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You'd look prettier if you smiled. Part 2

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By *angbangFantasy OP   Woman
over a year ago

London

Honestly there were some interesting posts in the 1st one, but I can't believe some comments some made. Just further strengthen the idea of misogyny being alive and well.

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By *ellhungvweMan
over a year ago

Cheltenham

So you were quiet in the first thread OP. Which comments did you think were interesting?

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By *ad NannaWoman
over a year ago

East London

Is it always about misogyny?.

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By *angbangFantasy OP   Woman
over a year ago

London

This post by La Fee Verte:

This thread has reminded me of a very similar one a little while ago - it was called something like 'women owe you nothing'.

I accept, as has been mentioned by *some* men earlier in the thread that silly, rude, none of their business type remarks can be made to and by either sex. Though I think it's far far more common to be men towards women. However, what I think *some* men will never appreciate is that there's all too often an extra layer of potential menace when a strange bloke bellows across the street at a woman to 'cheer up it may never happen' or 'it wouldn't hurt to smile'. And that's because apart from simply being irritated you don't know how said bloke is going to react if you a) ignore him or b) answer back. It's actually bloody intimidating when someone you didn't even know existed two minutes ago snarls that you're a 'stuck up bitch' or 'stupid cunt' or 'ugly cow' all because you don't immediately beam a dazzling smile in their direction as soon as they rudely alerted you to their presence, whilst fluttering your eyelashes and simpering.

Make no mistake... there are ways and ways of showing genuine concern if you truly believe someone needs help. Shouting at you to rearrange your face in some way isn't one of them and is frightening. I've had men persist when I've ignored them or hurried away, calling down the road after me etc. The way it makes me feel is that the man (or men plural) are attention seeking, that they want a reaction for their benefit (not mine) either because they're clumsily hitting on you or because they enjoy putting women down and 'justify' doing so by setting her up as in a woman ignoring them is twisted round in their head as being 'uptight' so they then feel entitled to call her a bitch or worse. I've had a man shout at me and then because I ignored him and carried on my way shout even louder 'Oi, luv, I'm talking to you!'... like I exist as a woman to 'serve' or 'entertain' men. You know, it's not fucking Gilead.

Can I ask this?... any man who's had a woman make similar comments to them, does it scare you, do you feel your stomach lurch in fear because you don't know if an annoying interruption is going to turn into something worse? And if you ignore a woman who tells you to smile, does she then turn verbally aggressive?

There are very distinct differences between the same phrase (re: smiling) being levelled at a man by a woman and vice versa. In each case yes it's arguably rude but I very much doubt a woman doing it has the motives as many of the men who do it do and it's disingenuous to suggest the effects on the target are the same.

Disclaimer: I know not *all* men carry on like this. I'm not suggesting they do so if you don't my comments aren't aimed at you. Furthermore I'm heartened to see some insightful posts from some male posters who 'get' it. I'm just sick of being made to feel completely and unnecessarily scared by what are, at best, utterly thoughtless rude and uninvited remarks which, at worst, are an excuse to verbally batter me, pass judgement on my appearance or personality when you have no clue who I am.

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By *angbangFantasy OP   Woman
over a year ago

London


"This post by La Fee Verte:

This thread has reminded me of a very similar one a little while ago - it was called something like 'women owe you nothing'.

I accept, as has been mentioned by *some* men earlier in the thread that silly, rude, none of their business type remarks can be made to and by either sex. Though I think it's far far more common to be men towards women. However, what I think *some* men will never appreciate is that there's all too often an extra layer of potential menace when a strange bloke bellows across the street at a woman to 'cheer up it may never happen' or 'it wouldn't hurt to smile'. And that's because apart from simply being irritated you don't know how said bloke is going to react if you a) ignore him or b) answer back. It's actually bloody intimidating when someone you didn't even know existed two minutes ago snarls that you're a 'stuck up bitch' or 'stupid cunt' or 'ugly cow' all because you don't immediately beam a dazzling smile in their direction as soon as they rudely alerted you to their presence, whilst fluttering your eyelashes and simpering.

Make no mistake... there are ways and ways of showing genuine concern if you truly believe someone needs help. Shouting at you to rearrange your face in some way isn't one of them and is frightening. I've had men persist when I've ignored them or hurried away, calling down the road after me etc. The way it makes me feel is that the man (or men plural) are attention seeking, that they want a reaction for their benefit (not mine) either because they're clumsily hitting on you or because they enjoy putting women down and 'justify' doing so by setting her up as in a woman ignoring them is twisted round in their head as being 'uptight' so they then feel entitled to call her a bitch or worse. I've had a man shout at me and then because I ignored him and carried on my way shout even louder 'Oi, luv, I'm talking to you!'... like I exist as a woman to 'serve' or 'entertain' men. You know, it's not fucking Gilead.

Can I ask this?... any man who's had a woman make similar comments to them, does it scare you, do you feel your stomach lurch in fear because you don't know if an annoying interruption is going to turn into something worse? And if you ignore a woman who tells you to smile, does she then turn verbally aggressive?

There are very distinct differences between the same phrase (re: smiling) being levelled at a man by a woman and vice versa. In each case yes it's arguably rude but I very much doubt a woman doing it has the motives as many of the men who do it do and it's disingenuous to suggest the effects on the target are the same.

Disclaimer: I know not *all* men carry on like this. I'm not suggesting they do so if you don't my comments aren't aimed at you. Furthermore I'm heartened to see some insightful posts from some male posters who 'get' it. I'm just sick of being made to feel completely and unnecessarily scared by what are, at best, utterly thoughtless rude and uninvited remarks which, at worst, are an excuse to verbally batter me, pass judgement on my appearance or personality when you have no clue who I am."

This post was very balanced

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By *angbangFantasy OP   Woman
over a year ago

London

I think random strange men asking a women to smile isn't for the benefit of the woman but rather for the man saying it.

Some were saying that we may not know the intent of a man when he says that and it might not be from a place of malice, but how a woman, you don't know, looks isn't any of their business to imply that they should smile because they wouldbe prettier (in the opinion of the random man). What about the woman? They have every right to look how they look because in turn you don't know what she has going on in her life or that day.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I think random strange men asking a women to smile isn't for the benefit of the woman but rather for the man saying it.

Some were saying that we may not know the intent of a man when he says that and it might not be from a place of malice, but how a woman, you don't know, looks isn't any of their business to imply that they should smile because they wouldbe prettier (in the opinion of the random man). What about the woman? They have every right to look how they look because in turn you don't know what she has going on in her life or that day.

"

Couldn’t agree more.

Someone said it to me so recently after my dad died and then winked at me and I could’ve ripped his head off.

It’s quite different to someone looking at you and smiling which is fine and harmless, to tell someone to smile just pisses me off personally.

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West

"Cheer up, worse things could happen" is on a similar vein and how fucking presumptuous and insensitive when the person hasn't a clue what's happening in the other person's life!

Or my favourite, after permanent disability caused by childbirth - "at least you have a healthy baby". Great, thanks.

There's an insidious culture of people (not just men) minimising issues that affect others, but often women. There's research to back up doctors (including female ones) are more likely to attribute pain in women to "emotions" and won't prescribe painkillers. They are far more likely to offer painkillers for to men reporting pain on the same level.

Like I said, insidious and deeply rooted/entrenched.

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By *icolerobbieCouple
over a year ago

walsall


""Cheer up, worse things could happen" is on a similar vein and how fucking presumptuous and insensitive when the person hasn't a clue what's happening in the other person's life!

Or my favourite, after permanent disability caused by childbirth - "at least you have a healthy baby". Great, thanks.

There's an insidious culture of people (not just men) minimising issues that affect others, but often women. There's research to back up doctors (including female ones) are more likely to attribute pain in women to "emotions" and won't prescribe painkillers. They are far more likely to offer painkillers for to men reporting pain on the same level.

Like I said, insidious and deeply rooted/entrenched."

Interesting, I wonder why they’d do that? Perhaps female doctors think that they are malingering ?

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West


""Cheer up, worse things could happen" is on a similar vein and how fucking presumptuous and insensitive when the person hasn't a clue what's happening in the other person's life!

Or my favourite, after permanent disability caused by childbirth - "at least you have a healthy baby". Great, thanks.

There's an insidious culture of people (not just men) minimising issues that affect others, but often women. There's research to back up doctors (including female ones) are more likely to attribute pain in women to "emotions" and won't prescribe painkillers. They are far more likely to offer painkillers for to men reporting pain on the same level.

Like I said, insidious and deeply rooted/entrenched.

Interesting, I wonder why they’d do that? Perhaps female doctors think that they are malingering ?"

Both male and female doctors have been observed to behave in that way. I'd personally blame the training. The majority of medics are men (especially so in certain specialisms) and so their ideas of how to treat women's issues are reinforced to all genders that they train. Treatment of specifically women's health issues are especially badly handled across the board - things like endometriosis, pelvic organ prolapse, dysfunctional menstruation etc.

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