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Is success hard work or luck?

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By *hagTonight OP   Man
over a year ago

From the land of haribos.

I watched coach gregs latest video about it https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cNuMlYLF-yQ

and it was interesting, as he gave few examples on it like circumstances determines it also, like someone can study as hard as someone else, but if they lived in a poor country they wouldnt have the same privelages to be what they wanted to be from their studies.

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By *hagTonight OP   Man
over a year ago

From the land of haribos.

I would say it is a mix of them both.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I agree to a certain extent your birthplace and social status can hinder some.

Far more equal opportunities in today's societies though so it's much better and continues to improve.

I worked my way up but a few lucky breaks along the way helped greatly. Sometimes it's not what you know its who you know.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Patience is key

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By *tue555Man
over a year ago

Passed Beyond Reach


"I watched coach gregs latest video about it https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cNuMlYLF-yQ

and it was interesting, as he gave few examples on it like circumstances determines it also, like someone can study as hard as someone else, but if they lived in a poor country they wouldnt have the same privelages to be what they wanted to be from their studies."

It could be either or combination of both. My early minor success was though hard work then I got a lucky break through the swing scene. The rest was hard work and sacrifice

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Patience is key

"

This Shag, didn’t you know

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

A bit of both laced with persistance and drive.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Bit of both but more weighted to hard work, perseverance etc.

Your own success in whatever it is you are doing whether it be your own business or competing in a sport is mostly down to you and your own efforts.

There are always outliers to this, those born into wealth who are given a head start or who have access to the best coaches etc. They don't always succeed though,many fail as they don't have the drive.

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By *ools and the brainCouple
over a year ago

couple, us we him her.

Both plus a ruthless Streak.

You don't become very successful unless you are willing to be a bit of a cunt .

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Sometimes both, sometimes either.

So many different paths and decisions in life that it could be any combination of the two.

Personally I have always worked hard but I have also been really lucky at a few keys points in life.

There is also the question of how you measure success? I feel like I am successful but somone else in my position may feel that what I have achieved is not enough for them. What is luck and what isn’t depends on a persons mindset.

I think if you work hard then you are more likely to take advantage of luck...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

100% luck

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By *ackformore100Man
over a year ago

Tin town


"Both plus a ruthless Streak.

You don't become very successful unless you are willing to be a bit of a cunt ."

Do you think that is always true? I think in some cases but I know a handful of successful folks who are also the nicest of people.

I'm also of the opinion that the definition of success is very personal and can be something remarkably humble to something outrageously grandiose.... Mine is getting a reply to an email this year.

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By *tue555Man
over a year ago

Passed Beyond Reach

Success also has its ramifications and cost. Resentment for one, relationships, people trying to undermine you rather than up their own game.

Now enjoy a comfortable lifestyle, doing what we want and sharing it with gorgeous partner

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By *n080971Man
over a year ago

Tower Bridge

Certainly in business the harder you work the luckier you get.

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By *ackformore100Man
over a year ago

Tin town


"Certainly in business the harder you work the luckier you get."

There's some great quotes on that message...

For the golfers among us... Lee trevino.

“There is no such thing as natural touch. Touch is something you create by hitting millions of golf balls.”

And Gary Player, renowned for his hard work ethic and humble childhood...

"the more I work and practise, the luckier I seem to get"... This from a guy who at age 81 was still doing 1000 crunches a day.

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By *iscreet-is-paramountMan
over a year ago

somewhere only we know.

Some get a leg up, others start from the bottom. I'm glad all I have is what I've earned and not been given.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

There is a lot of factors that come into it,

Nothing is ever achieved without hard work but I would say luck and being in the right time place also help

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By *ackformore100Man
over a year ago

Tin town


"There is a lot of factors that come into it,

Nothing is ever achieved without hard work but I would say luck and being in the right time place also help "

And who you know?

There's a lot to be said for being in the right place at the right time.

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By *ophieslutTV/TS
over a year ago

Central

It's more than just those 2 options, it's also about the decisions, risks taken and other options. Personality also plays a part, including being part of the 'right' set and privilege. Sensitivity and being astute are aspects of successful opportunity taking too. Privilege is a substantial factor still, including having the right family, connections etc.

Hard work may give you lots of satisfaction and rewards for doing that job but not avenues for promotion, for example

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By *ad NannaWoman
over a year ago

East London

Some success is down to who your parents are, how wealthy they are and which University they sent you to.

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By *hagTonight OP   Man
over a year ago

From the land of haribos.


"I agree to a certain extent your birthplace and social status can hinder some.

Far more equal opportunities in today's societies though so it's much better and continues to improve.

I worked my way up but a few lucky breaks along the way helped greatly. Sometimes it's not what you know its who you know."

Yes, it does improve more today as it is more equal opportunities than every before, as well some kinds of luck involved too

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Some success is down to who your parents are, how wealthy they are and which University they sent you to.

"

Sorry wouldnt agree with this at all

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By *hagTonight OP   Man
over a year ago

From the land of haribos.


"Patience is key

"

Yes, it is that too

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By *hagTonight OP   Man
over a year ago

From the land of haribos.


"I watched coach gregs latest video about it https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cNuMlYLF-yQ

and it was interesting, as he gave few examples on it like circumstances determines it also, like someone can study as hard as someone else, but if they lived in a poor country they wouldnt have the same privelages to be what they wanted to be from their studies.

It could be either or combination of both. My early minor success was though hard work then I got a lucky break through the swing scene. The rest was hard work and sacrifice "

Yes, a mix of them both there too

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Either and or both

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By *urtyGentMan
over a year ago

eastleigh

Most successful people are lucky enough to have been born into money. Most, not all before all the “millionaire mindset” and “ I built my business from buttons” brigade start casing me

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By *ummersunshine2019Man
over a year ago

sussex

Success is about achieving individual goals. As we all have different goals will never be the same, which is cool. Be boring if we all wanted to be millionaires... to me success would be one verification a month lol

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

For the vast majority of people to have success it would never happen without hard work in the first place. To move success up another rung takes a certain amount of luck as well. Luck can take all sorts of forms, right place right time, meeting the right person at the right time. Some people can engineer their own luck, by spotting a gap in a market and going for it..............but going for that gap involves risk and hard work. Back to hard work again, without it you would never be in a position to either spot luck or take advantage of it if it came along.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I would say it is a mix of them both."

I would not really disagree with you although it also how you measure success. I probably earn less in real terms than I did 20 years ago but I am more content with life, a success for me

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

An elusive combination of the two, only one of which you are in control of.

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By *ust RachelTV/TS
over a year ago

Horsham

I think it is a bit of both. You definitely need to put in the hard work, but it certainly helps being at the right place at the right time. That's where the luck comes in.

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By *hagTonight OP   Man
over a year ago

From the land of haribos.

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By *rightonsteveMan
over a year ago

Brighton - even Hove!


""
thought you’d gone to Spain?

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By *iaisonseekerMan
over a year ago

Liverpool

Outliers by Malcolm Gladwell is an interesting read on the topic.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Risk & hard work.

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By *ax_uk_2009Man
over a year ago

Wilmslow

I’ve worked hard my whole career and my promotions or pay rises have been due to being in the right time place (or project) at the right time.

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By *aitonelMan
over a year ago

Travelling

Both, and more. Success is never down to just one thing. It takes multiple factors, including these two to make something a sucess.

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By *asques and boxersCouple
over a year ago

Ashford and dept16

Seems to me in the main people seem to believe success is a destination. I prefer to think of it as a path never a destination. Imagine if you remove the word failure and replace it with learning oppertunity. The word success replaced with a path. The journey on the path is your life, along the way there will be achievements often found at points on the path after you stepped off the path and into the fertile fields of learning (formly called Failure).

In short Success is a state of mind not a destination faclitated by on going effort and a willingness to learn what some call success others call achievements what happens if you stopped at your first achievement have you succeeded???

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

There are advantages and disadvantages to being born in one place over the other.

One place has more opportunity so the person can learn and access them easily. On one hand that's a benefit but it also can teach that person to take things for granted and they won't be able to come across challenges very well.

The other place may have very little opportunities, but those who work hard may not only achieve their goals but also build an unbeatable character in the process. So whatever challenges they may face, they will beat them, no matter how tough they are.

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By *iaisonseekerMan
over a year ago

Liverpool

"A man is success if he gets up in the morning, goes to bed at night and, in between, he does what he wants to do."

Bob Dylan

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By *asques and boxersCouple
over a year ago

Ashford and dept16


""A man is success if he gets up in the morning, goes to bed at night and, in between, he does what he wants to do."

Bob Dylan"

Thats a nice quote Once met a very nice bloke who cut watercress. Lived in a employee tied cottage, earned a low income had little in the way of sVings and only a state pension. Was past state rrtirement age and still getting up before dawn 6 days a week to cut the watercress by hand in all weather.

He explained he was able to eat 3 times a day. To have a game of dominoes Saturday afternoon at the pub,to read his Sunday paper over a pint. Best of all to watch the sun rise everyday never one the same all beautful in their own way. He didn't owe any one anything doesn't want anything else.

He was in his word fully content and therefore successful, I couldn't disagree.

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West

My Grandad, although of a totally different generation, can tell me all I need to know about success. Now sadly no longer with us, there can be no person on Earth who I think could be more successful at life than him.

He was born at the very start of the 1930s, to a manual dock labourer and a fairground worker. His mother died when he was 2, leaving a father on a miniscule and very variable wage with 3 children. World War Two then broke out six years after this. My Grandad lived in a type of poverty we now associate with the third world. No proper toilet, no running water, no heating other than a fire in one room, insufficient food and all the rest. To say he came from nothing was an understatement.

He joined the army at the age of 14 in 1946 and was immediately posted to Italy (Trieste) as part of the Army of the Rhine. The smallest uniform was too large; he was underweight and under nourished, though the local Italian ladies remedied that with gifts of pasta. Lasagna remained his favourite food for the rest of his life.

He served for 12 years in total, marrying my Grandmother in the mid 50s and continuing with the Army for a few years.

Upon discharge from the Army, they moved back in with their parents and he took a job in a carpet factory doing night shifts. He saved enough to buy (cash, no mortgage) a run down barn/stable in the Lake District and he, along with family, worked to convert it into the house he remained living in until the last week of his life, a total of 64 years.

His first job in the Lake District was selling brushes door to door. By all accounts, he could have sold snow to the Inuit and sand to the Bedouin. He was very good at selling brushes. He graduated to selling insurance door to door and became the man from the Pru.

He worked his way through the ranks, taking professional exams throughout his 30s and 40s. He had left school without having taken his School Certificate, so didn't have any official qualifications prior to this. He eventually became the principal insurance and investments manager for a local firm.

Outside of his day to day profession, he was a musician. He played every woodwind instrument plus the piano and could turn his hand to brass if necessary. He never pocketed a penny from music, but he founded a band in the 1960s which is still going today, he played in the first ever concert of a semi professional orchestra in the North of England, he taught music at home at the weekend and in local schools, he examined for woodwind instruments, he heard auditions as an expert for two famous Northern music schools, he sat on the panel for a music prize for young people, he gave music talks to luncheon clubs/WI/MU etc up until his mid-80s, he played in the orchestra pit for local AmDram societies and continued to give concerts well into his 80s. Any money he received from music, he donated to charity. Every single penny.

His estate is worth a lot of money (not saying how much), yet it was all saved from hard work and prudent investment. He never earned a huge amount, but he was careful and sensible. Throughout my life, he has given money to the tune of tens of thousands of pounds to my mother to try and help her yet still, he leaves so much financially.

Do you know what makes me say my Grandad was successful? It wasn't his financial standings at death. He couldn't take it with him. It's the fact that even after two weeks of phoning round and emailing, I was still finding more people who knew him, worked with him, played music with him, raised charity funds with him and every single person we've contacted has said they feel his loss as much as we, his family do. If we could have held a proper funeral, the people wanting to attend wouldn't fit in the church. We have plans for an overspill in the parish hall and possibly also a marquee in the vicarage garden when we can hold a proper memorial, such are the numbers. The letters, cards, emails and phone conversations, recounting how he helped and positively influenced the lives of so many people. The sheer sums of money he raised for charity. The fact that I only need to use the shortened form of his first name and everyone knows who I'm referring to.

That's success.

I don't believe in God, but both my Grandparents were committed Christians, they met at a church Christmas coffee morning. He was the epitome of what a Christian would claim to be and if God did exist, my Grandad would have sashayed into heaven, instrument in hand, selling charity raffle tickets and recruiting people to volunteer and do good things.

Success is achieved through hard work. I base my own philosophy of life on my Grandad's example and am so proud that my son is doing the same. And he got the musical genes

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By *iaisonseekerMan
over a year ago

Liverpool


""A man is success if he gets up in the morning, goes to bed at night and, in between, he does what he wants to do."

Bob Dylan

Thats a nice quote Once met a very nice bloke who cut watercress. Lived in a employee tied cottage, earned a low income had little in the way of sVings and only a state pension. Was past state rrtirement age and still getting up before dawn 6 days a week to cut the watercress by hand in all weather.

He explained he was able to eat 3 times a day. To have a game of dominoes Saturday afternoon at the pub,to read his Sunday paper over a pint. Best of all to watch the sun rise everyday never one the same all beautful in their own way. He didn't owe any one anything doesn't want anything else.

He was in his word fully content and therefore successful, I couldn't disagree. "

I like the quote because it's a definition of success that is achievable and enduring. Your story illustrates that perfectly.

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By *stbury DavenportMan
over a year ago

Nottingham

Pure luck. Hard work means jack shit.

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West


"Pure luck. Hard work means jack shit. "

I respectfully disagree, Astbury.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think luck is extremely important, from being in the right place at the right time, knowing the right people, having the right genetics, being in the right family, having the right friends, so many things are not relevant to hard work... hard work matters, but some of the hardest workers in the world live in poverty in slums across the world

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

A small number of people benefit from pure luck such as winning the lottery but for most opportunity is more important, and the harder you work and put yourself in positive situations, the more likely good opportunities are to arise for you to take.

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By *rHotNottsMan
over a year ago

Dubai & Nottingham


"I watched coach gregs latest video about it https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cNuMlYLF-yQ

and it was interesting, as he gave few examples on it like circumstances determines it also, like someone can study as hard as someone else, but if they lived in a poor country they wouldnt have the same privelages to be what they wanted to be from their studies."

For me it’s been a mix of patience and persistence and risk taking . Luck is just another name for opportunity , you find it when you own your eyes. If you believe privilege is needed for success you will never be successful as you’re already defeated yourselves with a fixed mindset

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By *rHotNottsMan
over a year ago

Dubai & Nottingham


"A small number of people benefit from pure luck such as winning the lottery but for most opportunity is more important, and the harder you work and put yourself in positive situations, the more likely good opportunities are to arise for you to take."

I wouldn’t class winning a lottery as success, personally I’d hate to be given a huge sum of money , much more exciting to create it. People I’ve know win or inherit large sums are often very unhappy within 2-3 years and often skint within 10

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By * Sophie xTV/TS
over a year ago

Derby

Never forget that to get some of the things you want you need to be prepared to step on people who deserve better and treat people like arseholes, this world is full of a lot of people like that and they're often hard to avoid.

Things can and often do need a bit of luck and a lot of hard work if it's something you're aiming to achieve yourself without stepping on people along the way.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"A small number of people benefit from pure luck such as winning the lottery but for most opportunity is more important, and the harder you work and put yourself in positive situations, the more likely good opportunities are to arise for you to take.

I wouldn’t class winning a lottery as success, personally I’d hate to be given a huge sum of money , much more exciting to create it. People I’ve know win or inherit large sums are often very unhappy within 2-3 years and often skint within 10"

That is true. Many people fantasie about being rich but can’t handle the reality while many people who become rich are actually more motivated by success and achievement rather than money alone.

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By *ang bang bangity bangCouple
over a year ago

Sunderland

I think an element that is often overlooked is people's inability to see or act on "luck". Over the years I've seen numerous people put in the work but complain they don't get the lucky breaks but I've often seen those same people have opportunities put on a platter in front of them and they are either blind to it or in many cases dont act on it because they have placed limitations on themselves.

Conversely I've seen some amazing people who can really make a silk purse out of a sows ear. Give them the slightest glimmer of a chance and they grasp it. But people would say they're lucky.

And then I've also seen some people coast through life on sheer luck and be wildly successful

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By *rHotNottsMan
over a year ago

Dubai & Nottingham


"

And then I've also seen some people coast through life on sheer luck and be wildly successful "

It can look like that but usually isn’t. My daughter says I’m lucky to have my mentor, as well as advice he puts me in touch with investors and C levels. But for 20 + years I’ve nurtured that relationship because I realised how valuable and critical it was, there’s no luck there just effort and sacrifice

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think it is a mix of both, hard work and motivation coupled with luck

On paper my boy shouldn't of succeeded, growing up in a rural area classed as 'in need' went to local state school and college. Decided to go to a University 250 mile away because it is the best in Europe for his discipline.

He worked hard and got noticed. On leaving Uni he got the first job he applied for in Edinburgh. he had already been on their radar because of stuff he did at University....He now works for one of the most prestigious names in his field, Part luck but he worked his arse off to get there.

Nothing comes to you if you don't have determination, motivation to make it happen.

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By *on-snowedMan
over a year ago

harlow

Personally think "luck" is fictional

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By *hagTonight OP   Man
over a year ago

From the land of haribos.

Interesting points everyone

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By *asques and boxersCouple
over a year ago

Ashford and dept16


"My Grandad, although of a totally different generation, can tell me all I need to know about success. Now sadly no longer with us, there can be no person on Earth who I think could be more successful at life than him.

He was born at the very start of the 1930s, to a manual dock labourer and a fairground worker. His mother died when he was 2, leaving a father on a miniscule and very variable wage with 3 children. World War Two then broke out six years after this. My Grandad lived in a type of poverty we now associate with the third world. No proper toilet, no running water, no heating other than a fire in one room, insufficient food and all the rest. To say he came from nothing was an understatement.

He joined the army at the age of 14 in 1946 and was immediately posted to Italy (Trieste) as part of the Army of the Rhine. The smallest uniform was too large; he was underweight and under nourished, though the local Italian ladies remedied that with gifts of pasta. Lasagna remained his favourite food for the rest of his life.

He served for 12 years in total, marrying my Grandmother in the mid 50s and continuing with the Army for a few years.

Upon discharge from the Army, they moved back in with their parents and he took a job in a carpet factory doing night shifts. He saved enough to buy (cash, no mortgage) a run down barn/stable in the Lake District and he, along with family, worked to convert it into the house he remained living in until the last week of his life, a total of 64 years.

His first job in the Lake District was selling brushes door to door. By all accounts, he could have sold snow to the Inuit and sand to the Bedouin. He was very good at selling brushes. He graduated to selling insurance door to door and became the man from the Pru.

He worked his way through the ranks, taking professional exams throughout his 30s and 40s. He had left school without having taken his School Certificate, so didn't have any official qualifications prior to this. He eventually became the principal insurance and investments manager for a local firm.

Outside of his day to day profession, he was a musician. He played every woodwind instrument plus the piano and could turn his hand to brass if necessary. He never pocketed a penny from music, but he founded a band in the 1960s which is still going today, he played in the first ever concert of a semi professional orchestra in the North of England, he taught music at home at the weekend and in local schools, he examined for woodwind instruments, he heard auditions as an expert for two famous Northern music schools, he sat on the panel for a music prize for young people, he gave music talks to luncheon clubs/WI/MU etc up until his mid-80s, he played in the orchestra pit for local AmDram societies and continued to give concerts well into his 80s. Any money he received from music, he donated to charity. Every single penny.

His estate is worth a lot of money (not saying how much), yet it was all saved from hard work and prudent investment. He never earned a huge amount, but he was careful and sensible. Throughout my life, he has given money to the tune of tens of thousands of pounds to my mother to try and help her yet still, he leaves so much financially.

Do you know what makes me say my Grandad was successful? It wasn't his financial standings at death. He couldn't take it with him. It's the fact that even after two weeks of phoning round and emailing, I was still finding more people who knew him, worked with him, played music with him, raised charity funds with him and every single person we've contacted has said they feel his loss as much as we, his family do. If we could have held a proper funeral, the people wanting to attend wouldn't fit in the church. We have plans for an overspill in the parish hall and possibly also a marquee in the vicarage garden when we can hold a proper memorial, such are the numbers. The letters, cards, emails and phone conversations, recounting how he helped and positively influenced the lives of so many people. The sheer sums of money he raised for charity. The fact that I only need to use the shortened form of his first name and everyone knows who I'm referring to.

That's success.

I don't believe in God, but both my Grandparents were committed Christians, they met at a church Christmas coffee morning. He was the epitome of what a Christian would claim to be and if God did exist, my Grandad would have sashayed into heaven, instrument in hand, selling charity raffle tickets and recruiting people to volunteer and do good things.

Success is achieved through hard work. I base my own philosophy of life on my Grandad's example and am so proud that my son is doing the same. And he got the musical genes "

The very best success you could of sort for and so much more than financial dounds a true giant amoungst human kind.

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By *xhib12Man
over a year ago

Blyth

Personally for me it was hard work and taking chances when they came my way.

I didn't like school and left with very few qualifications. I didn't let it hold me back though and managed to get myself a short engineering course which led to my first job. Didn't particularly settle as I wanted to travel so found a way to get another job working on ships. Got made redundant a few years later but a chance meeting with an old shipmate opened a door into the offshore industry. A good few years later a chance to retrain came along so I took it and moved into a role I never imagined. I did well and was headhunted for a much more senior role by one of the big oil companies.

All of that is behind me now and I'm looking at a comfortable retirement with a property portfolio, a nice home, holidays, nice cars and knowing that my kids are comfortably set too.

Not bad for a kid who left school with very little.

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By *ranny-CrumpetWoman
over a year ago

The Town by The Cross

Success = subjective.

Especially this day and age. Everyone is an author a singer a business person yada yada yada and they are ALL successful according to THEMSELVES.

They need that hype to keep bringing in the money or to keep boosting their ego.

Success requires... ( some of not all of these below )

1. The belief that you are successful.

1a. The ability to remain self deluded.

2. The instilling of belief 1 in others.

3. A privileged birth re wealth and connections

4. A sense of entitlement brought - about by number 3 usually.

5. At least average intelligence

6. Self belief.

7. Hard Work.

8. Determination

9. Connections

10.Talent

Luck plays a large part in success. Right place , right time .......

You can work your fucking socks off and get nowhere. But it's MORE than just choosing between LUCK or HARD WORK or just trying to marry the two.

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By *ranny-CrumpetWoman
over a year ago

The Town by The Cross


"Personally think "luck" is fictional "

It is.

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By *ranny-CrumpetWoman
over a year ago

The Town by The Cross


"Both plus a ruthless Streak.

You don't become very successful unless you are willing to be a bit of a cunt .

Do you think that is always true? I think in some cases but I know a handful of successful folks who are also the nicest of people.

I'm also of the opinion that the definition of success is very personal and can be something remarkably humble to something outrageously grandiose.... Mine is getting a reply to an email this year. "

I really do appreciate that success means different things to different people. I am sure the Dali Lama doesn't count his success in the same way as sayyyyyyyy Kim Kardashian.

It's possible to feel successful on a small scale. e.g. I rustled up a tast dinner from almost zilch ...... success !

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By *ackformore100Man
over a year ago

Tin town


"Personally think "luck" is fictional

It is.

"

What would you call it when a golf ball bounces sideways on a fairway? When your competitors bounces straight forward... Or in seve ballesteros case... Hit it straight into the trees and it bounces out centre fairway? Or when a rugby ball bounces straight into the arms of a winger and not into touch?

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By *ranny-CrumpetWoman
over a year ago

The Town by The Cross


"Personally think "luck" is fictional

It is.

What would you call it when a golf ball bounces sideways on a fairway? When your competitors bounces straight forward... Or in seve ballesteros case... Hit it straight into the trees and it bounces out centre fairway? Or when a rugby ball bounces straight into the arms of a winger and not into touch? "

Science

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By *wisted999Man
over a year ago

North Bucks

Up till my teens life was shit, through grit and determination I managed to get to the UK and then through hard work and study I made something of myself I still don’t stop today and am studying for my next move.

My Uk family have a lot of money but none of that helped me get where I am professionally I had to do that on my own.

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By *ranny-CrumpetWoman
over a year ago

The Town by The Cross


"Up till my teens life was shit, through grit and determination I managed to get to the UK and then through hard work and study I made something of myself I still don’t stop today and am studying for my next move.

My Uk family have a lot of money but none of that helped me get where I am professionally I had to do that on my own. "

That sounds so familiar to me. You are not coming round for sex and lunch at 12 are you ?

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By *ackformore100Man
over a year ago

Tin town


"Personally think "luck" is fictional

It is.

What would you call it when a golf ball bounces sideways on a fairway? When your competitors bounces straight forward... Or in seve ballesteros case... Hit it straight into the trees and it bounces out centre fairway? Or when a rugby ball bounces straight into the arms of a winger and not into touch?

Science"

Best add ability to manipulate science to your list of items then!

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By *wisted999Man
over a year ago

North Bucks


"Up till my teens life was shit, through grit and determination I managed to get to the UK and then through hard work and study I made something of myself I still don’t stop today and am studying for my next move.

My Uk family have a lot of money but none of that helped me get where I am professionally I had to do that on my own.

That sounds so familiar to me. You are not coming round for sex and lunch at 12 are you ? "

Yes what’s for lunch?

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By *ranny-CrumpetWoman
over a year ago

The Town by The Cross


"Personally think "luck" is fictional

It is.

What would you call it when a golf ball bounces sideways on a fairway? When your competitors bounces straight forward... Or in seve ballesteros case... Hit it straight into the trees and it bounces out centre fairway? Or when a rugby ball bounces straight into the arms of a winger and not into touch?

Science

Best add ability to manipulate science to your list of items then! "

Those were not incidences of manipulation

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By *ranny-CrumpetWoman
over a year ago

The Town by The Cross


"Up till my teens life was shit, through grit and determination I managed to get to the UK and then through hard work and study I made something of myself I still don’t stop today and am studying for my next move.

My Uk family have a lot of money but none of that helped me get where I am professionally I had to do that on my own.

That sounds so familiar to me. You are not coming round for sex and lunch at 12 are you ?

Yes what’s for lunch? "

There's always a choice. It'd be really funny if it was you.

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By *on-snowedMan
over a year ago

harlow


"Personally think "luck" is fictional

It is.

What would you call it when a golf ball bounces sideways on a fairway? When your competitors bounces straight forward... Or in seve ballesteros case... Hit it straight into the trees and it bounces out centre fairway? Or when a rugby ball bounces straight into the arms of a winger and not into touch? "

Are we lucky because we ate today?

Are we lucky our children don't have cancer?

Point is there are to many variables, were all lucky if we put things into perspective.

Unlucky because we don't have more money than someone who won the lottery?

Lucky in millions of other ways.

Impossible for it to work.

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By *ackformore100Man
over a year ago

Tin town


"Personally think "luck" is fictional

It is.

What would you call it when a golf ball bounces sideways on a fairway? When your competitors bounces straight forward... Or in seve ballesteros case... Hit it straight into the trees and it bounces out centre fairway? Or when a rugby ball bounces straight into the arms of a winger and not into touch?

Science

Best add ability to manipulate science to your list of items then!

Those were not incidences of manipulation"

I understand so what determines that seves ball hits the tree and pops on the fairway and Paul azingers hits the same tree and disappears forever? I'm only using golf as an example there are heaps of others... What has seve received that zinger didn't?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Both plus a ruthless Streak.

You don't become very successful unless you are willing to be a bit of a cunt ."

Totally disagree.

Mr

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By *hilloutMan
over a year ago

All over the place! Northwesr, , Southwest

It depends.

On scenarios that depend entirely on you, hard work of course.

As an example; Shag, that amazing physique is 100% due to effort and hard work. No luck involved.

Most things in life do depend on a multitude of factors though, many of which are beyond our control and here luck can play a role as much as hard work.

Examples such as athletes, actors and even politicians come to mind. There are many brilliant and astounding examples of these that never made it big; not because they weren't talented, but perhaps they were not in the right place at the right time to be noticed by those who yeild influence to set them on a path to greatness.

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By *hilloutMan
over a year ago

All over the place! Northwesr, , Southwest


"It depends.

On scenarios that depend entirely on you, hard work of course.

As an example; Shag, that amazing physique is 100% due to effort and hard work. No luck involved.

Most things in life do depend on a multitude of factors though, many of which are beyond our control and here luck can play a role as much as hard work.

Examples such as athletes, actors and even politicians come to mind. There are many brilliant and astounding examples of these that never made it big; not because they weren't talented, but perhaps they were not in the right place at the right time to be noticed by those who yeild influence to set them on a path to greatness."

Weild I meant

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

To answer the OP, I think hardworking is a pretty important ingredient but it only pays off if you have the luck to be born in the right situation. All the hard work in the world isn't gong to help much if you're born in a South American slum for example. To get out of those situations requires luck - someone to notice you for what you are, not what you represent. The world is full of people living in grinding poverty yet who work ridiculously hard. It seems highly unlikely that hard work will give you more success in the UK say than the Sudan without recognising that the social, geographic and political arena an individual is born into play a significant part. This country itself has millions of workers slaving away on ridiculous wages, often working several jobs, getting up in the early hours and not stopping till late in the evening yet very few would call them successful. On top of that simple things like looks, gender, height all make a difference.

You also require a certain personality type, the confidence to take risks and responsibility. I'm not talking just about mortgaging your house to fund a start up but the little everyday risks. Being prepared to make a decision without asking someone else, getting those decisions mostly right but owning your mistakes when you don't. There are lots of people who don't do this and there will always be a natural ceiling for them as they need people above them to feel secure. Some organisations have enough layers that such people can work their way to a reasonable position by being good at their job and being a safe pair of hands but I don't believe they can ever be truly successful in an entrepreneurial way.

Sadly, we are all victims of the self attribution bias, we always give ourselves more credit for our success and less responsibility for our failures. There are many interesting experiments around this. People playing games that are purely based on luck will say it is their ability that has helped them win. They take credit for winning games where they succeed because their opponents are given an unknown handicap- and continue to insist it was at least partly due to their skills even when they are told about the handicap. We see the same in society today where many insist that they don't have privilege, the playing field always looks more level when you're looking down on it from a great height.

Mr

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By *ocbigMan
over a year ago

Birmingham


"Outliers by Malcolm Gladwell is an interesting read on the topic."

Hmmm Gladwell, him who took the 10,000 hours theory, misunderstood or misrepresented it & made money off it. Right place right time for him..

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By *ackformore100Man
over a year ago

Tin town

It really depends on one's definition of success.... The lady who works nights at one stop and days at boots to provide for her 3 lovely kids might reflect back at what an amazing job she's done and how successful she has been... And would be quite right to as well.

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By *ocbigMan
over a year ago

Birmingham


"I think it is a mix of both, hard work and motivation coupled with luck

On paper my boy shouldn't of succeeded, growing up in a rural area classed as 'in need' went to local state school and college. Decided to go to a University 250 mile away because it is the best in Europe for his discipline.

He worked hard and got noticed. On leaving Uni he got the first job he applied for in Edinburgh. he had already been on their radar because of stuff he did at University....He now works for one of the most prestigious names in his field, Part luck but he worked his arse off to get there.

Nothing comes to you if you don't have determination, motivation to make it happen.

"

...then you are a success too, you gave him that mindset. Well done both of you.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

That saying it’s not what you know but who you know

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By *ealthy_and_HungMan
over a year ago

Princes Risborough, Luasanne, Alderney

my successes have been due to pure luck. the continuation of those successes have been by hard graft. i measure none of my success by money but by personal achievement and cultural value to the wider world.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

100% hard work. Everyone who’s ever worked hard has been successful. That’s just one of the basics.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

50/50

I think you need both, but also more of one than the other.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I think it is a mix of both, hard work and motivation coupled with luck

On paper my boy shouldn't of succeeded, growing up in a rural area classed as 'in need' went to local state school and college. Decided to go to a University 250 mile away because it is the best in Europe for his discipline.

He worked hard and got noticed. On leaving Uni he got the first job he applied for in Edinburgh. he had already been on their radar because of stuff he did at University....He now works for one of the most prestigious names in his field, Part luck but he worked his arse off to get there.

Nothing comes to you if you don't have determination, motivation to make it happen.

...then you are a success too, you gave him that mindset. Well done both of you.

"

I have instilled a work ethic and he has watched me succeed in my career from working hard. But tbh I never pushed him, I was always telling him to slow it down tbh, but he has his own drive and determination

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By *ourNextAddictionMan
over a year ago

Somerset

Hard work & luck.

Let’s just say teachers wouldn’t of put me in the position I am. I’ve somehow always had the perfect hand when cards have been turned.

Luck (timing) - hard work - years sacrificed to get to the stage I’m at. Now I’m the youngest out of anyone at my level, it was worth it.

Friendships ruined whilst I was building, time is limited.

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By *iaisonseekerMan
over a year ago

Liverpool

Fully agree with those citing luck and someone to give you an opportunity

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By *ealthy_and_HungMan
over a year ago

Princes Risborough, Luasanne, Alderney

everybody gets given opportunities, sometimes without even realising. the trick is knowing to take them.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

Luck is necessary. A lot of luck. Without luck it isn't possible.

Work comes into it, for sure, but those without the luck don't even get a foothold.

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By *inky_couple2020Couple
over a year ago

North West


"Luck is necessary. A lot of luck. Without luck it isn't possible.

Work comes into it, for sure, but those without the luck don't even get a foothold."

I'd respectfully disagree on that, Swing

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By *rHotNottsMan
over a year ago

Dubai & Nottingham


"To answer the OP, I think hardworking is a pretty important ingredient but it only pays off if you have the luck to be born in the right situation. All the hard work in the world isn't gong to help much if you're born in a South American slum for example. To get out of those situations requires luck - someone to notice you for what you are, not what you represent. The world is full of people living in grinding poverty yet who work ridiculously hard. It seems highly unlikely that hard work will give you more success in the UK say than the Sudan without recognising that the social, geographic and political arena an individual is born into play a significant part. This country itself has millions of workers slaving away on ridiculous wages, often working several jobs, getting up in the early hours and not stopping till late in the evening yet very few would call them successful. On top of that simple things like looks, gender, height all make a difference.

You also require a certain personality type, the confidence to take risks and responsibility. I'm not talking just about mortgaging your house to fund a start up but the little everyday risks. Being prepared to make a decision without asking someone else, getting those decisions mostly right but owning your mistakes when you don't. There are lots of people who don't do this and there will always be a natural ceiling for them as they need people above them to feel secure. Some organisations have enough layers that such people can work their way to a reasonable position by being good at their job and being a safe pair of hands but I don't believe they can ever be truly successful in an entrepreneurial way.

Sadly, we are all victims of the self attribution bias, we always give ourselves more credit for our success and less responsibility for our failures. There are many interesting experiments around this. People playing games that are purely based on luck will say it is their ability that has helped them win. They take credit for winning games where they succeed because their opponents are given an unknown handicap- and continue to insist it was at least partly due to their skills even when they are told about the handicap. We see the same in society today where many insist that they don't have privilege, the playing field always looks more level when you're looking down on it from a great height.

Mr"

You are right about opportunities and poverty in other countries but that doesn’t apply here in the UK we have free education to at least masters level and free health and most people can access them both without issues

Risk and responsibility is also a good point. Making decisions is what makes you good at it, it’s how you develop wisdom. Unsuccessful people avoid risks and making tough decisions so never get wise.

The last point I call the mirror and the window. When things go bad unsuccessful people look out the window for answers, successful people look at themselves in the mirror.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"Luck is necessary. A lot of luck. Without luck it isn't possible.

Work comes into it, for sure, but those without the luck don't even get a foothold.

I'd respectfully disagree on that, Swing "

Fair. To each their own.

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By *orthern StarsCouple
over a year ago

Durham

Lots of hard work with a little bit of good luck.

You can work extremely hard but things happen that are totally beyond your control, and can have devastating impacts, so it helps if lady luck is on your side in life.

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By *rHotNottsMan
over a year ago

Dubai & Nottingham

If you think you need “luck “‘ you are really just refusing to take responsibility.

Do you think crossing your fingers or touching wood when you make an investment helps? That’s what luck is, it’s not science or effort or sacrifice but four leaf clovers and avoiding number 13

If you believe in that stuff it explains maybe why your are not successful

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"If you think you need “luck “‘ you are really just refusing to take responsibility.

Do you think crossing your fingers or touching wood when you make an investment helps? That’s what luck is, it’s not science or effort or sacrifice but four leaf clovers and avoiding number 13

If you believe in that stuff it explains maybe why your are not successful "

So the opposite would be unlucky/misfortune. All of the businesses going under through covid for example. Contingency plans may have been in place, but may not have allowed for this length of time.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"If you think you need “luck “‘ you are really just refusing to take responsibility.

Do you think crossing your fingers or touching wood when you make an investment helps? That’s what luck is, it’s not science or effort or sacrifice but four leaf clovers and avoiding number 13

If you believe in that stuff it explains maybe why your are not successful "

Circumstances entirely outside your control that have been set before you were born can throw off everyone or almost everyone.

My family. One generation: working class kids went to university, because it was within their grasp.

Next generation: the remaining working class families, none of their kids did. University was not within their grasp. (It might have been possible but it was significantly more difficult than it would have been for their parents)

For example

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"If you think you need “luck “‘ you are really just refusing to take responsibility.

Do you think crossing your fingers or touching wood when you make an investment helps? That’s what luck is, it’s not science or effort or sacrifice but four leaf clovers and avoiding number 13

If you believe in that stuff it explains maybe why your are not successful

So the opposite would be unlucky/misfortune. All of the businesses going under through covid for example. Contingency plans may have been in place, but may not have allowed for this length of time. "

Yes. Luck and responsibility are not mutually exclusive.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Very much depends how you define success, to me success is an abstract concept that can’t be measured or quantified, is it a feeling or an emotion, or is it material, but what is material. I don’t think anyone can say what success is, but whether it’s by luck or by design it’s impossible to say what it is, but if one things for certain is that one man’s success is another man’s failure and vice versa.

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By *olly_chromaticTV/TS
over a year ago

Stockport


"My Grandad, although of a totally different generation, can tell me all I need to know about success. Now sadly no longer with us, there can be no person on Earth who I think could be more successful at life than him.

He was born at the very start of the 1930s, to a manual dock labourer and a fairground worker. His mother died when he was 2, leaving a father on a miniscule and very variable wage with 3 children. World War Two then broke out six years after this. My Grandad lived in a type of poverty we now associate with the third world. No proper toilet, no running water, no heating other than a fire in one room, insufficient food and all the rest. To say he came from nothing was an understatement.

He joined the army at the age of 14 in 1946 and was immediately posted to Italy (Trieste) as part of the Army of the Rhine. The smallest uniform was too large; he was underweight and under nourished, though the local Italian ladies remedied that with gifts of pasta. Lasagna remained his favourite food for the rest of his life.

He served for 12 years in total, marrying my Grandmother in the mid 50s and continuing with the Army for a few years.

Upon discharge from the Army, they moved back in with their parents and he took a job in a carpet factory doing night shifts. He saved enough to buy (cash, no mortgage) a run down barn/stable in the Lake District and he, along with family, worked to convert it into the house he remained living in until the last week of his life, a total of 64 years.

His first job in the Lake District was selling brushes door to door. By all accounts, he could have sold snow to the Inuit and sand to the Bedouin. He was very good at selling brushes. He graduated to selling insurance door to door and became the man from the Pru.

He worked his way through the ranks, taking professional exams throughout his 30s and 40s. He had left school without having taken his School Certificate, so didn't have any official qualifications prior to this. He eventually became the principal insurance and investments manager for a local firm.

Outside of his day to day profession, he was a musician. He played every woodwind instrument plus the piano and could turn his hand to brass if necessary. He never pocketed a penny from music, but he founded a band in the 1960s which is still going today, he played in the first ever concert of a semi professional orchestra in the North of England, he taught music at home at the weekend and in local schools, he examined for woodwind instruments, he heard auditions as an expert for two famous Northern music schools, he sat on the panel for a music prize for young people, he gave music talks to luncheon clubs/WI/MU etc up until his mid-80s, he played in the orchestra pit for local AmDram societies and continued to give concerts well into his 80s. Any money he received from music, he donated to charity. Every single penny.

His estate is worth a lot of money (not saying how much), yet it was all saved from hard work and prudent investment. He never earned a huge amount, but he was careful and sensible. Throughout my life, he has given money to the tune of tens of thousands of pounds to my mother to try and help her yet still, he leaves so much financially.

Do you know what makes me say my Grandad was successful? It wasn't his financial standings at death. He couldn't take it with him. It's the fact that even after two weeks of phoning round and emailing, I was still finding more people who knew him, worked with him, played music with him, raised charity funds with him and every single person we've contacted has said they feel his loss as much as we, his family do. If we could have held a proper funeral, the people wanting to attend wouldn't fit in the church. We have plans for an overspill in the parish hall and possibly also a marquee in the vicarage garden when we can hold a proper memorial, such are the numbers. The letters, cards, emails and phone conversations, recounting how he helped and positively influenced the lives of so many people. The sheer sums of money he raised for charity. The fact that I only need to use the shortened form of his first name and everyone knows who I'm referring to.

That's success.

I don't believe in God, but both my Grandparents were committed Christians, they met at a church Christmas coffee morning. He was the epitome of what a Christian would claim to be and if God did exist, my Grandad would have sashayed into heaven, instrument in hand, selling charity raffle tickets and recruiting people to volunteer and do good things.

Success is achieved through hard work. I base my own philosophy of life on my Grandad's example and am so proud that my son is doing the same. And he got the musical genes "

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By *iaisonseekerMan
over a year ago

Liverpool


"If you think you need “luck “‘ you are really just refusing to take responsibility.

Do you think crossing your fingers or touching wood when you make an investment helps? That’s what luck is, it’s not science or effort or sacrifice but four leaf clovers and avoiding number 13

If you believe in that stuff it explains maybe why your are not successful "

Isn't this superstition rather than luck?

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By *ove2pleaseseukMan
over a year ago

Hastings

Both you need hard work but a good chunk of luck and timeing

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By *iaisonseekerMan
over a year ago

Liverpool


"If you think you need “luck “‘ you are really just refusing to take responsibility.

Do you think crossing your fingers or touching wood when you make an investment helps? That’s what luck is, it’s not science or effort or sacrifice but four leaf clovers and avoiding number 13

If you believe in that stuff it explains maybe why your are not successful

Circumstances entirely outside your control that have been set before you were born can throw off everyone or almost everyone.

My family. One generation: working class kids went to university, because it was within their grasp.

Next generation: the remaining working class families, none of their kids did. University was not within their grasp. (It might have been possible but it was significantly more difficult than it would have been for their parents)

For example"

We are all to some extent prisoners of our time and circumstance. To give another example, would Maradona have have risen from slums of Buenos Aires to be the most revered person in Argentina without the existence of professional football and the mass media that catapulted him to fame?

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By *olly_chromaticTV/TS
over a year ago

Stockport

I would say that there is firstly luck to have been born in the right circumstances for there to be any possibility of success, and then there is your own efforts to achieve the success from those circumstances.

At the furthest of one extreme, there are those that are born into such awful circumstances that it is utterly impossible for them to ever reach even the first step towards success. The children of sl@ves have short and brutal lives as sl@ves. No amount of hard work can dig them out of sl@very, it takes everything they can give to just stay alive. Only if they are supremely lucky, outside circumstances might help them break free.

The furthest opposite extreme is those born into such utter wealth that it is impossible for them to ever fail, even if they do nothing, or even if they positively bollocks up their life. Donald Trump got to be president of the united states not because of any hard work, but because he was born into a fortune beyond the dreams of all but a handful in the world. Trumps "hard work" actually lost him more money than if he had just done jack shit all his life, he still has more than a normal person would need for a hundred lifetimes of luxury. However IMHO he is a totally abysmal excuse for a human being who has used all his opportunity to just make the world a worse place.

In between we have those that are born into varying degrees of privilege, give varying degrees of hard work and dedication, have varying levels of selfishness or caring for others, and achieve varying levels of success - that they measure in different ways.

I find that the most wonderful contrast to oxygen wasters like Donald Trump is the stories of those such as Mrs KC's grandad. Born into marginal, but still possible, circumstances - that's luck, but only because it could have been so much worse. Then through hard work and determinism (and yes possibly some moments of "luck" along the way, but mainly only the "luck" that they have built for themselves), managed to build upon those marginal circumstances for the benefit of their family. But have done it without trampling others, have been in every way good examples of humanity. People that leave the world a better place for their existence. People that do not measure success just by a bank balance or by the number of arselickers that are attracted by that money.

For me, personal success is having enough that I'm not hungry, cold or scared in the dark. Success as a human being will be if when I die, the world on balance has been at least marginally improved by my presence in it for a little while.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"If you think you need “luck “‘ you are really just refusing to take responsibility.

Do you think crossing your fingers or touching wood when you make an investment helps? That’s what luck is, it’s not science or effort or sacrifice but four leaf clovers and avoiding number 13

If you believe in that stuff it explains maybe why your are not successful

Circumstances entirely outside your control that have been set before you were born can throw off everyone or almost everyone.

My family. One generation: working class kids went to university, because it was within their grasp.

Next generation: the remaining working class families, none of their kids did. University was not within their grasp. (It might have been possible but it was significantly more difficult than it would have been for their parents)

For example

We are all to some extent prisoners of our time and circumstance. To give another example, would Maradona have have risen from slums of Buenos Aires to be the most revered person in Argentina without the existence of professional football and the mass media that catapulted him to fame?"

Yes. And that's the luck I meant. Without the circumstances you're born into, or shit thrust onto you through no fault of your own, your life might be incredibly different. From that starting point, whatever it is, it's mostly work and partly luck. But without that luck... nope.

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By *..FirstMan
over a year ago

london

I like the quote “Luck is where preparation and opportunity intersect.”

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By *orthernswingerMan
over a year ago

Carlisle

A blend of intelligence, luck and hard work is a good combination. Usually the harder you work the luckier you become.

From a lifetime a working in large corporations, playing the game is one of the key components to success, toadying up to the right people, exaggerating your wins, keeping your mouth shut, befriending your boss etc etc etc

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By *rHotNottsMan
over a year ago

Dubai & Nottingham

[Removed by poster at 27/02/21 13:12:15]

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By *rHotNottsMan
over a year ago

Dubai & Nottingham

“One secret of success in life is be ready for the opportunity when it arrives” Disraeli

So many people pass it by then they don’t get another chance. I like the story of how woody Allen used a job as a joke writer for a film set, pushed for more pay was refused but then instead negotiated a small on camera shot, then grew the role once in and became famous. His opportunity was being spotted telling jokes in a bar and asked to write some for a film , but it wasn’t luck that made him famous , it was dieting the opportunity, negotiation skills and tactics

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