spend as much time as I like anywhere in Europe. Just a bad morning perhaps? "

Ref. Point 1: There is the point that England has spent the last forty years bombing hell out of most of the countries where these people were originally. If Iran had spent the last forty years fighting their wars in Milton Keynes, there might well be English people that felt Iran owed them something.

Ref. Point 2: I also feel somewhat aggrieved about my freedoms being reduced over the last few years. I would however ask how you voted in the referendum? Everyone that voted remain, yes I feel your pain. Anyone that didn't vote, well you should have. Everyone that voted leave, suck it up, you know what you voted for, every bad effect from brexit is your own fault.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *mateur100Man
over a year ago

nr faversham


"Isn't it internationa maritime law that people stranded at sea are picked up? As far as I can recall, there's no clauses that say "yeah but apart from those guys"

International maritime law states that the boats should meet a whole raft ( ) of standards which are conveniently ignored by the French I believe

Quote the standards oar do one.

All vessels with a 6 horse power + engine must have a licensed skipper, foghorn, lifejackets for all, a certain level of buoyancy, flares, torch, baler and compass...as I understand it

That looks great apart from it having zero relevance to this discussion, also you need to provide an actual link."

You asked, I answered. I don't remember where I read this but I'm sure you can find it too if you look.

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By *ustustwo.1965Couple
over a year ago

.


"You're irritated both by your inability to go anywhere you please and other people's attempts to do the same?

Awesome reply.

Mr"

I was thinking exactly the same.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I dont really get the 'freedom to travel and study in other countries' has been curtailed. We havnt been banned from doing so, surely its just a case of a bit more red tape to consider. Admittedly I havnt or wont be trying but it seems a bit moany to me and is more 'my freedom to travel and study in other countries without having to fill in another form' has been hampered not the action itself. Who knows.

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By *ebjonnson OP   Man
over a year ago

Maldon


"You're irritated both by your inability to go anywhere you please and other people's attempts to do the same?

Awesome reply.

Mr

I was thinking exactly the same. "

It’s a clever point but the two are very different. I think the Mod was playing the Devils avocado.

One is (or was) legal and controlled, the other has no control at all and sadly, sometimes tragically, puts vulnerable people in danger.

Why do we not see gang masters / people smugglers humiliated/ punished, paraded on national TV? Are we that inept?

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By *pursChick aka ShortieWoman
over a year ago

On a mooch


"You're irritated both by your inability to go anywhere you please and other people's attempts to do the same?

Awesome reply.

Mr

I was thinking exactly the same.

It’s a clever point but the two are very different. I think the Mod was playing the Devils avocado.

One is (or was) legal and controlled, the other has no control at all and sadly, sometimes tragically, puts vulnerable people in danger.

Why do we not see gang masters / people smugglers humiliated/ punished, paraded on national TV? Are we that inept?

"

Really what world do you want to live in that we see that on TV, starting to sound like some of the places these people escape from

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Whenever I see the dinghys they're full of young men. Going to be a gender imbalance in the future. "

Maybe if they were informed in France that chances of getting a meet on Fab are slim, they might reconsider the perilous journey?

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By *luttyLaylaWoman
over a year ago

North West


"You're irritated both by your inability to go anywhere you please and other people's attempts to do the same?"

Genius!

OP, spend some time with the group of people you mentioned

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"You're irritated both by your inability to go anywhere you please and other people's attempts to do the same?

Awesome reply.

Mr

I was thinking exactly the same.

It’s a clever point but the two are very different. I think the Mod was playing the Devils avocado.

One is (or was) legal and controlled, the other has no control at all and sadly, sometimes tragically, puts vulnerable people in danger.

Why do we not see gang masters / people smugglers humiliated/ punished, paraded on national TV? Are we that inept?

"

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By *ibonacciMan
over a year ago

hidden location


"Just saw the news clip of the RNLI boat bringing in another group of mainly young men , rescued from the channel.

It irritated me. Im also irritated by the decades long inability of the UK or French authorities to get to grips with this issue.

I like to think of myself as a caring , moderate, man of the world. Love and peace to all etc.

I’m also very irritated at my recent restrictions post Brexit to not spend as much time as I like anywhere in Europe. Just a bad morning perhaps? "

One tip may help: When you sit down to take your breakfast and you're naked, try not to sit on your balls. Your outlook on life will be a lot brighter and your balls will be a whole lot healthier.

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By *ebjonnson OP   Man
over a year ago

Maldon


"You're irritated both by your inability to go anywhere you please and other people's attempts to do the same?

Genius!

OP, spend some time with the group of people you mentioned "

Ay?

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By *ebjonnson OP   Man
over a year ago

Maldon


"Just saw the news clip of the RNLI boat bringing in another group of mainly young men , rescued from the channel.

It irritated me. Im also irritated by the decades long inability of the UK or French authorities to get to grips with this issue.

I like to think of myself as a caring , moderate, man of the world. Love and peace to all etc.

I’m also very irritated at my recent restrictions post Brexit to not spend as much time as I like anywhere in Europe. Just a bad morning perhaps?

One tip may help: When you sit down to take your breakfast and you're naked, try not to sit on your balls. Your outlook on life will be a lot brighter and your balls will be a whole lot healthier. "

No idea what you are on about, who sits on their balls?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Just saw the news clip of the RNLI boat bringing in another group of mainly young men , rescued from the channel.

It irritated me. Im also irritated by the decades long inability of the UK or French authorities to get to grips with this issue.

I like to think of myself as a caring , moderate, man of the world. Love and peace to all etc.

I’m also very irritated at my recent restrictions post Brexit to not spend as much time as I like anywhere in Europe. Just a bad morning perhaps?

One tip may help: When you sit down to take your breakfast and you're naked, try not to sit on your balls. Your outlook on life will be a lot brighter and your balls will be a whole lot healthier.

No idea what you are on about, who sits on their balls? "

It happens sometimes

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 09/09/21 15:25:55]

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By *ervent_fervourMan
over a year ago

Halifax


"You're irritated both by your inability to go anywhere you please and other people's attempts to do the same?

Ones legal the other isn't "

Bugger legal(and priti Patel, who keeps gettigg slapped down through her illegal actions),one's preference, the other's moral.

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By *atielpoolTV/TS
over a year ago

liverpool

We recieve about a third of the asylum applications that France does, we’re quite away behind Turkey which has 4 million plus refugees. Ironically under EU law which we no longer belong, we did have the right to return them to the shores of Calais

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 09/09/21 15:29:05]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It is not xenophobic or racist to be upset that the government does nothing to deal with the cost of foreigners entering this country illegally from France. Unfortunately this is just one of the many ways our government is wasting our tax money, while feathering their own nests and those of their chums, all while moving your pension further and further beyond your reach.

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By *dwalu2Couple
over a year ago

Bristol

It’s curious that the people who never seem to shut up about asylum seekers ‘putting a strain on public finances’, etc etc are always blithely unconcerned by our corrupt and inept government publicly diverting public money by the billions into the private hands of their corporate donors and families.

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By *dwalu2Couple
over a year ago

Bristol


"It is not xenophobic or racist to be upset that the government does nothing to deal with the cost of foreigners entering this country illegally from France. Unfortunately this is just one of the many ways our government is wasting our tax money, while feathering their own nests and those of their chums, all while moving your pension further and further beyond your reach."

Not these ones though!

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By *mateur100Man
over a year ago

nr faversham

Ive read a lot of the comments here and elsewhere and I just wonder if the £54m being given to the French to try and stop these crossings (by their own admission it's impossible) would be better spent building an asylum centre of sorts on/near the Calais camps? £54m could build a hell of a centre. You would hope that those genuinely seeking asylum would use it and vastly reduce the small boat crossings, risk to life, and people smuggling gangs? Or am I just living in a dream world

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By *andyfloss2000Woman
over a year ago

ashford


"On one hand I understand your frustration OP. I too am extremely upset that a privilege I was born with has just been stripped away from me without my control. However to retain your compassion just give a thought to the glaring difference between floating here on a dingy and freely moving the continent.

Most of these people are running from hell. They are not risking their lives for a house in a country that hates them just to spite us. If we don't want to see foreigners being rescued from our shoreline then we need to address the reasons why they make these perilous journeys in the first place. Our wars abroad, our foreign policy and economic plans for the rest of the world are destroying their homes so they come here. We are all victims of the abuses thrust upon this world by greed, fear and hate but trust me, we have more in common with those poor than we do our wealthy.

Totally agree! We are so privileged to be born here! these poor souls have come from hell! X

It’s that hellish that they leave the old, the females, the young, behind. In most cases.

I’m not uncaring and I do accept the basic human need to seek a better life. This has been going on for thirty years or so now. Look at Calais and the security around the motorway and of course the tunnel. I’m sure that if those that arrive were housed in Hampstead, Cheyenne Walk, Guildford, Gerrards Cross, Mill Hill etc, it would have stopped decades back.

All ages arrive! Do u not recall the young child that drowned last year??

In most cases it’s young men."
and young men deserve compassion!

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By *ervent_fervourMan
over a year ago

Halifax


"There's nothing wrong with wanting proper border controls.

We've built a welfare state and made a country we can be proud of.

You can't have a welfare state AND open borders

Why?

Because we have so many people paying in and so many people taking out. They should roughly balance. That is the social contract.

What would happen if millions of people arrive with open borders?

Who would pay benefits? Who would pay for extra school places? Extra hospital places? More road space? Housing?

A lot of virtue signalling going on but people aren't addressing the issues.

It's like your household, set up to run, presumably, with a rough balance between income, mouths to feed etc. What would happen if more people just turned up uninvited?

1. That isn't how national economies work. You don't "balance" books like a household budget.

2. Where are these millions coming from? Currently there are as many foreign born nationals living in the UK as there are british ex pats living abroad.

3. Stop calling anything vaguely socially democratic "virtue signalling". Are people who wear poppies and are vocal about doing so virtue signallers?

Not so. In the EU referendum the Remainers claimed there were as many UK ex-pats living abroad as there were vice-versa.

The UK and EU countries are now asking each others citizens to register there presence.

It has been found that 6m EU citizens were, after all, in the UK. There are 1.75m (it might be 2.75m...can't remember) UK citizens living elsewhere.

The effect on house prices, wages etc has been entirely predictable

You think every 12th person living in the UK was a foreign born EU national? I highly doubt that.

What about points 1 and 3?

Also 4:

The entire premise of the argument seems to be based around foreign people being a drain on national resources. From an employers perspective I have only ever seen hard workers. Actual, reliable, dependable and solid. Not afraid of a hard days graft. I'm gutted I lost my Poles and Slovaks. They were highly skilled and worked a darn sight harder than the locals.

Points 1 and 3 ..I simply haven't got all day but... you're wrong

Yes, employers like open borders.

It's supply and demand. If the supply of labour increases then it's price ..wages. .will fall.

We're seeing that deliberate employer-backed over-supply unwind now in the transport and leisure industries

Working people know these truths and have, over the decades, built up reasonable wages and living standards.

Uncontrolled immigration adversely affects wages, house prices, schools, hospitals etc.

It is not racist to say that

There should be more than enough money in the pot. Just needs fairer taxation. Plus fairer redistribution to the councils who most need it. Unfortunately they're mostly Tory led. Which is funny. It's almost like there's aa conspiracy with deliberate underfunding in order to gain votes and stoke dogwhistle racism.

In what way is it 'dogwhistlr racism' to oppose open borders?

Do you support downward pressure on wages, upward pressure on house prices, schools, hospitals etc?

In what way is it 'racist' to point that out?"

The whole thing is dogwhistle racism. Xenophobia I believe the title of the thread points this out?

And could you answer why the ridiculous term virtue signalling is at heart a bad thing? People point out that politicians and the media are mistreating people, and you see this phrase used as a demeaning slur. The right attempting to destroy/subvert semantics by turning something which should be self evidently positive (ie stating something moral) into, as I say, a slur.

Comes across as pathetic and insiduous as remoaner and woke and snowflake,and used by people who have been manipulated by the right wing media to (ironically) criticise anyone who states an opi nion opposite to their agenda(usually affiliated with non right wing media).

Which then means any debate is pointless. Which is the aim. So frustrating and depressing.

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By *mateur100Man
over a year ago

nr faversham

Can anyone help me in understanding why the French claim it's breaking maritime law to turn boats back into French waters citing "people at risk of losing their lives must be rescued"? Why doesn't this apply when the boats are moving from the French coast towards British waters?

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By *drianukMan
over a year ago

Spain, Lancs


"There's nothing wrong with wanting proper border controls.

We've built a welfare state and made a country we can be proud of.

You can't have a welfare state AND open borders

Why?

Because we have so many people paying in and so many people taking out. They should roughly balance. That is the social contract.

What would happen if millions of people arrive with open borders?

Who would pay benefits? Who would pay for extra school places? Extra hospital places? More road space? Housing?

A lot of virtue signalling going on but people aren't addressing the issues.

It's like your household, set up to run, presumably, with a rough balance between income, mouths to feed etc. What would happen if more people just turned up uninvited?

1. That isn't how national economies work. You don't "balance" books like a household budget.

2. Where are these millions coming from? Currently there are as many foreign born nationals living in the UK as there are british ex pats living abroad.

3. Stop calling anything vaguely socially democratic "virtue signalling". Are people who wear poppies and are vocal about doing so virtue signallers?

Not so. In the EU referendum the Remainers claimed there were as many UK ex-pats living abroad as there were vice-versa.

The UK and EU countries are now asking each others citizens to register there presence.

It has been found that 6m EU citizens were, after all, in the UK. There are 1.75m (it might be 2.75m...can't remember) UK citizens living elsewhere.

The effect on house prices, wages etc has been entirely predictable

You think every 12th person living in the UK was a foreign born EU national? I highly doubt that.

What about points 1 and 3?

Also 4:

The entire premise of the argument seems to be based around foreign people being a drain on national resources. From an employers perspective I have only ever seen hard workers. Actual, reliable, dependable and solid. Not afraid of a hard days graft. I'm gutted I lost my Poles and Slovaks. They were highly skilled and worked a darn sight harder than the locals.

Points 1 and 3 ..I simply haven't got all day but... you're wrong

Yes, employers like open borders.

It's supply and demand. If the supply of labour increases then it's price ..wages. .will fall.

We're seeing that deliberate employer-backed over-supply unwind now in the transport and leisure industries

Working people know these truths and have, over the decades, built up reasonable wages and living standards.

Uncontrolled immigration adversely affects wages, house prices, schools, hospitals etc.

It is not racist to say that

There should be more than enough money in the pot. Just needs fairer taxation. Plus fairer redistribution to the councils who most need it. Unfortunately they're mostly Tory led. Which is funny. It's almost like there's aa conspiracy with deliberate underfunding in order to gain votes and stoke dogwhistle racism.

In what way is it 'dogwhistlr racism' to oppose open borders?

Do you support downward pressure on wages, upward pressure on house prices, schools, hospitals etc?

In what way is it 'racist' to point that out?

The whole thing is dogwhistle racism. Xenophobia I believe the title of the thread points this out?

And could you answer why the ridiculous term virtue signalling is at heart a bad thing? People point out that politicians and the media are mistreating people, and you see this phrase used as a demeaning slur. The right attempting to destroy/subvert semantics by turning something which should be self evidently positive (ie stating something moral) into, as I say, a slur.

Comes across as pathetic and insiduous as remoaner and woke and snowflake,and used by people who have been manipulated by the right wing media to (ironically) criticise anyone who states an opi nion opposite to their agenda(usually affiliated with non right wing media).

Which then means any debate is pointless. Which is the aim. So frustrating and depressing. "

You merely assert that it is racism to have these concerns.

In what way is it racist?

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By *ebjonnson OP   Man
over a year ago

Maldon


"Can anyone help me in understanding why the French claim it's breaking maritime law to turn boats back into French waters citing "people at risk of losing their lives must be rescued"? Why doesn't this apply when the boats are moving from the French coast towards British waters? "

I think we know.

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By *uke olovingmanMan
over a year ago

Gravesend

Surely the French are breaking some law allowing the migrants illegally staying in their country to leave and illegally enter another country

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By *mateur100Man
over a year ago

nr faversham


"Can anyone help me in understanding why the French claim it's breaking maritime law to turn boats back into French waters citing "people at risk of losing their lives must be rescued"? Why doesn't this apply when the boats are moving from the French coast towards British waters?

I think we know."

I'd appreciate some guidance because I can't understand it

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By *andyfloss2000Woman
over a year ago

ashford

At the end of the the day they are our fellow humans! And should b treated with compassion! We are lucky to b born here! And have no idea what horrors they have been through to get here! Leaving everything they know to put their lives at risk in sinking boats! Respect to them! X

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By *mateur100Man
over a year ago

nr faversham


"At the end of the the day they are our fellow humans! And should b treated with compassion! We are lucky to b born here! And have no idea what horrors they have been through to get here! Leaving everything they know to put their lives at risk in sinking boats! Respect to them! X"

Sadly we don't live in the garden of Eden

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By *drianukMan
over a year ago

Spain, Lancs


"At the end of the the day they are our fellow humans! And should b treated with compassion! We are lucky to b born here! And have no idea what horrors they have been through to get here! Leaving everything they know to put their lives at risk in sinking boats! Respect to them! X"

Would you have an upper limit? 10m? 20m?

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By *andyfloss2000Woman
over a year ago

ashford


"At the end of the the day they are our fellow humans! And should b treated with compassion! We are lucky to b born here! And have no idea what horrors they have been through to get here! Leaving everything they know to put their lives at risk in sinking boats! Respect to them! X

Sadly we don't live in the garden of Eden"

No but we are all capable of empathy! X

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By *mateur100Man
over a year ago

nr faversham


"At the end of the the day they are our fellow humans! And should b treated with compassion! We are lucky to b born here! And have no idea what horrors they have been through to get here! Leaving everything they know to put their lives at risk in sinking boats! Respect to them! X

Sadly we don't live in the garden of Eden

No but we are all capable of empathy! X"

And pragmatism

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By *andyfloss2000Woman
over a year ago

ashford


"At the end of the the day they are our fellow humans! And should b treated with compassion! We are lucky to b born here! And have no idea what horrors they have been through to get here! Leaving everything they know to put their lives at risk in sinking boats! Respect to them! X

Sadly we don't live in the garden of Eden

No but we are all capable of empathy! X

And pragmatism"

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By *rHotNottsMan
over a year ago

Dubai & Nottingham


"Those people will eventually pay the tax that will ensure you’re looked after in your old age."

The ones at the Syrian car wash near me dint don’t , they just sell c*ke and young girls for the night ….. and wash cars

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By *drianukMan
over a year ago

Spain, Lancs


"At the end of the the day they are our fellow humans! And should b treated with compassion! We are lucky to b born here! And have no idea what horrors they have been through to get here! Leaving everything they know to put their lives at risk in sinking boats! Respect to them! X

Sadly we don't live in the garden of Eden

No but we are all capable of empathy! X

And pragmatism

"

And if they were economic immigrants... would you still want to let them all in? How many? 1m? 10m? 20m?

Should the act of them buying a place from a people smuggler be enough to let anyone in?

What about housing? Hospitals? Wage levels?

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By *hocCock1Man
over a year ago

Southampton

I don't despair, when I see people being plucked out of the treacherous sea, I despair when I see some of the posts in these threads. Legal or illegal immigrants aren't stealing your low paid job or taking all your benefits...corporations and governments are taking money out of your pockets and making you believe its the 'others' fault.Divide and rule, works every time

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By *drianukMan
over a year ago

Spain, Lancs


"I don't despair, when I see people being plucked out of the treacherous sea, I despair when I see some of the posts in these threads. Legal or illegal immigrants aren't stealing your low paid job or taking all your benefits...corporations and governments are taking money out of your pockets and making you believe its the 'others' fault.Divide and rule, works every time "

So should there be an upper limit? What should that limit be?

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By *onb21Woman
over a year ago

Cardiff

This country is filthy rich and not through honourable means.

Be mad at the people that have more than they ever need and hold on to it instead of at those who have less than you.

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By *drianukMan
over a year ago

Spain, Lancs


"This country is filthy rich and not through honourable means.

Be mad at the people that have more than they ever need and hold on to it instead of at those who have less than you."

If most are economic immigrants (they are as they are coming from France) should there be an upper limit?

What about the effects on wages, housing, hospitals etc?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I don't despair, when I see people being plucked out of the treacherous sea, I despair when I see some of the posts in these threads. Legal or illegal immigrants aren't stealing your low paid job or taking all your benefits...corporations and governments are taking money out of your pockets and making you believe its the 'others' fault.Divide and rule, works every time

So should there be an upper limit? What should that limit be?"

What would your upper limit be?

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By *hocCock1Man
over a year ago

Southampton


"I don't despair, when I see people being plucked out of the treacherous sea, I despair when I see some of the posts in these threads. Legal or illegal immigrants aren't stealing your low paid job or taking all your benefits...corporations and governments are taking money out of your pockets and making you believe its the 'others' fault.Divide and rule, works every time

So should there be an upper limit? What should that limit be?"

Corporations should pay their fair share of taxes that would solve ALL money issues. Government should be honest and say we live off cheap labour , always have, so we need more bodies again IMHO

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"At the end of the the day they are our fellow humans! And should b treated with compassion! We are lucky to b born here! And have no idea what horrors they have been through to get here! Leaving everything they know to put their lives at risk in sinking boats! Respect to them! X

Sadly we don't live in the garden of Eden

No but we are all capable of empathy! X

And pragmatism

And if they were economic immigrants... would you still want to let them all in? How many? 1m? 10m? 20m?

Should the act of them buying a place from a people smuggler be enough to let anyone in?

What about housing? Hospitals? Wage levels?"
why does it need to boil down to a number? I don't think anyone is advocating unlimited migration. And so other than saying we should accept no migrants at all, then it's about being sensible. Because of you are worried about strain on space and hospitals, should countries limit tourists ?

And for asylum seekers, how they come in doesn't mean they are simply let in. And those who avoid due process will probably not be buying houses or sending kids to school... From what little I know you have to seek to stay off radars.

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By *ap d agde coupleCouple
over a year ago

Broadstairs


"This country is filthy rich and not through honourable means.

Be mad at the people that have more than they ever need and hold on to it instead of at those who have less than you."
Really U.K. is 2.2 Trillion in debt

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By *yron69Man
over a year ago

Fareham


"This country is filthy rich and not through honourable means.

Be mad at the people that have more than they ever need and hold on to it instead of at those who have less than you."

Show me an honourable country?

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By *drianukMan
over a year ago

Spain, Lancs


"I don't despair, when I see people being plucked out of the treacherous sea, I despair when I see some of the posts in these threads. Legal or illegal immigrants aren't stealing your low paid job or taking all your benefits...corporations and governments are taking money out of your pockets and making you believe its the 'others' fault.Divide and rule, works every time

So should there be an upper limit? What should that limit be?

Corporations should pay their fair share of taxes that would solve ALL money issues. Government should be honest and say we live off cheap labour , always have, so we need more bodies again IMHO "

That's the future you want, is it? One of cheap labour?

Undermining the workers who've spent generations trying to tighten up the labour market against bullying employers?

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By *izandpaulCouple
over a year ago

merseyside


"This popped up on my Facebook memories today.

‘My parents voted to leave to ‘stop all these immigrants’ They have both subsequently died in the past 3 years. We watched, as each in turn were nursed to a dignified and comfortable death by nursing and care staff from the European Union. The irony was not lost on us’ "

Nice.

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By *elshkinkyMan
over a year ago

south wales

Never argue with stupid people as they will bring you down to their level and beat you with experience

Mark Twain

Not aimed at anyone in particular but whose advice I repeat on subjects such as this… I despair at people who have opinions on it without knowing enough about it

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By *hocCock1Man
over a year ago

Southampton


"I don't despair, when I see people being plucked out of the treacherous sea, I despair when I see some of the posts in these threads. Legal or illegal immigrants aren't stealing your low paid job or taking all your benefits...corporations and governments are taking money out of your pockets and making you believe its the 'others' fault.Divide and rule, works every time

So should there be an upper limit? What should that limit be?

Corporations should pay their fair share of taxes that would solve ALL money issues. Government should be honest and say we live off cheap labour , always have, so we need more bodies again IMHO

That's the future you want, is it? One of cheap labour?

Undermining the workers who've spent generations trying to tighten up the labour market against bullying employers?"

You misunderstood me...its not what I want...its where we are now !!! Government just aren't saying it

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By *hocCock1Man
over a year ago

Southampton


"Never argue with stupid people as they will bring you down to their level and beat you with experience

Mark Twain

Not aimed at anyone in particular but whose advice I repeat on subjects such as this… I despair at people who have opinions on it without knowing enough about it "

This did spring to my mind

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By *onb21Woman
over a year ago

Cardiff


"I don't despair, when I see people being plucked out of the treacherous sea, I despair when I see some of the posts in these threads. Legal or illegal immigrants aren't stealing your low paid job or taking all your benefits...corporations and governments are taking money out of your pockets and making you believe its the 'others' fault.Divide and rule, works every time "

Bullies never go for the powerful. They will always attack the weak.

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By *hocCock1Man
over a year ago

Southampton


"I don't despair, when I see people being plucked out of the treacherous sea, I despair when I see some of the posts in these threads. Legal or illegal immigrants aren't stealing your low paid job or taking all your benefits...corporations and governments are taking money out of your pockets and making you believe its the 'others' fault.Divide and rule, works every time

Bullies never go for the powerful. They will always attack the weak."

Sadly true

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By *amish SMan
over a year ago

Eastleigh

If they are fleeing persecution, war, drought etc, then they should stop in the first safe country they come to. To cross half a dozen safe countries to then claim asylum is not right or fair on the UK or any other country where this happens.

I find it irritating that the EU can dictate how we control our borders, didn't see the same reaction to Australia, or Denmark.

Some may want to turn up unannounced on a French beach with no passport and see how they would be treated, something says it will be far harsher than how we treat those arriving here.

End of the day, and many out there racist or not want control of our borders and who comes in, and clearly at the moment this is not the case.

It also makes a mockery of the EU's insistence of a border in the Irish sea between the UK and NI. If I was a resident of Ireland and arrived in the UK mainland port and was asked to show a passport I would be well pissed off, because apparently if you come from France you don't need one it seems.

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By *izandpaulCouple
over a year ago

merseyside

It's a very complex problem with multiple layers.

My husband works in some of the worlds shitholes(as he so eloquently puts it) and often talks about the problems the country and its nationals face.

While there is abject poverty in the world and our inability or will to solve it, it's just same old.

One young guy in an African state, who was trying to get a weeks school for a manky old chicken but was turned away, chatted to Paul.

Asked him about his life, family and school but the statement that took the wind out of his sails was why don't all British kids go to school if it's free.

To them, education is a golden ticket to freedom and why wouldn't anyone want a free golden ticket.

You go from that extreme to another. Criminals openly speaking about coming to UK to commit crime as it's well known(according to them) that even when you get caught, without a travel document it's difficult to deport, nobody kicks the shit out of you in a British prison and family don't have to supply the prison with your food.

In a nutshell, there is no easy answer and never try to put all those foreign folks you see on TV and social media in the same boat. No pun intended.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"If they are fleeing persecution, war, drought etc, then they should stop in the first safe country they come to. To cross half a dozen safe countries to then claim asylum is not right or fair on the UK or any other country where this happens.

I find it irritating that the EU can dictate how we control our borders, didn't see the same reaction to Australia, or Denmark.

Some may want to turn up unannounced on a French beach with no passport and see how they would be treated, something says it will be far harsher than how we treat those arriving here.

End of the day, and many out there racist or not want control of our borders and who comes in, and clearly at the moment this is not the case.

It also makes a mockery of the EU's insistence of a border in the Irish sea between the UK and NI. If I was a resident of Ireland and arrived in the UK mainland port and was asked to show a passport I would be well pissed off, because apparently if you come from France you don't need one it seems. "
it's not fair on the UK to pick up a handful but is fair for countries neighbouring war zones to have to house millions. Basically saying as we are an island, fuck the lot of you... Who cares if we've had a hand in the mayhem ?

Will admit I struggle to follow the rest of your thread. Talking about a trade border when we are talking about people has thrown me. Talking about the EU dictating stuff has thrown me. Denmark is in the EU. And Australia is the itehe side of the world. It feels like you've played immigration news bingo.

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By *ebjonnson OP   Man
over a year ago

Maldon


"If they are fleeing persecution, war, drought etc, then they should stop in the first safe country they come to. To cross half a dozen safe countries to then claim asylum is not right or fair on the UK or any other country where this happens.

I find it irritating that the EU can dictate how we control our borders, didn't see the same reaction to Australia, or Denmark.

Some may want to turn up unannounced on a French beach with no passport and see how they would be treated, something says it will be far harsher than how we treat those arriving here.

End of the day, and many out there racist or not want control of our borders and who comes in, and clearly at the moment this is not the case.

It also makes a mockery of the EU's insistence of a border in the Irish sea between the UK and NI. If I was a resident of Ireland and arrived in the UK mainland port and was asked to show a passport I would be well pissed off, because apparently if you come from France you don't need one it seems. "

Some great points.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"You should all be upset and pissed we’re not controlling our boarders.you don’t have a clue who’s coming in what crimes they’ve vomited in other countries. Rapist. Nonces. Drug dealers. Suppose I’m a racist then

We have never had ‘control ‘ of our borders, it’s naive to think we ever will "

But he's talking about boarders like a previous contributior, not borders.

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By *uriousscouserWoman
over a year ago

Wirral


"There are a lot of interesting views on this. Like others, I’m puzzled as to why the people fleeing persecution from their home country, choose to pass through several other safe countries to get to the UK. Surely you’d be grateful at the first safe place you come to that you’re no longer looking over your shoulder scared for your life..

Not to then carry on in an unsafe overloaded dinghy or through the channel tunnel just to reach our shores…

Just screams out benefit claimants to me… "

Asylum seekers can claim:

€47.60/week in france

€408/month in Germany

£39.63/week in the UK

I suspect our generous benefits aren't the main draw.

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