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hyped up managers!?!

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By *istress_L-Captain OP   Couple
over a year ago

Southport

They get paid more for a reason. Mine have been telling me to do their job! I think its probably as they are not capable of doing it themselves!

Only a little rant this morning.....quick hide here he comes......

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"They get paid more for a reason. Mine have been telling me to do their job! I think its probably as they are not capable of doing it themselves!

Only a little rant this morning.....quick hide here he comes......"

Been doing my managers jobs all my working life, never came across a manager worthy of the name. What I don't understand, is no matter how incompetent they are, no-one above them seems to notice........

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"They get paid more for a reason. Mine have been telling me to do their job! I think its probably as they are not capable of doing it themselves!

Only a little rant this morning.....quick hide here he comes......"

And breathe...

Now get back to ya work... ()

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"They get paid more for a reason. Mine have been telling me to do their job! I think its probably as they are not capable of doing it themselves!

Only a little rant this morning.....quick hide here he comes......

Been doing my managers jobs all my working life, never came across a manager worthy of the name. What I don't understand, is no matter how incompetent they are, no-one above them seems to notice........"

Think tad unfair....you may just work in a bad sector....

My managers spot on, now I hope my managers feel the same, everyones human so all make mistakes or can't be perfect but its how you deal with all issues.

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By *istress_L-Captain OP   Couple
over a year ago

Southport

I work in care a couple of the managers are alright don't get me wrong but one has no concept that I am dealing with people are their needs. If I haven't filled up sugar bowls cause I was dealing with a person god for bid they have to do it. They are quick to blame the care staff but will not take any blame themselves

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Been doing my managers jobs all my working life, never came across a manager worthy of the name. What I don't understand, is no matter how incompetent they are, no-one above them seems to notice........"

You mean nobody has noticed your wonderful talent for doing the job of your superiors better than they can do it? How do you get through the day with so much pent up frustration?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I work in care a couple of the managers are alright don't get me wrong but one has no concept that I am dealing with people are their needs. If I haven't filled up sugar bowls cause I was dealing with a person god for bid they have to do it. They are quick to blame the care staff but will not take any blame themselves"

Please don't take this the wrong way but ensuring the sugar bowls are full may be part of your role, the managers role may be deciding the rota, managing the budgets etc and ensuring the overall standard is maintained by the team ( like sugar bowls).

How they train, inspire and motivate you to do your job is a very important management skill, but it's a poor manager who does your job for you.

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By *istress_L-Captain OP   Couple
over a year ago

Southport

All the other managers understand there are times when we can't get to the sugar till the chef comes in at six. We have six o clock checks to do and get people up i'm suppose to finish at 8am there are mornings where I am still busy with people after this time.

The managers are suppose to double check everything and either do little thing like sugar or get a volunteer to do it. I'm not leaving someone in the bath or shower and say hold on I need to just do sugar bowls!!!!!!!!!!!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The thing is though that some staff think they're doing the managers job cos they've been asked to do something a little out of their remit, maybe given a little more responsibility. If they cope with that level of responsibility, this will only go in favour of the employee.

Part of a managers role is to develop employees so they attain additional skills which will further aid their career. Employees are safe doing this as the ultimate responsibility stays with the manager, therefore if 'shit hits fan' then the manager will take the flack, not the employee.

Employees only see a small part of their managers role and are not privy to decision making, budgets, etc etc. A confident manager may look as if they have an easy role but they are probably very efficient at managing their workload and priorities.

That said, as in all aspects of life, you get the lazy buggers who don't want to do anything. Such is life

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By *at n michaelCouple
over a year ago

AYRSHIRE

when i worked in nursing home carers attended to residents and domestics/kitchen staff attended to little things like sugar bowls preparing food .n idont blame you for not wanting to leave some 1 in bath....yes some managers sit in their little offices doing so called paper work i.e sitting on their erses lol x

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

Been doing my managers jobs all my working life, never came across a manager worthy of the name. What I don't understand, is no matter how incompetent they are, no-one above them seems to notice........"

I appreciate the point you are making, but you're missing the point to a degree. Their primary function as a manager is to manage you and get the best out of their team, if you're doing a good job and the rest of the team are then the result is all that matters up the line, they are obviously managing in a way that is effective.

That said if over a long term they are taking the team for granted and demoralising a good team that will eventually show in the results.

The key is a manager doesn't have to be competent at doing your job, they just have to be good at getting you to do your job well.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"They get paid more for a reason. Mine have been telling me to do their job! I think its probably as they are not capable of doing it themselves!

Only a little rant this morning.....quick hide here he comes......"

If they are getting you to perform at a higher level, making you work harder and archive more then they may actually be doing their job very well. Manages often strive to get the workers to do less thinking about what others do and don’t and get arses off chairs into action.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I work in care a couple of the managers are alright don't get me wrong but one has no concept that I am dealing with people are their needs. If I haven't filled up sugar bowls cause I was dealing with a person god for bid they have to do it. They are quick to blame the care staff but will not take any blame themselves

Please don't take this the wrong way but ensuring the sugar bowls are full may be part of your role, the managers role may be deciding the rota, managing the budgets etc and ensuring the overall standard is maintained by the team ( like sugar bowls).

How they train, inspire and motivate you to do your job is a very important management skill, but it's a poor manager who does your job for you. "

I used to do care work many years ago and tho a care worker may have any jobs from helping someone to the loo to making cups of tea job are ment to be prioritised, you dont leave someone sat in wet underwear because a sugar bowl needs filling and if the homes having a bad day and lots of people are needing on going help sometimes the sugar bowl gets left, how do you decide when to leave someone in need in order to do such trivial jobs

If a family member turned up to find their loved one in bed buzzing for help and noone there to respond because they was all doing jobs like, making tea, putting towels away etc the manager would be the first to pull you up infront of that family member for not putting the person first when it was them who told you to go do jobs like fulling sugar bowls, been there, done it, got the t shirt

and to be honest i dis agree a good manager would full the sugar bowl for you if it was busy and all the care workers was busy doing important jobs...like caring, its not a case of doing your job its called team work and the manager is part of that team because at the end of the day a managers is only as good as their staff, look after them and they look after you

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"when i worked in nursing home carers attended to residents and domestics/kitchen staff attended to little things like sugar bowls preparing food .n idont blame you for not wanting to leave some 1 in bath....yes some managers sit in their little offices doing so called paper work i.e sitting on their erses lol x"

The 'so called paper work' is at least as important as the patient sitting in the bath.

Without the paperwork and budgets being correct then the care home would probably go bust so there'd be no patient and no care worker!

It's always easy to underestimate the role of management.

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By *istress_L-Captain OP   Couple
over a year ago

Southport

The point i'm trying to make is a few managers will pitch in when they can see the care side struggling but if we miss something that in the big scheme of things doesn't matter because we are doing what we are primarily there for they have a hissy fit!

I was pulled aside this morning and was asked why someone wasn't up! They had refused to get up and wanted to lie in. The other care staff and nurses were fine. But the manager kept asking why!!!!! If I physically got them out of bed its abuse and I can lose my job.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The point i'm trying to make is a few managers will pitch in when they can see the care side struggling but if we miss something that in the big scheme of things doesn't matter because we are doing what we are primarily there for they have a hissy fit!

I was pulled aside this morning and was asked why someone wasn't up! They had refused to get up and wanted to lie in. The other care staff and nurses were fine. But the manager kept asking why!!!!! If I physically got them out of bed its abuse and I can lose my job.

"

a of these so called managers in care home just want everything to run clock work and seem to forget they are dealing witb people and they are not a product on a proiduction line

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By *am sampsonMan
over a year ago

cwmbran


"The point i'm trying to make is a few managers will pitch in when they can see the care side struggling but if we miss something that in the big scheme of things doesn't matter because we are doing what we are primarily there for they have a hissy fit!

I was pulled aside this morning and was asked why someone wasn't up! They had refused to get up and wanted to lie in. The other care staff and nurses were fine. But the manager kept asking why!!!!! If I physically got them out of bed its abuse and I can lose my job.

"

see it's little things like that, that doesn't fit into a nice little tick box. Having managed and had managers it's unfortunate that everything today seems to be about tick boxes, accountability, and the bottom line, targets etc

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It is the managers role to manage the team and ensure the smooth and efficient running of that team.

The issue of the sugar bowl, whilst it may seem trivial and there may appear to be other things more important to do, in fact its quite important.

You can't have anyone handling food in a care facility. People who handle food require a food hygiene certificate. It would not be entirely beneficial to have the domestic staff doing this, they may have just cleaned toilets.

If the care home is independant and has not commissioned infection control training for staff on how to wash hands etc, and you get anyone filling up food bowls without washing their hands, and the residents have their tea and biscuits, and a day later an outbreak of diarrhoea and vomiting occurs, which could lead to the home being closed for a short time and the Health Protection Agency involved.

See its not always as clear cut as people sitting on their arses not bothering to fill sugar bowls

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

I used to do care work many years ago and tho a care worker may have any jobs from helping someone to the loo to making cups of tea job are ment to be prioritised, you dont leave someone sat in wet underwear because a sugar bowl needs filling and if the homes having a bad day and lots of people are needing on going help sometimes the sugar bowl gets left, how do you decide when to leave someone in need in order to do such trivial jobs

If a family member turned up to find their loved one in bed buzzing for help and noone there to respond because they was all doing jobs like, making tea, putting towels away etc the manager would be the first to pull you up infront of that family member for not putting the person first when it was them who told you to go do jobs like fulling sugar bowls, been there, done it, got the t shirt

and to be honest i dis agree a good manager would full the sugar bowl for you if it was busy and all the care workers was busy doing important jobs...like caring, its not a case of doing your job its called team work and the manager is part of that team because at the end of the day a managers is only as good as their staff, look after them and they look after you "

I agree with the point you made at the end of your post but question some of the points made earlier.

You seem to infer that on occassion you cannot have good care and good standards at the same time, that should never be acceptable to any manager, it certainly wouldn't be acceptable to a customer or 'family member' as you put it.

If a customer visiting an elderly relative found that relative had been waiting an unnacceptable amount of time for a requested cup of tea, I'm sure they would question the standards of the care home and the so called 'trivial job' becomes a documented complaint possibly resulting in a lost customer, lost revenue and we all know where that eventually leads. They don't really care about the other patients they're paying for a service and certain standard of service.

Prioritising and 'spinning plates' is part of every job.

I disagree with you, a good manager doesn't have to fill the sugar bowls, they have to set the standard and ensure they have adequate well trained staff to maintain the care and standards required to meet all customer expectations. It's not easy when most work to tight budget constraints, but as I said earlier, it's easy to underestimate management.

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By *am sampsonMan
over a year ago

cwmbran


"

Prioritising and 'spinning plates' is part of every job.

I disagree with you, a good manager doesn't have to fill the sugar bowls, they have to set the standard and ensure they have adequate well trained staff to maintain the care and standards required to meet all customer expectations. It's not easy when most work to tight budget constraints, but as I said earlier, it's easy to underestimate management. "

And therein lies the problem when a plate is dropped too few managers are prepared to accept that staff were doing their best and will single them out for blame - despite the fact that Managers for whatever reason have failed to ensure that there is adequate staff in place to provide the service and standards required

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

Prioritising and 'spinning plates' is part of every job.

I disagree with you, a good manager doesn't have to fill the sugar bowls, they have to set the standard and ensure they have adequate well trained staff to maintain the care and standards required to meet all customer expectations. It's not easy when most work to tight budget constraints, but as I said earlier, it's easy to underestimate management.

And therein lies the problem when a plate is dropped too few managers are prepared to accept that staff were doing their best and will single them out for blame - despite the fact that Managers for whatever reason have failed to ensure that there is adequate staff in place to provide the service and standards required"

I couldn't agree with you more, that's bad management.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

You see less when your looking up. Those a notch up, see more looking over...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Been doing my managers jobs all my working life, never came across a manager worthy of the name. What I don't understand, is no matter how incompetent they are, no-one above them seems to notice........

You mean nobody has noticed your wonderful talent for doing the job of your superiors better than they can do it? How do you get through the day with so much pent up frustration? "

Strange that you think a manager knows how to do the job of the people he 'manages'. That is almost never the case. Most business' are run, despite managers, by a handful of quality staff. Guess you must be a 'manager' to think otherwise. 'Pent up frustration'?, don't make me laugh. I have the best job in the world. Haven't even seen my 'manager' for over 2 years, yet he thinks he's hands on! Lol

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

crap ...thought this was about football !!! always has been always will be the way it goes . As much as we all think we would do things differently prob would end up doing the same .

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

Been doing my managers jobs all my working life, never came across a manager worthy of the name. What I don't understand, is no matter how incompetent they are, no-one above them seems to notice........

I appreciate the point you are making, but you're missing the point to a degree. Their primary function as a manager is to manage you and get the best out of their team, if you're doing a good job and the rest of the team are then the result is all that matters up the line, they are obviously managing in a way that is effective.

That said if over a long term they are taking the team for granted and demoralising a good team that will eventually show in the results.

The key is a manager doesn't have to be competent at doing your job, they just have to be good at getting you to do your job well. "

I understand what you say, but I'm not missing the point. When your manager doesn't know his arse from his elbow, and it is necessary to circumvent him to enable the smooth running of the department, he is lazy & incompetent, period.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

Been doing my managers jobs all my working life, never came across a manager worthy of the name. What I don't understand, is no matter how incompetent they are, no-one above them seems to notice........

I appreciate the point you are making, but you're missing the point to a degree. Their primary function as a manager is to manage you and get the best out of their team, if you're doing a good job and the rest of the team are then the result is all that matters up the line, they are obviously managing in a way that is effective.

That said if over a long term they are taking the team for granted and demoralising a good team that will eventually show in the results.

The key is a manager doesn't have to be competent at doing your job, they just have to be good at getting you to do your job well. "

See I agree with most of this except the last statement. A manager who has been promoted from the job his team do (and that he could do well, hence one of the reasons he got promoted) in my experience is almost always a better manager than someone with the same skills who hasn't, as he can empathise with his teams workload, train them from his own experiences, and will find it easier to spot skivers.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

See I agree with most of this except the last statement. A manager who has been promoted from the job his team do (and that he could do well, hence one of the reasons he got promoted) in my experience is almost always a better manager than someone with the same skills who hasn't, as he can empathise with his teams workload, train them from his own experiences, and will find it easier to spot skivers."

I agree. Would much rather 'go over the top' with someone with a battlefield promotion, than someone straight out of Sandhurst.

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By *ovedupstillCouple
over a year ago

mullinwire

always find that those 'promoted' through the ranks, especially in Japanese companies, as they tend not to sack people, just move them around if they suck, are no good at anything.

lets be honest, if you are fantastic at what you do, why on earth would a company want to move you from that position?

its those that cant do the job they either move sideways, or promote, which means you get people that arent qualified getting positions higher than yourself.

thats how you get such a disgruntled workforce.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

The key is a manager doesn't have to be competent at doing your job, they just have to be good at getting you to do your job well.

See I agree with most of this except the last statement. A manager who has been promoted from the job his team do (and that he could do well, hence one of the reasons he got promoted) in my experience is almost always a better manager than someone with the same skills who hasn't, as he can empathise with his teams workload, train them from his own experiences, and will find it easier to spot skivers."

Good point but I stand by my statement.

Take the football world as an example, Jose Mourinio possibly currently the best manager in the game never played professional football, Alex Ferguson the best manager over the last 2 decades has never been a goalkeeper or a midfielder. There are a huge number of examples within the business world.

Being competent in a role doesn't determine success in managing others carrying out that role. If it did all management roles would be filled internally.

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By *istress_L-Captain OP   Couple
over a year ago

Southport

One of the best managers we have started on the care side. She is able to point out what we need to do but is willing to help out if a bit of cleaning.

Our big boss is always willing to get his hands dirty. I have seen him wash up, Hoover and help set up the dinning room removing dirty dishes etc. He is capable of helping us but is also capable of telling us where we are going wrong.

I respect him as a manager and he has a wicked sense of humour. The problem is why does one of the other managers think its below him to help the team out when they haven't stopped all shift

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

I agree. Would much rather 'go over the top' with someone with a battlefield promotion, than someone straight out of Sandhurst."

I on the other hand would much rather 'go over the top' with someone who has gone through an exacting selection process and been specifically trained to lead me over the top, rather than someone who got lucky because they were in the right place at the right time or was the only option available!

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By *ovedupstillCouple
over a year ago

mullinwire


"

I agree. Would much rather 'go over the top' with someone with a battlefield promotion, than someone straight out of Sandhurst.

I on the other hand would much rather 'go over the top' with someone who has gone through an exacting selection process and been specifically trained to lead me over the top, rather than someone who got lucky because they were in the right place at the right time or was the only option available! "

kind of agree with you, but all the training and pieces of paper in the world arent to say you can man manage, and thats where its at with todays workforce.

40 years ago when everyone, even the women, had beards, everything was hard and there were very few cases of workplace bullying because people got on with it but now management is a very different animal.

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By *waymanMan
over a year ago

newcastle


"when i worked in nursing home carers attended to residents and domestics/kitchen staff attended to little things like sugar bowls preparing food .n idont blame you for not wanting to leave some 1 in bath....yes some managers sit in their little offices doing so called paper work i.e sitting on their erses lol x

The 'so called paper work' is at least as important as the patient sitting in the bath.

Without the paperwork and budgets being correct then the care home would probably go bust so there'd be no patient and no care worker!

It's always easy to underestimate the role of management. "

You might want to re-read that first sentence.

If you aren't caring for the clients there is no point doing the paperwork. Simple as.

Part of the problem in social care, as in many other parts of public services, is that the conflict between the needs of the client and the demands of the professional client (i.e. the person paying the bill or demanding regulatory reports and the like) can mean that the only genuine value, the delivery of care, gets downvalues.

It's why tabloid campaigns about the number of bureaucrats have such resonance, because people instinctively understand that the only real value is the delivery of care, not the completion of paperwork. The task of management is to reduce the waste involved in non-care activities to the minimum....

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

The 'so called paper work' is at least as important as the patient sitting in the bath.

Without the paperwork and budgets being correct then the care home would probably go bust so there'd be no patient and no care worker!

It's always easy to underestimate the role of management.

You might want to re-read that first sentence.

If you aren't caring for the clients there is no point doing the paperwork. Simple as.

...."

Who said or infered anything about not caring for the clients?

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By *waymanMan
over a year ago

newcastle


"

The 'so called paper work' is at least as important as the patient sitting in the bath.

Without the paperwork and budgets being correct then the care home would probably go bust so there'd be no patient and no care worker!

It's always easy to underestimate the role of management.

You might want to re-read that first sentence.

If you aren't caring for the clients there is no point doing the paperwork. Simple as.

....

Who said or infered anything about not caring for the clients?"

How can I comment on what other people may have inferred from your remarks? That's just daft.

You said "The 'so called paper work' is at least as important as the patient sitting in the bath."

It's not. It's all waste, and management's job is to spend as little money on admin as possible.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The simple fact is that we all make mistakes at work and we all choose to work in ways that other people disagree with.

For some reason when you're a manager, those things make you an idiot, a hindrance and a bad boss. I don't know what that reason is - jealousy? Bitterness about not getting to do what you want when you want?

Sure, there are bad managers out there but there are also plenty of good managers who still get no end of flack. Personally, I think it's all just a bit tedious and unfair.

In particular things like "I've been doing my manager's job for years" annoy me - no. Just no. Your manager's job is to get the work done, using the resources (including human resources) he has available. If you're doing the work required then that IS him doing his job, right there.

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By *waymanMan
over a year ago

newcastle


"The simple fact is that we all make mistakes at work and we all choose to work in ways that other people disagree with.

For some reason when you're a manager, those things make you an idiot, a hindrance and a bad boss. I don't know what that reason is - jealousy? Bitterness about not getting to do what you want when you want?

Sure, there are bad managers out there but there are also plenty of good managers who still get no end of flack. Personally, I think it's all just a bit tedious and unfair.

In particular things like "I've been doing my manager's job for years" annoy me - no. Just no. Your manager's job is to get the work done, using the resources (including human resources) he has available. If you're doing the work required then that IS him doing his job, right there."

That rather depends on whether you're doing what you do because of his efforts, or despite him...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"That rather depends on whether you're doing what you do because of his efforts, or despite him..."

No it doesn't. His work is getting done either way, he's doing his job either way. In the case where the staff would still achieve without him (ie, the case where they achieve despite him) his job is simply easier.

A good team makes a manager's job easier - nothing surprising about that, is there?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"

....

Who said or infered anything about not caring for the clients?

How can I comment on what other people may have inferred from your remarks? That's just daft.

"

I haven't asked you to read into others inference from my remarks, simply read theirs.


"

u said "The 'so called paper work' is at least as important as the patient sitting in the bath."

It's not. It's all waste, and management's job is to spend as little money on admin as possible.

"

Of course it is! Without managing the paperwork, ie the budget, the resources, the regulatory requirements, the P&L etc there is no care home! No care home means no patient in the bath.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The simple fact is that we all make mistakes at work and we all choose to work in ways that other people disagree with.

For some reason when you're a manager, those things make you an idiot, a hindrance and a bad boss. I don't know what that reason is - jealousy? Bitterness about not getting to do what you want when you want?

Sure, there are bad managers out there but there are also plenty of good managers who still get no end of flack. Personally, I think it's all just a bit tedious and unfair.

In particular things like "I've been doing my manager's job for years" annoy me - no. Just no. Your manager's job is to get the work done, using the resources (including human resources) he has available. If you're doing the work required then that IS him doing his job, right there."

Very well said.

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By *waymanMan
over a year ago

newcastle


"

....

Who said or infered anything about not caring for the clients?

How can I comment on what other people may have inferred from your remarks? That's just daft.

I haven't asked you to read into others inference from my remarks, simply read theirs.

u said "The 'so called paper work' is at least as important as the patient sitting in the bath."

It's not. It's all waste, and management's job is to spend as little money on admin as possible.

Of course it is! Without managing the paperwork, ie the budget, the resources, the regulatory requirements, the P&L etc there is no care home! No care home means no patient in the bath. "

You seem determine dot find an excuse to use exclamation marks. I don't know why. The kind of thinking you're espousing is stone age bureaucracy; start with what the client values, and work from there, not from what the bureaucracy has decided matters.

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By *emmefataleWoman
over a year ago

dirtybigbadsgirlville

As a manager of any sort you have to delegate. I had trouble doing this at first but ended up getting totally snowed under...so learnt quickly I had to. People whoarent or have no experience being management will always say "I'm doing their job" chances are that you may not cope with their workload either and find yourself doing exactly the same thing.

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