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Police by Consent

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By *ssex_tom OP   Man
over a year ago

Chelmsford

Our Policing model is apparently Policing by Consent...

Stop and Search is pissing off some communities...

Is this policing by consent...

Not sure but it's not working....

 (thread closed by moderator)

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By *ackformore100Man
over a year ago

Tin town


"Our Policing model is apparently Policing by Consent...

Stop and Search is pissing off some communities...

Is this policing by consent...

Not sure but it's not working...."

Trouble with that expression... Which imo means next to nothing... Is it provides just the excuse the police need to stand a watch crimes taking place and for the minority rulers to exercise disproportionate influence over the law abiding majority. It may just be me, but I see the police in the last 9 months becoming less and less visible and effective.

That said, the police can not and never have been able to police effective when the general public don't want them to and dont follow societal norms. The issue with "consent" is it is non sensically vague.... Consent of what, when, consent of whom? I mean I don't give the midnight ravers my consent to keep me awake and be antisocial...so why don't the police operate to my consent? But my consent is less important than the ones who choose to break our laws.

The whole concept is nonsense.

As for stop and search... Whose consent are they after? The suspected knife carrier or the potential victim? Or would we rather the police did nothing?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

A friend once told me, that when a person is arrested, and the desk sgt reads your rights, he will then ask, do you understand?

This apparently is legalese for, do you stand under my authority. So in theory, if you say no, they have no authority over you..

But I'm sure that wouldn't work in the real world.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"A friend once told me, that when a person is arrested, and the desk sgt reads your rights, he will then ask, do you understand?

This apparently is legalese for, do you stand under my authority. So in theory, if you say no, they have no authority over you..

But I'm sure that wouldn't work in the real world. "

Trust me ... that's bollocks

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By *agneto.Man
over a year ago

Bham

No thanks officer, I don't consent to being arrested today.

Ok bye then. Have a nice day.

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By *r.HMan
over a year ago

A gentleman never tells

In the words of NWA: Fuck The Police

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"In the words of NWA: Fuck The Police "

Yeah. Till your 4 year old neighbour goes missing ... nah you are alright officer we don't want her looked for.

Or till your brother is stabbed and the nearest ambulance is 30 minutes away. We don't want your CPR officer.

Yeah fuck the police

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By *ulfilthmentMan
over a year ago

Just around the corner


"A friend once told me, that when a person is arrested, and the desk sgt reads your rights, he will then ask, do you understand?

This apparently is legalese for, do you stand under my authority. So in theory, if you say no, they have no authority over you..

But I'm sure that wouldn't work in the real world. "

What a load of ‘sovereign citizen’ bollocks. He’s asking if he needs tot the duty solicitor to explain how much trouble you’re in i words of one syllable.

 (thread closed by moderator)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"A friend once told me, that when a person is arrested, and the desk sgt reads your rights, he will then ask, do you understand?

This apparently is legalese for, do you stand under my authority. So in theory, if you say no, they have no authority over you..

But I'm sure that wouldn't work in the real world.

Trust me ... that's bollocks "

I shall take heed, if ever I find myself in a not good kind of sticky situation

 (thread closed by moderator)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"A friend once told me, that when a person is arrested, and the desk sgt reads your rights, he will then ask, do you understand?

This apparently is legalese for, do you stand under my authority. So in theory, if you say no, they have no authority over you..

But I'm sure that wouldn't work in the real world.

What a load of ‘sovereign citizen’ bollocks. He’s asking if he needs tot the duty solicitor to explain how much trouble you’re in i words of one syllable."

I didn't say I agreed with what said friend had tried to tell me, I'm sure I did use the word apparently before stating what was said. Even after that, said even if this was the case, would not work in the real world.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"A friend once told me, that when a person is arrested, and the desk sgt reads your rights, he will then ask, do you understand?

This apparently is legalese for, do you stand under my authority. So in theory, if you say no, they have no authority over you..

But I'm sure that wouldn't work in the real world.

What a load of ‘sovereign citizen’ bollocks. He’s asking if he needs tot the duty solicitor to explain how much trouble you’re in i words of one syllable."

Yeah sovereign citizens get pretty short shrift when they try this stuff.

Real explanations as to the meaning and purposes of legalese are available.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"In the words of NWA: Fuck The Police

Yeah. Till your 4 year old neighbour goes missing ... nah you are alright officer we don't want her looked for.

Or till your brother is stabbed and the nearest ambulance is 30 minutes away. We don't want your CPR officer.

Yeah fuck the police "

 (thread closed by moderator)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"No thanks officer, I don't consent to being arrested today.

Ok bye then. Have a nice day. "

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"In the words of NWA: Fuck The Police

Yeah. Till your 4 year old neighbour goes missing ... nah you are alright officer we don't want her looked for.

Or till your brother is stabbed and the nearest ambulance is 30 minutes away. We don't want your CPR officer.

Yeah fuck the police "

I don't like going to work some days, but I need the money to pay for stuff I enjoy and to take care of my girl so I do.... Some ppl have better jobs than me that pay better and better houses and prettier girlfriends and get more sex, but I still go to work and follow the system and contribute without feeling butt hurt, otherwise there is no system and we'd all be destructive, chaotic, criminals and worse off.... ....it's not like I don't have a vote and a voice or anything, sad times....

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"In the words of NWA: Fuck The Police

Yeah. Till your 4 year old neighbour goes missing ... nah you are alright officer we don't want her looked for.

Or till your brother is stabbed and the nearest ambulance is 30 minutes away. We don't want your CPR officer.

Yeah fuck the police "

This

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By *ssex_tom OP   Man
over a year ago

Chelmsford

I have not had many dealings with them but the last time I tried to report something in a Tesco car park the lady policewoman was more interested in her newly purchased lunch to listen. She told me the car park was Tesco property and told me to see the manager. She then walked off... I was trying to report a crime...

I also tried to report a burglary to my local policing team. They told me that crime was nothing to do with them and I should dial 101. I did ring 101 and it took me three attempts and an hour and a half to get through..

They sent someone 5 days later.

I then read that 999 is being used by the public for non emergency calls..

No shit Sherlock...

I then listen to a local Chief Constable saying that answering calls is a challenge ... A challenge..?

Just get someone to answer them you twat ... Preferably the guy with a speed gun on a deserted 40 mph road because he has fuck all else to do ..

 (thread closed by moderator)

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By *ob198XaMan
over a year ago

teleford


"In the words of NWA: Fuck The Police "

Those who are anti police in this country are generally dirty rotten c*nts. We need to live in a society were citizens works in partnership with their local police not in battle against them. I want my police to be there to back me and my community when we need them and for them to know the community is there to back them if they find themselves in strife. It is sickening to see people standing round taking videos and even joining in to attack police rather than having their back. Stand with your police force and we can all enjoy a safe, secure community.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"In the words of NWA: Fuck The Police

Those who are anti police in this country are generally dirty rotten c*nts. We need to live in a society were citizens works in partnership with their local police not in battle against them. I want my police to be there to back me and my community when we need them and for them to know the community is there to back them if they find themselves in strife. It is sickening to see people standing round taking videos and even joining in to attack police rather than having their back. Stand with your police force and we can all enjoy a safe, secure community."

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By *ssex_tom OP   Man
over a year ago

Chelmsford

I think they should have a good look at the police. It could easily be privatised imo

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By *oldswarriorMan
over a year ago

Falkirk


"I think they should have a good look at the police. It could easily be privatised imo"

Commission driven to solve crimes.

You could be onto something.

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By *atcherwankerMan
over a year ago

Birmingham

Consent is given by the democratic election of a government to the policing and security policy laid out in their manifesto. Consent to policing is given by the electorate, not the individual.

You can't legitimately claim you individually don't Consent to police authority and are therefore exempt from police action any more than you can, say, insist on retaining EU citizenship because you didn't vote for brexit or refuse to acknowledge conservative government policy because you voted Green.

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By *estrained_DallianceMan
over a year ago

Cardiff


"I think they should have a good look at the police. It could easily be privatised imo

Commission driven to solve crimes.

You could be onto something."

But then we'd also head to a world of only solving the most profitable crimes to solve

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Just get someone to answer them you twat ... Preferably the guy with a speed gun on a deserted 40 mph road because he has fuck all else to do ..

"

Okay, while I feel your frustration, the issue isn't with the Police directly. It's with their funding. Ten years of Tory austerity cutbacks have seen the budgets of the Police, Criminal Justice system and Court Service slashed to the point that they are collapsing. If you're a criminal or aspire to be one, now is the time!

The result of this is they all have to triage what gets dealt with. Where I live it just take one serious incident on a any given day for everything else to go on the long finger.

The beauty of covert cuts like this is that thankfully the majority of people won't notice, most of the time. But when they do, and it's not there, well... if you voted Tory, reap your reward.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I think they should have a good look at the police. It could easily be privatised imo"

Ah yes, the perfect Tory view! Begin by running it down, with years of cutbacks, neglect leading to a deterioration in performance. Then, lets save it by privatisation!

Well my friend, look how well the aspects of this system that have been run by private enterprise have done? The scandal of the forensic labs leading to criminals walking free and cases collapsing. The prisons that have felt in private management. Christ, look how G4S failed with their Olympic security?

I won't mention the other aspects of privatisation that have made a tiny select minority multimillionaires while failing the people reliant on their services.

A privatised police force would have protecting its shareholders as its primary responsibility, not the public, and that my friend should give you nightmares!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/policing-by-consent/definition-of-policing-by-consent

The link explains exactly what policing by consent means.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"In the words of NWA: Fuck The Police

Yeah. Till your 4 year old neighbour goes missing ... nah you are alright officer we don't want her looked for.

Or till your brother is stabbed and the nearest ambulance is 30 minutes away. We don't want your CPR officer.

Yeah fuck the police "

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By *ob Carpe DiemMan
over a year ago

Torquay

Not much to add here except RIP PC Harper

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By *ssex_tom OP   Man
over a year ago

Chelmsford


" Not much to add here except RIP PC Harper"

Very sad loss...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"In the words of NWA: Fuck The Police "

Knob

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I often give some police consent

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I have not had many dealings with them but the last time I tried to report something in a Tesco car park the lady policewoman was more interested in her newly purchased lunch to listen. She told me the car park was Tesco property and told me to see the manager. She then walked off... I was trying to report a crime...

I also tried to report a burglary to my local policing team. They told me that crime was nothing to do with them and I should dial 101. I did ring 101 and it took me three attempts and an hour and a half to get through..

They sent someone 5 days later.

I then read that 999 is being used by the public for non emergency calls..

No shit Sherlock...

I then listen to a local Chief Constable saying that answering calls is a challenge ... A challenge..?

Just get someone to answer them you twat ... Preferably the guy with a speed gun on a deserted 40 mph road because he has fuck all else to do ..

"

Oh wow! Tom, you really have no idea do you? Go spend some time chatting to an off duty officer, their family or go to an open day at your local police station and chat to them there. I really hope one day you understand just how lucky we are and how much respect they truly deserve.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I then listen to a local Chief Constable saying that answering calls is a challenge ... A challenge..?"

To give you a real world example of the challenge, if you dial 999, and get put in a queue before your call is answered. It's happened to me. That shows you how bad the cutbacks to police funding has been. The police do not set their budget. They are given the budget by the government. The police cannot change their budget, but we can change the government.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I have not had many dealings with them but the last time I tried to report something in a Tesco car park the lady policewoman was more interested in her newly purchased lunch to listen. She told me the car park was Tesco property and told me to see the manager. She then walked off... I was trying to report a crime...

I also tried to report a burglary to my local policing team. They told me that crime was nothing to do with them and I should dial 101. I did ring 101 and it took me three attempts and an hour and a half to get through..

They sent someone 5 days later.

I then read that 999 is being used by the public for non emergency calls..

No shit Sherlock...

I then listen to a local Chief Constable saying that answering calls is a challenge ... A challenge..?

Just get someone to answer them you twat ... Preferably the guy with a speed gun on a deserted 40 mph road because he has fuck all else to do ..

Oh wow! Tom, you really have no idea do you? Go spend some time chatting to an off duty officer, their family or go to an open day at your local police station and chat to them there. I really hope one day you understand just how lucky we are and how much respect they truly deserve. "
They deal with some of the most horrendous situations ever. I know by a few officer friends exactly the stresses of the job. Some people are just plain rude about them. As said let's hope they never need them personally

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By *utterflyandArtificeCouple
over a year ago

Trowbridge

To live in a safe society there are commensurate societal norms by which we must all live.

One of these norms is a respect for the law. The law keeps us safe.

Simple really, if you break the law you are susceptible to be arrested and investigated and if found guilty by your peers you will be punished.

The problem is that there are too many who think that they can go through life without thought of consequence for their actions and when they are caught it is the Police who are wrong.

Societal Norms

Number 1; Don't be a Dick.

Number 2; Respect everyone.

Number 3; Thought of Consequence.

Number 4; Don't be a Dick.

I am grateful to all who choose to serve, or have served our society, whether they are NHS, Old Bill, Military, Fire Service, etc.

I think we are very lucky to have fine upstanding people who are willing to do what they do for us all.

DBAD

X

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"But then we'd also head to a world of only solving the most profitable crimes to solve"

Exactly... and solving crime, protect the public, and preventing crime costs money... which isn't directly recoverable. So, policing is essentially a loss leader.

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By *oldswarriorMan
over a year ago

Falkirk


"I think they should have a good look at the police. It could easily be privatised imo

Commission driven to solve crimes.

You could be onto something.

But then we'd also head to a world of only solving the most profitable crimes to solve"

Or the commission could be set for volume, so lesser easier to convict crimes also return a higher profit.

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By *otfabcouple2017Couple
over a year ago

Nottingham


"Our Policing model is apparently Policing by Consent...

Stop and Search is pissing off some communities...

Is this policing by consent...

Not sure but it's not working...."

Have a look at the London knife crime stats, before during and after last stop and search was put in place

The evidence shows it DID have an effect of lowering knife crime.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"To live in a safe society there are commensurate societal norms by which we must all live.

One of these norms is a respect for the law. The law keeps us safe.

Simple really, if you break the law you are susceptible to be arrested and investigated and if found guilty by your peers you will be punished.

The problem is that there are too many who think that they can go through life without thought of consequence for their actions and when they are caught it is the Police who are wrong.

Societal Norms

Number 1; Don't be a Dick.

Number 2; Respect everyone.

Number 3; Thought of Consequence.

Number 4; Don't be a Dick.

I am grateful to all who choose to serve, or have served our society, whether they are NHS, Old Bill, Military, Fire Service, etc.

I think we are very lucky to have fine upstanding people who are willing to do what they do for us all.

DBAD

X

"

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By *estrained_DallianceMan
over a year ago

Cardiff


"I think they should have a good look at the police. It could easily be privatised imo

Commission driven to solve crimes.

You could be onto something.

But then we'd also head to a world of only solving the most profitable crimes to solve

Or the commission could be set for volume, so lesser easier to convict crimes also return a higher profit.

"

Exactly... We saw same with a lot of privatisation in the NHS... Private treatment centres took the easy low risk operations leaving complex cases for NHS. Suddenly easy to paint that private sector has less complications if you ignore that they were able to cherry pick.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I think they should have a good look at the police. It could easily be privatised imo

Commission driven to solve crimes.

You could be onto something.

But then we'd also head to a world of only solving the most profitable crimes to solve

Or the commission could be set for volume, so lesser easier to convict crimes also return a higher profit.

Exactly... We saw same with a lot of privatisation in the NHS... Private treatment centres took the easy low risk operations leaving complex cases for NHS. Suddenly easy to paint that private sector has less complications if you ignore that they were able to cherry pick."

And at a stroke, the already badly served victims of sex crime would be forgotten, pushed further aside in to the wilderness, and left to wallow. While sex offenders have just landed in their very own land of milk and honey.

And don't even start on complex crime, like fraud.

Any level of privatisation or private business running any part of the service is an absolute disaster. People suggesting otherwise clearly have little to no knowledge of how the police and criminal justice system works, and what their roles are.

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By *ecretlivesCouple
over a year ago

FABWatch HQ

Policing only works by consent. It is just the point at which the consent is evaluated is sometimes at a much bigger level than the individual - sovereign or otherwise. Police operate within rules that are drawn up by Parliament.

Don't like Stop and Search? lobby for law change. Don't like the actions of an individual officer? report them? Don't like people beating shit out of innocents or mugging grannies? Stand next to the person with the uniform on. Act upon your consent.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Policing only works by consent. It is just the point at which the consent is evaluated is sometimes at a much bigger level than the individual - sovereign or otherwise. Police operate within rules that are drawn up by Parliament.

Don't like Stop and Search? lobby for law change. Don't like the actions of an individual officer? report them? Don't like people beating shit out of innocents or mugging grannies? Stand next to the person with the uniform on. Act upon your consent.

"

I agree - we're all far too good at whining and saying what should be done, often quite simply because of personal butthurtedness, but then when someone dares to point out that it can actually be achieved if we get off our hurt butts and get involved then we all go silent and blame it on the people who disagree with us - but that IS consent, innit....

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"To live in a safe society there are commensurate societal norms by which we must all live.

One of these norms is a respect for the law. The law keeps us safe.

Simple really, if you break the law you are susceptible to be arrested and investigated and if found guilty by your peers you will be punished.

The problem is that there are too many who think that they can go through life without thought of consequence for their actions and when they are caught it is the Police who are wrong.

Societal Norms

Number 1; Don't be a Dick.

Number 2; Respect everyone.

Number 3; Thought of Consequence.

Number 4; Don't be a Dick.

I am grateful to all who choose to serve, or have served our society, whether they are NHS, Old Bill, Military, Fire Service, etc.

I think we are very lucky to have fine upstanding people who are willing to do what they do for us all.

DBAD

X

"

Wise words x

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I think they should have a good look at the police. It could easily be privatised imo

Commission driven to solve crimes.

You could be onto something.

But then we'd also head to a world of only solving the most profitable crimes to solve

Or the commission could be set for volume, so lesser easier to convict crimes also return a higher profit.

Exactly... We saw same with a lot of privatisation in the NHS... Private treatment centres took the easy low risk operations leaving complex cases for NHS. Suddenly easy to paint that private sector has less complications if you ignore that they were able to cherry pick.

And at a stroke, the already badly served victims of sex crime would be forgotten, pushed further aside in to the wilderness, and left to wallow. While sex offenders have just landed in their very own land of milk and honey.

And don't even start on complex crime, like fraud.

Any level of privatisation or private business running any part of the service is an absolute disaster. People suggesting otherwise clearly have little to no knowledge of how the police and criminal justice system works, and what their roles are."

 (thread closed by moderator)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I then listen to a local Chief Constable saying that answering calls is a challenge ... A challenge..?

To give you a real world example of the challenge, if you dial 999, and get put in a queue before your call is answered. It's happened to me. That shows you how bad the cutbacks to police funding has been. The police do not set their budget. They are given the budget by the government. The police cannot change their budget, but we can change the government."

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By *estrained_DallianceMan
over a year ago

Cardiff


"I think they should have a good look at the police. It could easily be privatised imo

Commission driven to solve crimes.

You could be onto something.

But then we'd also head to a world of only solving the most profitable crimes to solve

Or the commission could be set for volume, so lesser easier to convict crimes also return a higher profit.

Exactly... We saw same with a lot of privatisation in the NHS... Private treatment centres took the easy low risk operations leaving complex cases for NHS. Suddenly easy to paint that private sector has less complications if you ignore that they were able to cherry pick.

And at a stroke, the already badly served victims of sex crime would be forgotten, pushed further aside in to the wilderness, and left to wallow. While sex offenders have just landed in their very own land of milk and honey.

And don't even start on complex crime, like fraud.

Any level of privatisation or private business running any part of the service is an absolute disaster. People suggesting otherwise clearly have little to no knowledge of how the police and criminal justice system works, and what their roles are."

 (thread closed by moderator)

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By *abasaurus RexMan
over a year ago

Gloucestershire

Everyone slags the police off but most are hard working, dedicated people who put up with shit working hours, constant abuse and very little thanks.

Whenever one police officer does something bad, they all suffer another tirade of abuse and vitriol.

They’re not perfect, they’re human after all. They get hardly any training at the start, there’s too few of them and they’re woefully underfunded across the board.

There are some major dickheads. It attracts power hungry types. Especially men.

I’d still rather have them at the end of the phone and at my front door when I need them.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Or the commission could be set for volume, so lesser easier to convict crimes also return a higher profit."

Following the Birmingham pub bombings in 1974, the police, under serious pressure to "get a result" framed six innocent people whose lives were destroyed. It remains not so much as a miscarriage of justice, but actually a criminal act in itself.

The victims and families of those pub bombings were failed, the six people incorrectly sent to prison and their families were failed, the public were failed, and the police service tarnished (and rightly so) as a result.

Look at that case, and then tell me why the police should be motivated to solve a crime by any other reason than getting the right result?

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By *oldswarriorMan
over a year ago

Falkirk


"Or the commission could be set for volume, so lesser easier to convict crimes also return a higher profit.

Following the Birmingham pub bombings in 1974, the police, under serious pressure to "get a result" framed six innocent people whose lives were destroyed. It remains not so much as a miscarriage of justice, but actually a criminal act in itself.

The victims and families of those pub bombings were failed, the six people incorrectly sent to prison and their families were failed, the public were failed, and the police service tarnished (and rightly so) as a result.

Look at that case, and then tell me why the police should be motivated to solve a crime by any other reason than getting the right result?"

We have come along way since 1974.

Technology has played a huge roll in this.

It's no longer the "Gene Hunt" method of policing, where the old gut instinct is the preferred method of judgment.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"We have come along way since 1974.

Technology has played a huge roll in this.

It's no longer the "Gene Hunt" method of policing, where the old gut instinct is the preferred method of judgment."

But not far enough!

I'm a supporter of the police. They don't get it right all the time, and they make mistakes and have their failures like all other services. But I force my ire at the people responsible for remedying that, and invariably in most cases, that isn't the police.

You mention technology. So how come defendants and victims have been failed by police not sharing electronic evidence with the defence and prosecution?

However, my point was that the police do not need to be motivated by anything other than protecting. And a vital part of that is when investigating a crime, they get the right people.

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By *ssex_tom OP   Man
over a year ago

Chelmsford

Is an organization thag has been described as institutionally racist for decades got for purpose ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Is an organization thag has been described as institutionally racist for decades got for purpose ?"

Oh Tom ....

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Is an organization thag has been described as institutionally racist for decades got for purpose ?"

Tom,

You do come out with some stuff. Can I ask what your chosen source your news and current affairs is?

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"We have come along way since 1974.

Technology has played a huge roll in this.

It's no longer the "Gene Hunt" method of policing, where the old gut instinct is the preferred method of judgment.

But not far enough!

I'm a supporter of the police. They don't get it right all the time, and they make mistakes and have their failures like all other services. But I force my ire at the people responsible for remedying that, and invariably in most cases, that isn't the police.

You mention technology. So how come defendants and victims have been failed by police not sharing electronic evidence with the defence and prosecution?

However, my point was that the police do not need to be motivated by anything other than protecting. And a vital part of that is when investigating a crime, they get the right people."

Agreed.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Everyone slags the police off but most are hard working, dedicated people who put up with shit working hours, constant abuse and very little thanks.

Whenever one police officer does something bad, they all suffer another tirade of abuse and vitriol.

They’re not perfect, they’re human after all. They get hardly any training at the start, there’s too few of them and they’re woefully underfunded across the board.

There are some major dickheads. It attracts power hungry types. Especially men.

I’d still rather have them at the end of the phone and at my front door when I need them. "

This 100 times over!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Is an organization thag has been described as institutionally racist for decades got for purpose ?"

Do you mean fit for purpose?

If you do, let's give all our police the day off to spend with their families (because you know, they are human) and see what happens to our country...

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By *ssex_tom OP   Man
over a year ago

Chelmsford


"Is an organization thag has been described as institutionally racist for decades got for purpose ?

Tom,

You do come out with some stuff. Can I ask what your chosen source your news and current affairs is?"

Well it's the McPherson report and the Lammy report .... Not to mention all the stop and search data...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Is an organization thag has been described as institutionally racist for decades got for purpose ?

Do you mean fit for purpose?

If you do, let's give all our police the day off to spend with their families (because you know, they are human) and see what happens to our country... "
If ever there was a vocation that everyone is an expert on its the Police service. There's some drivel in this thread.

Policing by consent has so many complex connotations. My interpretation? There's public consultation, input,challenge and scrutiny, and the service is answerable to many. When you deal in the commodity of angry, unhappy people being called out for their actions by and large, its no wonder they don't give 5 star ratings on TripAdvisor with the service given.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Is an organization thag has been described as institutionally racist for decades got for purpose ?

Do you mean fit for purpose?

If you do, let's give all our police the day off to spend with their families (because you know, they are human) and see what happens to our country... If ever there was a vocation that everyone is an expert on its the Police service. There's some drivel in this thread.

Policing by consent has so many complex connotations. My interpretation? There's public consultation, input,challenge and scrutiny, and the service is answerable to many. When you deal in the commodity of angry, unhappy people being called out for their actions by and large, its no wonder they don't give 5 star ratings on TripAdvisor with the service given."

Are you surprised about the drivel? There's always going to be someone out there that thinks they can do a better job or thinks the officers on the streets are the ones to be held accountable. If only they knew the amount of red tape that holds them up at every turn and how the criminal system is completely out of there hands.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)

It's a complicated issue that isn't really well dealt with on this kind of discussion forum.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"It's a complicated issue that isn't really well dealt with on this kind of discussion forum."

Amen to that!

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By *stbury DavenportMan
over a year ago

Nottingham


"I think they should have a good look at the police. It could easily be privatised imo

Commission driven to solve crimes.

You could be onto something."

And, of course, nobody would ever get fitted up for the money. Oh no.

Fucking hell.

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By *oldswarriorMan
over a year ago

Falkirk


"I think they should have a good look at the police. It could easily be privatised imo

Commission driven to solve crimes.

You could be onto something.

And, of course, nobody would ever get fitted up for the money. Oh no.

Fucking hell. "

Nothing to hide, nothing to fear.

Do you know first hand that the Police fit people up?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"It's a complicated issue that isn't really well dealt with on this kind of discussion forum."

True, very true

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By *ssex_tom OP   Man
over a year ago

Chelmsford

Move along Sir, Nothing to see..

Easy as you go Sir....

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By *orny PTMan
over a year ago

Peterborough


"I think they should have a good look at the police. It could easily be privatised imo

Commission driven to solve crimes.

You could be onto something."

Traffic cops picking out cars like snooker players pick out balls: this was done by VIZ.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Can I go back a step, like to the top, your rights when arrested, ie being read your rights:

You do not have to say anything, but it may harm your defence, if you do not mention, when questioned, something which you later rely on in court, anything you do say may be given in evidence. Do you understand??

All you are being asked is, do you understand the above paragraph, nothing to with consent.

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By *amish SMan
over a year ago

Eastleigh

Recently in involved with the local police. They said there was nothing they could do, after 18 months of abuse I complained to their complaints organisation, boy, did an inspector come visit me. He was around like shot and said that they are not doing anything as 'it was unlikely the CPS would not let the case go to court' I pointed out they are not the CPS and they should let the CPS decide. It resulted in only the second case of its type getting to crown court and and a guilty verdict was dished out.

They police with the consent of the criminals, not law abiding citizens, it needs to change.

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By *orny PTMan
over a year ago

Peterborough

South Yorkshire police, don't have a good reputation: Rotherham/Hillsborough/Cliff Richard to name a few.

Is it any wonder that people have little faith?

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By *ssex_tom OP   Man
over a year ago

Chelmsford


"I think they should have a good look at the police. It could easily be privatised imo

Commission driven to solve crimes.

You could be onto something.

Traffic cops picking out cars like snooker players pick out balls: this was done by VIZ."

And Essex Police.. according to the papers ...

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By *adbod74Man
over a year ago

Dudley

Personally if people just complied with any police request wouldn't it all just be a lot easier, they have a job to do like any of us, imagine going to maccies and ordering your food and they just said no I don't want to lol

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Must, not, get, in, trouble.......

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By *ssex_tom OP   Man
over a year ago

Chelmsford

That's why I would never buy a red car...

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By *orny PTMan
over a year ago

Peterborough


"That's why I would never buy a red car... "

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Recently in involved with the local police. They said there was nothing they could do, after 18 months of abuse I complained to their complaints organisation, boy, did an inspector come visit me. He was around like shot and said that they are not doing anything as 'it was unlikely the CPS would not let the case go to court' I pointed out they are not the CPS and they should let the CPS decide. It resulted in only the second case of its type getting to crown court and and a guilty verdict was dished out.

They police with the consent of the criminals, not law abiding citizens, it needs to change.

"

Well there it is...all the overwhelming unbiased evidence you need!

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By *entralscotscpl7Couple
over a year ago

Falkirk


"I think they should have a good look at the police. It could easily be privatised imo

Commission driven to solve crimes.

You could be onto something.

Traffic cops picking out cars like snooker players pick out balls: this was done by VIZ."

And yet they don't need to. Motoring offences are one of the highest revenue earners, and yet the first thing that is normally said by those repeat offenders is "why are you not out catching real criminals".

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By *ssex_tom OP   Man
over a year ago

Chelmsford


"That's why I would never buy a red car...

"

Only a snooker fan would get that gag

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By *ockosaurusMan
over a year ago

Warwick


"I think they should have a good look at the police. It could easily be privatised imo

Commission driven to solve crimes.

You could be onto something."

Then they wouldn't be interested in actually solving the crime, just finding someone to pin it on.

Any discrepancies would be hidden away.

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By *ssex_tom OP   Man
over a year ago

Chelmsford

More data today on a disproportionate amount of Covid fines issued to BAME...

Just saying...

Some of those not affected have white privilege perhaps...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"More data today on a disproportionate amount of Covid fines issued to BAME...

Just saying...

Some of those not affected have white privilege perhaps... "

Tom, give it a rest

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By *ssex_tom OP   Man
over a year ago

Chelmsford


"More data today on a disproportionate amount of Covid fines issued to BAME...

Just saying...

Some of those not affected have white privilege perhaps...

Tom, give it a rest"

Yes Milady..

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"More data today on a disproportionate amount of Covid fines issued to BAME...

Just saying...

Some of those not affected have white privilege perhaps...

Tom, give it a rest

Yes Milady.. "

Thank you, much appreciated.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


" Not much to add here except RIP PC Harper"

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By *orny PTMan
over a year ago

Peterborough

Does that have anything to do with Black lads in London stabbing each other?

I've never lived or worked in London, but a had a Black manager, who told me that was the reason she moved away from there, is she didn't want her boys to end up being another statistic in the crime reports, or worse still under that sheet on a sluice table. (True event)

When a black woman says that, she gets told well done, for doing the right thing. (I would assume)

If a white male says the same thing he's gonna be called racist. (Anyone surprised with that potential outcome?)

What would people think and say if the white guy and black woman were Mum and Dad to those very same boys?

Question the thugs with knives, if you dare.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Recently in involved with the local police. They said there was nothing they could do, after 18 months of abuse I complained to their complaints organisation, boy, did an inspector come visit me. He was around like shot and said that they are not doing anything as 'it was unlikely the CPS would not let the case go to court' I pointed out they are not the CPS and they should let the CPS decide. It resulted in only the second case of its type getting to crown court and and a guilty verdict was dished out.

They police with the consent of the criminals, not law abiding citizens, it needs to change.

"

Hamish,

Firstly, let me offer my sympathies that you've found yourself in your particular position.

The role of the police in prosecution is to gather evidence, build a case, and put that forward to the CPS. It is the CPS, not the police, who decided if a suspect is to go to court. Making a case takes time and costs money. Prosecuting a case takes time and costs money. Both the police and CPS have had their budgets slashed over the past ten years. They have to make every penny count, and sadly, that means some cases don't go to court because they cannot risk the funding being spent on case that doesn't result in a conviction.

In reality, the cost of the case should never be a factor in determining if a case goes to court. But thanks to budget cuts, it has become a factor. Those who think a privatised criminal justice system would work are living very privileged lives untouched by crime.

I've had to push to get cases to court. I've had to complain about the conduct of individual officers. I've had issues compounded by police errors and inaction. But I support the police, as the issues are not of their making and actually, they are not allowed to be political.

If you want to change the system, change the government.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"They police with the consent of the criminals, not law abiding citizens, it needs to change."

If you read through the thread, the definition of policing with consent has been discussed. To save you having to read through, in essence it means we are not living in a police state.

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"They police with the consent of the criminals, not law abiding citizens, it needs to change.

If you read through the thread, the definition of policing with consent has been discussed. To save you having to read through, in essence it means we are not living in a police state."

I'm not sure logical or reasonable discussion of this as a serious issue will take off. I applaud you for trying though. Seriously.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

Do you know first hand that the Police fit people up?

"

Birmingham six

Guildford four

...that's ten to begin with.

How about police conduct after Hillsborough? While I believe the disaster itself was a cock up rather than anything malicious, their actions after the fact amplified the grief of relatives of those killed and injured, not to mention the victims themselves.

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By *oldswarriorMan
over a year ago

Falkirk


"

Do you know first hand that the Police fit people up?

Birmingham six

Guildford four

...that's ten to begin with.

How about police conduct after Hillsborough? While I believe the disaster itself was a cock up rather than anything malicious, their actions after the fact amplified the grief of relatives of those killed and injured, not to mention the victims themselves."

So we shouldn’t trust the authorities for the risk of being fitted up?

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By *naswingdressWoman
over a year ago

Manchester (she/her)


"

Do you know first hand that the Police fit people up?

Birmingham six

Guildford four

...that's ten to begin with.

How about police conduct after Hillsborough? While I believe the disaster itself was a cock up rather than anything malicious, their actions after the fact amplified the grief of relatives of those killed and injured, not to mention the victims themselves.

So we shouldn’t trust the authorities for the risk of being fitted up?

"

Everyone should be subject to scrutiny and asked to improve. Always.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

Do you know first hand that the Police fit people up?

Birmingham six

Guildford four

...that's ten to begin with.

How about police conduct after Hillsborough? While I believe the disaster itself was a cock up rather than anything malicious, their actions after the fact amplified the grief of relatives of those killed and injured, not to mention the victims themselves.

So we shouldn’t trust the authorities for the risk of being fitted up?

Everyone should be subject to scrutiny and asked to improve. Always."

True. And you won't find a more scrutinised organisation these days.

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By *estrained_DallianceMan
over a year ago

Cardiff


"

Do you know first hand that the Police fit people up?

Birmingham six

Guildford four

...that's ten to begin with.

How about police conduct after Hillsborough? While I believe the disaster itself was a cock up rather than anything malicious, their actions after the fact amplified the grief of relatives of those killed and injured, not to mention the victims themselves.

So we shouldn’t trust the authorities for the risk of being fitted up?

Everyone should be subject to scrutiny and asked to improve. Always.

True. And you won't find a more scrutinised organisation these days."

Exactly... The bit that particularly confuses me is why there is a perception that adding a profit motive will improve the quality of a service.

I accept that there is a possibility it may improve efficiency...however, having worked for both private and public sector organisations the approach is different.

In public sector it tends to focus on delivery.. in private sector the focus will tend to be on maximising profits.

I think it would be naive in the extreme to imagine that comission based arrests or profit led policing would not lead to significant risk of increased wrongful arrests

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

So we shouldn’t trust the authorities for the risk of being fitted up?

"

No, that's not my point... and if you read through all I've posted here you will see that I am an advocate for police support.

My point was that "fitting up" has and does happen. Introduce a profit motive, and that is likely to increase. Look how well prison and detention centres have done under private companies.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

I accept that there is a possibility it may improve efficiency..."

In conversation with a police inspector one evening, I questioned the value in having multiple constabularies, and how having central purchasing for vehicles, uniform, equipment, etc could save money. The agreed, but succinctly pointed out that the largest spend in the police budget was... manpower.

So, under ten years of tories police numbers have been cut!

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By *m3232Man
over a year ago

maidenhead

Stop and search should be no problem to anyone that’s not doing anything illegal.

I would even vote for it.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Is an organization thag has been described as institutionally racist for decades got for purpose ?"

Except its just that...a term thats been branded about.

Whilst I appreciate you like trolling, people forget its a cross section of society. Society suffers with racist profiling, prejudice and all the other unsavoury behaviours. And whilst there's legislation, there's no scrutiny to the degree that the Police suffers. Im guessing you've never been a Police officer? If thats the case you're basing your opinion on anecdotal evidence on a relatively few incidents, as opposed to the many positive ones.

People believe what they want to believe.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Except its just that...a term thats been branded about.

Whilst I appreciate you like trolling, people forget its a cross section of society. Society suffers with racist profiling, prejudice and all the other unsavoury behaviours. And whilst there's legislation, there's no scrutiny to the degree that the Police suffers. Im guessing you've never been a Police officer? If thats the case you're basing your opinion on anecdotal evidence on a relatively few incidents, as opposed to the many positive ones.

People believe what they want to believe."

Exactly this!

Take a look at the Met in London, as an example. In total, they employ 44,000 people, of which 32,401 are police officers, 9,461 police staff and 1,247 PCSOs.

Take a cross section of 44,000 people in the UK. How many of those will be racist, homophobic, anti-Semitic or whatever undesirable view or belief you want to take? So, given that, why should we expect that the police services up and down the land will be immune? They won't be, but I believe the work tirelessly to avoid those views getting in to their ranks in the first place, and ejecting them when those in the ranks are found to harbour such views.

The police have a tough job, and it would be great if the government and general public gave them the resources and support they need to keep us safe.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Except its just that...a term thats been branded about.

Whilst I appreciate you like trolling, people forget its a cross section of society. Society suffers with racist profiling, prejudice and all the other unsavoury behaviours. And whilst there's legislation, there's no scrutiny to the degree that the Police suffers. Im guessing you've never been a Police officer? If thats the case you're basing your opinion on anecdotal evidence on a relatively few incidents, as opposed to the many positive ones.

People believe what they want to believe.

Exactly this!

Take a look at the Met in London, as an example. In total, they employ 44,000 people, of which 32,401 are police officers, 9,461 police staff and 1,247 PCSOs.

Take a cross section of 44,000 people in the UK. How many of those will be racist, homophobic, anti-Semitic or whatever undesirable view or belief you want to take? So, given that, why should we expect that the police services up and down the land will be immune? They won't be, but I believe the work tirelessly to avoid those views getting in to their ranks in the first place, and ejecting them when those in the ranks are found to harbour such views.

The police have a tough job, and it would be great if the government and general public gave them the resources and support they need to keep us safe.

"

Here here!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Stop and search should be no problem to anyone that’s not doing anything illegal.

I would even vote for it. "

You know Germany done this during the 2nd world war, it was preceded by "show me your papers".

Never really worked out for those innocent people.

Policing by consent simply means imo the police doing there job, they must suspect you of a crime before taking any action against you, randomly grabbing people on the street for stop and search is a violation of peoples rights as individuals to go about their lawful business. If I walked up to you in the street and said empty your pockets would you ?, a uniform does not maketh the man with extra powers or change anything. Watch some PINAC vids on you tube and you will see plenty examples of police abusing powers.

4 or 5 police cars Turing up to 1 man and a camera, meanwhile I can't get an officer to investigate vehicle breakins or house burglary.

I'm for the police doing their job but they must DO their job and not act like bullying dicks because they wear a uniform.

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By *Wman15Man
over a year ago

Altrincham


"More data today on a disproportionate amount of Covid fines issued to BAME...

Just saying...

Some of those not affected have white privilege perhaps... "

But what are the reasons behind the figures?

It could be that they were disproportionately breaking the relevant rules and not simply because of bias or profiling

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By *m3232Man
over a year ago

maidenhead


"Stop and search should be no problem to anyone that’s not doing anything illegal.

I would even vote for it.

You know Germany done this during the 2nd world war, it was preceded by "show me your papers".

Never really worked out for those innocent people.

Policing by consent simply means imo the police doing there job, they must suspect you of a crime before taking any action against you, randomly grabbing people on the street for stop and search is a violation of peoples rights as individuals to go about their lawful business. If I walked up to you in the street and said empty your pockets would you ?, a uniform does not maketh the man with extra powers or change anything. Watch some PINAC vids on you tube and you will see plenty examples of police abusing powers.

4 or 5 police cars Turing up to 1 man and a camera, meanwhile I can't get an officer to investigate vehicle breakins or house burglary.

I'm for the police doing their job but they must DO their job and not act like bullying dicks because they wear a uniform.

"

I have no problem with show me your papers.

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By *Wman15Man
over a year ago

Altrincham


"

Do you know first hand that the Police fit people up?

Birmingham six

Guildford four

...that's ten to begin with.

How about police conduct after Hillsborough? While I believe the disaster itself was a cock up rather than anything malicious, their actions after the fact amplified the grief of relatives of those killed and injured, not to mention the victims themselves."

Not particularly recent examples....and of course some people conveniently overlook the fact that it people in the communities that those wrongly convicted of the Bham and Guildford murders came from knew who were actually responsible but allowed the not guilty to be convicted

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Stop and search is only a problem if you have something to hide.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 28/07/20 16:17:26]

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By *oggoneMan
over a year ago

Derry


"

Do you know first hand that the Police fit people up?

Birmingham six

Guildford four

...that's ten to begin with.

How about police conduct after Hillsborough? While I believe the disaster itself was a cock up rather than anything malicious, their actions after the fact amplified the grief of relatives of those killed and injured, not to mention the victims themselves.

Not particularly recent examples....and of course some people conveniently overlook the fact that it people in the communities that those wrongly convicted of the Bham and Guildford murders came from knew who were actually responsible but allowed the not guilty to be convicted "

Any sources for that rubbish?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Not particularly recent examples....and of course some people conveniently overlook the fact that it people in the communities that those wrongly convicted of the Bham and Guildford murders came from knew who were actually responsible but allowed the not guilty to be convicted "

If you want to list cases where people have been fitted up, it would be a long list... I simply used those as examples people would be familiar with.

Yet you conveniently ignore the fact that the people who were responsible for those bombings, and who admitted to them in prison, were never charged? And despite these confessions, the Birmingham six remained in prison for how long? Because, the police didn't want to admit they fitted them up!

What you are talking resembles those oval shaped items found in a scrotum!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Stop and search should be no problem to anyone that’s not doing anything illegal.

I have no problem with show me your papers. "

When you stand for nothing , you fall for everything.

Most law abiding people would like their civil liberties to stay that way, those freedoms fought and died for over many wars .

To turn the country into a communist state where our freedoms like walking down a street without the threat of someone randomly telling me to empty my pockets kind of makes a mockery of those freedoms million of people lost their lives trying to protect.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Stop and search should be no problem to anyone that’s not doing anything illegal.

I have no problem with show me your papers.

When you stand for nothing , you fall for everything.

Most law abiding people would like their civil liberties to stay that way, those freedoms fought and died for over many wars .

To turn the country into a communist state where our freedoms like walking down a street without the threat of someone randomly telling me to empty my pockets kind of makes a mockery of those freedoms million of people lost their lives trying to protect. "

Do you actually understand stop and search? It doesn't appear that way from your words.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Stop and search should be no problem to anyone that’s not doing anything illegal.

I have no problem with show me your papers.

When you stand for nothing , you fall for everything.

Most law abiding people would like their civil liberties to stay that way, those freedoms fought and died for over many wars .

To turn the country into a communist state where our freedoms like walking down a street without the threat of someone randomly telling me to empty my pockets kind of makes a mockery of those freedoms million of people lost their lives trying to protect. "

Go research section 1 of the Police and Criminal Evidence Act 1984. I am guessing you haven't... 'random doesn't appear in the wording.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Stop and search should be no problem to anyone that’s not doing anything illegal.

I have no problem with show me your papers.

When you stand for nothing , you fall for everything.

Most law abiding people would like their civil liberties to stay that way, those freedoms fought and died for over many wars .

To turn the country into a communist state where our freedoms like walking down a street without the threat of someone randomly telling me to empty my pockets kind of makes a mockery of those freedoms million of people lost their lives trying to protect.

Go research section 1 of the Police and Criminal Evidence Act 1984. I am guessing you haven't... 'random doesn't appear in the wording."

I totally agree with you on the using of PACE to search someone. Now do me a favour and go and look at the thousands of videos of police abusing the powers of PACE and then tell me there not randomly searching people and breaching peoples civil liberties.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

ACAB

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By *arlomaleMan
over a year ago

darlington


"ACAB"
???

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"ACAB"

What, ALL of them?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Stop and search should be no problem to anyone that’s not doing anything illegal.

I have no problem with show me your papers.

When you stand for nothing , you fall for everything.

Most law abiding people would like their civil liberties to stay that way, those freedoms fought and died for over many wars .

To turn the country into a communist state where our freedoms like walking down a street without the threat of someone randomly telling me to empty my pockets kind of makes a mockery of those freedoms million of people lost their lives trying to protect.

Go research section 1 of the Police and Criminal Evidence Act 1984. I am guessing you haven't... 'random doesn't appear in the wording.

I totally agree with you on the using of PACE to search someone. Now do me a favour and go and look at the thousands of videos of police abusing the powers of PACE and then tell me there not randomly searching people and breaching peoples civil liberties. "

You got the data to hand?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"ACAB ??? "

All Criminals Are Bad

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By *estrained_DallianceMan
over a year ago

Cardiff


"Stop and search should be no problem to anyone that’s not doing anything illegal.

I have no problem with show me your papers.

When you stand for nothing , you fall for everything.

Most law abiding people would like their civil liberties to stay that way, those freedoms fought and died for over many wars .

To turn the country into a communist state where our freedoms like walking down a street without the threat of someone randomly telling me to empty my pockets kind of makes a mockery of those freedoms million of people lost their lives trying to protect.

Go research section 1 of the Police and Criminal Evidence Act 1984. I am guessing you haven't... 'random doesn't appear in the wording.

I totally agree with you on the using of PACE to search someone. Now do me a favour and go and look at the thousands of videos of police abusing the powers of PACE and then tell me there not randomly searching people and breaching peoples civil liberties. "

Ever thought there might also be a hint of bias in those videos or the ones filming them? Any idea of what happened before the filming started or the warning markers held for those individuals from previous behaviour?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

All of them

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By *arlomaleMan
over a year ago

darlington


"ACAB ???

All Criminals Are Bad "
all cakes are bad perhaps

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By *estrained_DallianceMan
over a year ago

Cardiff


"ACAB ???

All Criminals Are Bad "

Hehe... I do wonder how quickly someone who suggests ACAB is a reasonable stance changes their mind when assaulted or if a child goes missing

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By *estrained_DallianceMan
over a year ago

Cardiff


"ACAB ???

All Criminals Are Bad all cakes are bad perhaps "

Surely all cakes are brilliant?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"All of them"

Bet you'd still call them if you needed to though right!?

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By *arlomaleMan
over a year ago

darlington


"ACAB ???

All Criminals Are Bad all cakes are bad perhaps

Surely all cakes are brilliant?"
depends if they have raisins in (bork)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"ACAB ???

All Criminals Are Bad

Hehe... I do wonder how quickly someone who suggests ACAB is a reasonable stance changes their mind when assaulted or if a child goes missing"

Couldnt agree more! Pathetic thing to say imo

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By *estrained_DallianceMan
over a year ago

Cardiff


"ACAB ???

All Criminals Are Bad all cakes are bad perhaps

Surely all cakes are brilliant? depends if they have raisins in (bork) "

Ah so we could say all cakes are brilliant except for a small subset?

Odd how some people feel that such a nuanced approach can't be taken to groups of people

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By *arlomaleMan
over a year ago

darlington


"ACAB ???

All Criminals Are Bad

Hehe... I do wonder how quickly someone who suggests ACAB is a reasonable stance changes their mind when assaulted or if a child goes missing

Couldnt agree more! Pathetic thing to say imo"
lol it’s something Vivian from the young ones would come out with

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"ACAB ???

All Criminals Are Bad

Hehe... I do wonder how quickly someone who suggests ACAB is a reasonable stance changes their mind when assaulted or if a child goes missing

Couldnt agree more! Pathetic thing to say imo lol it’s something Vivian from the young ones would come out with "

Well he did get on University Challenge so he must have been pretty clever

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Stop and search should be no problem to anyone that’s not doing anything illegal.

I have no problem with show me your papers.

When you stand for nothing , you fall for everything.

Most law abiding people would like their civil liberties to stay that way, those freedoms fought and died for over many wars .

To turn the country into a communist state where our freedoms like walking down a street without the threat of someone randomly telling me to empty my pockets kind of makes a mockery of those freedoms million of people lost their lives trying to protect.

Go research section 1 of the Police and Criminal Evidence Act 1984. I am guessing you haven't... 'random doesn't appear in the wording.

I totally agree with you on the using of PACE to search someone. Now do me a favour and go and look at the thousands of videos of police abusing the powers of PACE and then tell me there not randomly searching people and breaching peoples civil liberties.

You got the data to hand?"

You tube is full of the data you request, not allowed to send thousands of links on Fab. Try Pinac, or pap.

Do you use your camera phone in a public place ? I bet you do. Go look at what happens when others do this perfectly legal thing, tyoe PINAC.

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By *arlomaleMan
over a year ago

darlington


"ACAB ???

All Criminals Are Bad

Hehe... I do wonder how quickly someone who suggests ACAB is a reasonable stance changes their mind when assaulted or if a child goes missing

Couldnt agree more! Pathetic thing to say imo lol it’s something Vivian from the young ones would come out with

Well he did get on University Challenge so he must have been pretty clever "
scumbag college

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"ACAB ???

All Criminals Are Bad

Hehe... I do wonder how quickly someone who suggests ACAB is a reasonable stance changes their mind when assaulted or if a child goes missing"

That's where our consent comes in, we're consenting to them doing what there PAID to do, we don't consent to them abusing there position. This us where your missing the point.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"ACAB ???

All Criminals Are Bad

Hehe... I do wonder how quickly someone who suggests ACAB is a reasonable stance changes their mind when assaulted or if a child goes missing

That's where our consent comes in, we're consenting to them doing what there PAID to do, we don't consent to them abusing there position. This us where your missing the point. "

Ps I definitely don't agree with ACAB, but there is always minorities that can tarnish a reputation for all.

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By *Wman15Man
over a year ago

Altrincham


"

Do you know first hand that the Police fit people up?

Birmingham six

Guildford four

...that's ten to begin with.

How about police conduct after Hillsborough? While I believe the disaster itself was a cock up rather than anything malicious, their actions after the fact amplified the grief of relatives of those killed and injured, not to mention the victims themselves.

Not particularly recent examples....and of course some people conveniently overlook the fact that it people in the communities that those wrongly convicted of the Bham and Guildford murders came from knew who were actually responsible but allowed the not guilty to be convicted

Any sources for that rubbish?"

You really believe that no one knew who had committed those mass murders? Unbelievable

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By *abasaurus RexMan
over a year ago

Gloucestershire


"Stop and search is only a problem if you have something to hide."

Or you’re disproportionately targeted.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Stop and search is only a problem if you have something to hide.

Or you’re disproportionately targeted. "

Or if you disproportionately do the majority of the crimes for which you are stopped and searched

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Stop and search is only a problem if you have something to hide.

Or you’re disproportionately targeted.

Or if you disproportionately do the majority of the crimes for which you are stopped and searched "

If searched under PACE repeatedly then clearly their not finding anything and hence being stopped and searched constantly is an abuse of power. Given that they MUST have a reasonable excuse to use PACE then it's a problem. YOU need to look at the vids I suggested earlier mate.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Stop and search is only a problem if you have something to hide.

Or you’re disproportionately targeted.

Or if you disproportionately do the majority of the crimes for which you are stopped and searched

If searched under PACE repeatedly then clearly their not finding anything and hence being stopped and searched constantly is an abuse of power. Given that they MUST have a reasonable excuse to use PACE then it's a problem. YOU need to look at the vids I suggested earlier mate. "

Reasonable grounds to suspect...not an excuse. Big difference!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Stop and search is only a problem if you have something to hide.

Or you’re disproportionately targeted.

Or if you disproportionately do the majority of the crimes for which you are stopped and searched

If searched under PACE repeatedly then clearly their not finding anything and hence being stopped and searched constantly is an abuse of power. Given that they MUST have a reasonable excuse to use PACE then it's a problem. YOU need to look at the vids I suggested earlier mate. "

Two thirds of London’s knife crime is committed by ethnic minorities. The vast majority of deaths by gang violence and knives in London is committed by ethnic minorities. These are facts. Stop and search is a deterrent to anyone on the street carrying a knife. Without it the police do not have a necessary tool with which to combat knife crime.

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By *oggoneMan
over a year ago

Derry


"

Do you know first hand that the Police fit people up?

Birmingham six

Guildford four

...that's ten to begin with.

How about police conduct after Hillsborough? While I believe the disaster itself was a cock up rather than anything malicious, their actions after the fact amplified the grief of relatives of those killed and injured, not to mention the victims themselves.

Not particularly recent examples....and of course some people conveniently overlook the fact that it people in the communities that those wrongly convicted of the Bham and Guildford murders came from knew who were actually responsible but allowed the not guilty to be convicted

Any sources for that rubbish?

You really believe that no one knew who had committed those mass murders? Unbelievable

"

OK so you don't have a source for your claims that it was the Irish community that was indirectly responsible for the Police to beat suspects, force false confessions, lie about forensic evidence and the CPS to withhold information from the defence?

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By *orny PTMan
over a year ago

Peterborough


"ACAB"

TAXI! (Beeps horn, because it's raining!)

01840 211337

Kenningstock Cottage, Advent, Camelford, PL32 9QP

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

Do you know first hand that the Police fit people up?

Birmingham six

Guildford four

...that's ten to begin with.

How about police conduct after Hillsborough? While I believe the disaster itself was a cock up rather than anything malicious, their actions after the fact amplified the grief of relatives of those killed and injured, not to mention the victims themselves.

Not particularly recent examples....and of course some people conveniently overlook the fact that it people in the communities that those wrongly convicted of the Bham and Guildford murders came from knew who were actually responsible but allowed the not guilty to be convicted

Any sources for that rubbish?

You really believe that no one knew who had committed those mass murders? Unbelievable

OK so you don't have a source for your claims that it was the Irish community that was indirectly responsible for the Police to beat suspects, force false confessions, lie about forensic evidence and the CPS to withhold information from the defence? "

40 odd years ago. Sure it wasn't right ... of course it wasn't, but alot changes in 40 years. There won't be a single police officer involved in that situation still in the job. In fact many will be dead by now. How does that situation reflect on modern day police forces? Not looking for a fight, just asking.

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By *reatformeatWoman
over a year ago

my own bubble

If you have nothing to hide why would you object to a stop and search ? Modern policing is far to soft now and silly face book videos of idiots abusing police all the time and getting away with it doesn't help. Have some respect for the law they have a very difficult job with the amount of flth and scum on our streets today

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"40 odd years ago. Sure it wasn't right ... of course it wasn't, but alot changes in 40 years. There won't be a single police officer involved in that situation still in the job. In fact many will be dead by now. How does that situation reflect on modern day police forces? Not looking for a fight, just asking."

Yes, it is different today, and if your read through fully you will see I'm on the side of the police. My point being, that when put under pressure to "get a result", certain officers concentrated on "result" rather than "right result". In a privatised or financially incentivised goal driven police environment, this sort of behaviour would return in an instant.

Today, resources are so scarce for police to do their job that crime report prevention is the first triage for victims. We are in the golden age of crime, if you are a criminal.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Our Policing model is apparently Policing by Consent...

Stop and Search is pissing off some communities...

Is this policing by consent...

Not sure but it's not working...."

It's coersion and manipulation.

I like the police but not sneaky over zealous manipulation.

Black men will be disproportionately searched in my utopia. That's because they disproportionately commit crimes.

I am going to put black women incharge of them and give black women the authority to control them....so white people aren't liable....

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By *isaB45Woman
over a year ago

Fabville

I'm appalled to see so much hate here. It's sickening.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"If you have nothing to hide why would you object to a stop and search ? Modern policing is far to soft now and silly face book videos of idiots abusing police all the time and getting away with it doesn't help. Have some respect for the law they have a very difficult job with the amount of flth and scum on our streets today "

Because I am conservative

Only commie left wing people enjoy police control to such an extent.

I would still make the law so that black Muslim men wher given equal treatment somewhat....

But they say "why you picking on me"

....It's Because you need the police in your community more because you like tupac/spinning rimz/selling drugs/shootings

We don't need the mayor of London turning it into Chicago because of political correctness

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Sorry not sorry....

For the record I don't like Karen either.

Karen enables all of this

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