FabSwingers.com forum: Ignorance is *not* bliss...

By *verage Joe Black OP Man
over a year ago

Border Area

...but it *is* worryingly commonplace.

I followed the "bareback" thread with a mixture of frustration and despair over the past few days.

As a result I felt compelled to pen this thread.

I'm somewhat astounded at the prevalent ignorance of STIs and STDs (yes, there is a difference) and the relevant preventative and retrospective measures that responsible people in this type of lifestyle should be more aware of and embracing.

Reading the thread, a few people mentioned testing but most champion the use of condoms as the be all and end all. Worryingly many posts come across with a smug kind of "I'm using condoms, I'm not like those fools who don't."

First off: do people know that there are many STIs that condoms do not and cannot protect against?

Google "The STIs That Condoms Don't Protect Against". Of the credible sources that appear, the Australian Health board page is pretty good, but the most useful and succinct is on the self.com posting.

Condoms (used properly) help protect against STIs and STDs that are carried in bodily fluids. Many STIs transmit through skin to skin contact.

And reflect on this: how many of you Use condoms when engaging in oral sex?

How many of you have had a particularly vigorous sex session and the condom came off?

How many of you know that condom use has a 80-92% chance of stopping HIV?

As someone who was bewildered and angry to have gotten an STI many years ago despite using condoms,

I have educated myself in the interim.

The only effective strategy for maintaining sexual health is:

1. Common sense about partners / situations

2. *Careful* Condom use when the situation suggests so (likely to be most cases)

3. Regular testing - the most effective and important step which many seem to ignore

4. Sharing of test results - this is easy now as most clinics email results or give you online access

5. Educating ourselves to remove condom ignorance

6. Removing STI phobia: people get them and get cured from them, like common cold or chest infection.

So please, please, please: stop this myth that condoms is the be all and end all. It's not. It's just another preventative measure in your array - testing is the main component in your sexual health.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"...but it *is* worryingly commonplace.

I followed the "bareback" thread with a mixture of frustration and despair over the past few days.

As a result I felt compelled to pen this thread.

First off: do people know that there are many STIs that condoms do not and cannot protect against?

Condoms (used properly) help protect against STIs and STDs that are carried in bodily fluids. Many STIs transmit through skin to skin contact.

And reflect on this: how many of you Use condoms when engaging in oral sex?

How many of you have had a particularly vigorous sex session and the condom came off?

How many of you know that condom use has a 80-92% chance of stopping HIV?

As someone who was bewildered and angry to have gotten an STI many years ago despite using condoms,

I have educated myself in the interim.

The only effective strategy for maintaining sexual health is:

1. Common sense about partners / situations

2. *Careful* Condom use when the situation suggests so (likely to be most cases)

3. Regular testing - the most effective and important step which many seem to ignore

4. Sharing of test results - this is easy now as most clinics email results or give you online access

5. Educating ourselves to remove condom ignorance

6. Removing STI phobia: people get them and get cured from them, like common cold or chest infection.

So please, please, please: stop this myth that condoms is the be all and end all. It's not. It's just another preventative measure in your array - testing is the main component in your sexual health.

You can call me a weirdo but I do tests every 3 months altogether with a usual health check up. No matter if had sex or not.

Thanks OP! I hope more people will do regular check ups.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"...but it *is* worryingly commonplace.

I followed the "bareback" thread with a mixture of frustration and despair over the past few days.

As a result I felt compelled to pen this thread.

First off: do people know that there are many STIs that condoms do not and cannot protect against?

Condoms (used properly) help protect against STIs and STDs that are carried in bodily fluids. Many STIs transmit through skin to skin contact.

And reflect on this: how many of you Use condoms when engaging in oral sex?

How many of you have had a particularly vigorous sex session and the condom came off?

How many of you know that condom use has a 80-92% chance of stopping HIV?

As someone who was bewildered and angry to have gotten an STI many years ago despite using condoms,

I have educated myself in the interim.

The only effective strategy for maintaining sexual health is:

1. Common sense about partners / situations

2. *Careful* Condom use when the situation suggests so (likely to be most cases)

3. Regular testing - the most effective and important step which many seem to ignore

4. Sharing of test results - this is easy now as most clinics email results or give you online access

5. Educating ourselves to remove condom ignorance

6. Removing STI phobia: people get them and get cured from them, like common cold or chest infection.

So please, please, please: stop this myth that condoms is the be all and end all. It's not. It's just another preventative measure in your array - testing is the main component in your sexual health.

You can call me a weirdo but I do tests every 3 months altogether with a usual health check up. No matter if had sex or not.

Thanks OP! I hope more people will do regular check ups. "

Every 3 months!! when I got tested the clinic said unless you haven't had sex in 3 months the test will not be conclusive.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Great post op. The condom, safe sex topic has been always discussed to death on fab and your right many aren't aware of the full risks we all take even when using condom's. You would imagine on an adult swing site the topic wouldn't need to be raised over and over thou but it looks like there are still many who haven't a clue

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"...but it *is* worryingly commonplace.

I followed the "bareback" thread with a mixture of frustration and despair over the past few days.

As a result I felt compelled to pen this thread.

First off: do people know that there are many STIs that condoms do not and cannot protect against?

Condoms (used properly) help protect against STIs and STDs that are carried in bodily fluids. Many STIs transmit through skin to skin contact.

And reflect on this: how many of you Use condoms when engaging in oral sex?

How many of you have had a particularly vigorous sex session and the condom came off?

How many of you know that condom use has a 80-92% chance of stopping HIV?

As someone who was bewildered and angry to have gotten an STI many years ago despite using condoms,

I have educated myself in the interim.

The only effective strategy for maintaining sexual health is:

1. Common sense about partners / situations

2. *Careful* Condom use when the situation suggests so (likely to be most cases)

3. Regular testing - the most effective and important step which many seem to ignore

4. Sharing of test results - this is easy now as most clinics email results or give you online access

5. Educating ourselves to remove condom ignorance

6. Removing STI phobia: people get them and get cured from them, like common cold or chest infection.

So please, please, please: stop this myth that condoms is the be all and end all. It's not. It's just another preventative measure in your array - testing is the main component in your sexual health.

You can call me a weirdo but I do tests every 3 months altogether with a usual health check up. No matter if had sex or not.

Thanks OP! I hope more people will do regular check ups.

Every 3 months!! when I got tested the clinic said unless you haven't had sex in 3 months the test will not be conclusive."

I don't mind. I do it as a part of my routine check ups.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Every 3 months!! when I got tested the clinic said unless you haven't had sex in 3 months the test will not be conclusive."

Hence the 3 month testing

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By *ryst In IsoldeWoman
over a year ago

your imagination

Well said OP! One of those occasions when an applause emoji would be appropriate

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Well said OP, the level of ignorance here is astounding. At this stage the words "clean" and "safe" make me roll my eyes.

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By *oghunter33Woman
over a year ago

on the hill NordWest of

Tbh I find your post a bit assumptive and patronising.

The logical answer to said thread if you're not into barebacking is 'using condoms'. Those two expressions are kinda antonyms.

Just because they gave a simple answer to a simply phrased question doesn't mean that people have no or little knowledge about sti's and don't get tested (regularly).

Anyhow I give you a

from for your 6 point maintaining-sexual-health programme. Pity you didn't frame it with a positive reminder.

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By *verage Joe Black OP Man
over a year ago

Border Area

"Tbh I find your post a bit assumptive and patronising.

The logical answer to said thread if you're not into barebacking is 'using condoms'. Those two expressions are kinda antonyms.

Just because they gave a simple answer to a simply phrased question doesn't mean that people have no or little knowledge about sti's and don't get tested (regularly).

Anyhow I give you a

from for your 6 point maintaining-sexual-health programme. Pity you didn't frame it with a positive reminder."

I take your point DH. It's difficult to try and be unemotional about subjects that you feel strongly about and in actual fact I tried hard not to sound condescending and "school master" like. I actually stopped short of making the assertion that a % of the people holding the view that they used condoms "so they are ok" have undiagnosed STIs...!

Not as sure I'd agree on the assumptive point though. Like many threads, the OP of "barebacking" asked a simple question and set the tone, but it roared off and took on a different direction as people shared their interpretation and broader views on the subject.

So this thread was based on the views being shared, not the original post and hence the reasons I started a new thread, so as not to further divert or perhaps subvert the OPs topic.

A respectful wink to your check and balance though

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

From personal experience of discussing safe sex and regular testing with people from vanilla world and some newbies on fab - it's the vanilla world that is more dangerous.

Something about joining fab makes people want to go be safe and get tested meanwhile peeps who swarm on the likes of pof or go on a pull on a regular night out aren't afraid to bareback "sure it's a one off, it'll be grand", "what do I need to get tested for, not like I'm on some swingers site having orgies" and lots of other ridiculous excuses.

Some never get tested in their lives as it's "too shameful to sit at the gum clinic, what if someine sees me". Think I pretty much heard it all by now from ones that truly don't have a clue

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By *verage Joe Black OP Man
over a year ago

Border Area

"From personal experience of discussing safe sex and regular testing with people from vanilla world and some newbies on fab - it's the vanilla world that is more dangerous.

Some never get tested in their lives as it's "too shameful to sit at the gum clinic, what if someine sees me". Think I pretty much heard it all by now from ones that truly don't have a clue

Testing is so easy these days. There are so many options, anonymity assured and having quick online or emailed access to results is straightforward. Nearly all tests are quick and rarely uncomfortable.

It nearly makes the *very* occasional test where a (usually male) nurse feels like Hannibal Lector ramming a chainsaw up your japs eye worthwhile..

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"From personal experience of discussing safe sex and regular testing with people from vanilla world and some newbies on fab - it's the vanilla world that is more dangerous.

Some never get tested in their lives as it's "too shameful to sit at the gum clinic, what if someine sees me". Think I pretty much heard it all by now from ones that truly don't have a clue

You gorgeous girl are always the voice of reason. I told two of my vanilla friends I had joined Fab. They said I would be riddled with everything. I have being tested three times in the year I have being here and am very selective with my play partners. They on the other hand had being less selective about their Tinder date's and don't find it necessary to be tested as they are too mortified to attend a clinic.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"...but it *is* worryingly commonplace.

I followed the "bareback" thread with a mixture of frustration and despair over the past few days.

As a result I felt compelled to pen this thread.

First off: do people know that there are many STIs that condoms do not and cannot protect against?

Condoms (used properly) help protect against STIs and STDs that are carried in bodily fluids. Many STIs transmit through skin to skin contact.

And reflect on this: how many of you Use condoms when engaging in oral sex?

How many of you have had a particularly vigorous sex session and the condom came off?

How many of you know that condom use has a 80-92% chance of stopping HIV?

As someone who was bewildered and angry to have gotten an STI many years ago despite using condoms,

I have educated myself in the interim.

The only effective strategy for maintaining sexual health is:

1. Common sense about partners / situations

2. *Careful* Condom use when the situation suggests so (likely to be most cases)

3. Regular testing - the most effective and important step which many seem to ignore

4. Sharing of test results - this is easy now as most clinics email results or give you online access

5. Educating ourselves to remove condom ignorance

6. Removing STI phobia: people get them and get cured from them, like common cold or chest infection.

So please, please, please: stop this myth that condoms is the be all and end all. It's not. It's just another preventative measure in your array - testing is the main component in your sexual health.

I like the number 4 but it did not work, I was considering sex without a condom with a guy. I shared my results and asked for his, he couldn't and then proceeded say he would but didn't. So I didn't and moved on. I must get better with condoms with oral I tried once but I got empty reaches. I see other taking about flavoured condoms I must be looking in the wrong place for them. Where can I get them and better condoms, I hear skins are good,can they be bought flavoured aswell. Where can I purchase these at good value and big packets? Thank you OP for the reminder of just how risky it is, this is why I don't play a whole lot now and especially in different groups, big groups etc.

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By *evil_u_knowMan
over a year ago

city

If you read a lot of bareback threads you will find out that using condoms is just one thing people who use condoms do.

Not all but a lot of them cut out riskier play, and riskier groups of people.

They often say just one bareback pic with another person will result in them never meeting a person.

Sometimes Bi guys complain that women turn them down over sti concerns alone. While it might be annoying for them, they are indeed a higher risk group.

African born people are the highest risk group in Ireland.

Then Gay men (or people in a mans body).

Then Bi men (or people in a mans body).

then gay bi women (or people in a womans body)

Then it gets onto people who engage in risky sex (like swinging)

then it goes way down to people who get tattoos.

then right at the bottom is normal Irish man and Iris woman, where their odds of getting/having sti/std are basically close to zero.

Other nationalities like brazil are high, I just dont know where they are in the list.

We all just have to decide what risks we want to take, and condom users usually reduce risks in a number of ways.

I for example use listerine on my genitals as it cuts out ghonerrea transfer, etc. I limit some of my exposure to some of the groups above. If a condom breaks on me I take 6 months off sex till i get an all clear. I don't cheat or mess people about, I don't lie about what I want or do with others. Now and again I do higher my risks for example in an mmf I am not pushed if the other guy is bi etc.

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By *hocoholicWoman
over a year ago

The big D

"...but it *is* worryingly commonplace.

I followed the "bareback" thread with a mixture of frustration and despair over the past few days.

As a result I felt compelled to pen this thread.

First off: do people know that there are many STIs that condoms do not and cannot protect against?

Condoms (used properly) help protect against STIs and STDs that are carried in bodily fluids. Many STIs transmit through skin to skin contact.

And reflect on this: how many of you Use condoms when engaging in oral sex?

How many of you have had a particularly vigorous sex session and the condom came off?

How many of you know that condom use has a 80-92% chance of stopping HIV?

As someone who was bewildered and angry to have gotten an STI many years ago despite using condoms,

I have educated myself in the interim.

The only effective strategy for maintaining sexual health is:

1. Common sense about partners / situations

2. *Careful* Condom use when the situation suggests so (likely to be most cases)

3. Regular testing - the most effective and important step which many seem to ignore

4. Sharing of test results - this is easy now as most clinics email results or give you online access

5. Educating ourselves to remove condom ignorance

6. Removing STI phobia: people get them and get cured from them, like common cold or chest infection.

So please, please, please: stop this myth that condoms is the be all and end all. It's not. It's just another preventative measure in your array - testing is the main component in your sexual health.

Once again I’m on the side of Doghunter on a post. Each OP that posts a topic has a reason & of course is entitled to it. My opinion on your post OP is that altho it may come across as educational & concern but it’s very judgemental & condescending.

There’s just so much of it in ur post that I can’t cover it all. Summary is that when words like ‘ignorance, astounded, compelled, frustrated & despair’ are used its in a patronising way.

When u tell us to ‘google’ stuff & state ‘condoms (used properly)’ like we’re buffoons, u lecture on how many of us done/know this/that, u add in a dig at d fact there’s a difference with STI & STD that wasn’t even relevant but more in my opinion a narcissist jibe, u didn’t even aim it at d silly posters but u lectured even ‘responsible people in this type of lifestyle should be more aware’, u even listed a strategy that we should be doing.

A judgemental post labelling us all with stupidity & ignorance is still rude even if u sugar coated it with intelligent words, quotes & facts. On behalf of myself, I am an adult & a swinger, I know abt sexual health & how to look after my own.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

If your worried about being seen in a clinic may I suggest himerus health in Dublin, its on a health care campus so nobody will have any idea of why your there, you can pay cash and the only people you meet are the doctor and receptionist, just give your first name and phone number and they will text you the results, it's all very anomamous, for your own safety and the safety of future partners, as has been said some sti's and std's don't show outward symptoms, great post op

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"If your worried about being seen in a clinic may I suggest himerus health in Dublin, its on a health care campus so nobody will have any idea of why your there, you can pay cash and the only people you meet are the doctor and receptionist, just give your first name and phone number and they will text you the results, it's all very anomamous, for your own safety and the safety of future partners, as has been said some sti's and std's don't show outward symptoms, great post op"

Now go to vanilla world and tell that to every vanilla person you know

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

HSE STI services in Ireland

Carlow

STI Clinic, Carlow District Hospital, Athy Road. Tel: 051 842 646

Clare

STI Clinic, University Hospital Ennis. Tel: 061 482 382

Cork

STI Clinic, South Infirmary Victoria University Hospital, Old Blackrock Road. Tel: 021 496 6844

STI Clinic, Youth Health Service, Penrose House, Penrose Quay, Cork City. Tel: 076 108 4150

Donegal

GUM/ STI Clinic, Letterkenny General Hospital, Letterkenny. Tel: 074 912 3715

Dublin

GUIDE Clinic, St. James’s Hospital, James’s Street, Dublin 8. Tel: 01 416 2315/6

STI Clinic, Mater Hospital, Eccles Street, Dublin 7. Tel: 01 803 2063

Gay Men’s Health Service, Baggot Street Clinic, 18 Upper Baggot St., Dublin 4. Tel: 01 669 9553

Galway

STI Clinic, Portiuncula Hospital, Ballinasloe. Tel: 090 964 8372 (ext 676)

University Hospital Galway, Newcastle Road. Tel: 091 525 200

Kerry

STI Clinic, University Hospital Kerry, Tralee. Tel: 021 496 6844

Laois

STI Clinic, Out patients Dept., Midland Regional Hospital, Block Rd., Portlaoise. Tel: 086 859 1273

Limerick

STI Clinic, University Hospital Limerick, Dooradoyle. Tel: 061 482 382

Louth

GUM Clinic, Louth County Hospital, Dublin Road, Dundalk. Tel: 086 824 1847

STI Clinic, Our Lady of Lourdes Hospital Drogheda. Tel: 086 824 1847

Mayo

STI Clinic, Mayo General Hospital, Castlebar. Tel: 094 902 1733 (ext 3501)

Monaghan

GUM Clinic, Monaghan General Hospital, Monaghan. Tel: 086 824 1847

Sligo

GUM Clinic, Sligo General Hospital, The Mall. Tel: 071 917 0473

Tipperary

STI Clinic, South Tipperary General Hospital, Clonmel. Tel: 051 842 646

STI Clinic, University Hospital Nenagh. Tel: 061 482 382

Waterford

STI Clinic, University Hospital Waterford Dunmore Road. Tel: 051 842 646

Westmeath

STI Clinic, Midland Regional Hospital, Longford Road, Mullingar. Tel: 086 416 9830

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I posted these before but no harm posting again. It's a free confidential consultation

I attend Portlaoise the midwives are lovely there is no need for embarrassment they have seen it all before

I am usually waiting four weeks for a appointment and two weeks for the results

If anyone is too embarrassed to ask questions about this on the forum please Pm me.

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By *verage Joe Black OP Man
over a year ago

Border Area

There’s just so much of it in ur post that I can’t cover it all. Summary is that when words like ‘ignorance, astounded, compelled, frustrated & despair’ are used its in a patronising way.

Ouch!

Well, I will consider myself quite publically rebuked

On reading your specific points and looking over my article again, I agree that it does not come across properly and in so doing loses the the actual ethos of what I was trying to get across.

To those readers who are fully aware, informed and practice good sexual health, please accept my sincere and complete apology: it was not my intention to categorise everyone as being ignorant, ill informed and reckless.

My intention was genuine however I put much of the article across as emotive, clumsy and insulting. Was not my intention.

I do believe in the theme of the post though and hope people can see past the way the message was delivered to some of the messages.

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By *eisejayMan
over a year ago

waterford

As bad as the Health Service is, sti testing (and treatment if you ever need it) is free and confidential in the public hospital-run clinics.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Hopefully people will be able to draw some information and ideas to muse on from this thread. Which I think is the aim.

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By *verage Joe Black OP Man
over a year ago

Border Area

"HSE STI services in Ireland

Carlow

STI Clinic, Carlow District Hospital, Athy Road. Tel: 051 842 646

Clare

STI Clinic, University Hospital Ennis. Tel: 061 482 382

Cork

STI Clinic, South Infirmary Victoria University Hospital, Old Blackrock Road. Tel: 021 496 6844

STI Clinic, Youth Health Service, Penrose House, Penrose Quay, Cork City. Tel: 076 108 4150

Donegal

GUM/ STI Clinic, Letterkenny General Hospital, Letterkenny. Tel: 074 912 3715

Dublin

GUIDE Clinic, St. James’s Hospital, James’s Street, Dublin 8. Tel: 01 416 2315/6

STI Clinic, Mater Hospital, Eccles Street, Dublin 7. Tel: 01 803 2063

Gay Men’s Health Service, Baggot Street Clinic, 18 Upper Baggot St., Dublin 4. Tel: 01 669 9553

Galway

STI Clinic, Portiuncula Hospital, Ballinasloe. Tel: 090 964 8372 (ext 676)

University Hospital Galway, Newcastle Road. Tel: 091 525 200

Kerry

STI Clinic, University Hospital Kerry, Tralee. Tel: 021 496 6844

Laois

STI Clinic, Out patients Dept., Midland Regional Hospital, Block Rd., Portlaoise. Tel: 086 859 1273

Limerick

STI Clinic, University Hospital Limerick, Dooradoyle. Tel: 061 482 382

Louth

GUM Clinic, Louth County Hospital, Dublin Road, Dundalk. Tel: 086 824 1847

STI Clinic, Our Lady of Lourdes Hospital Drogheda. Tel: 086 824 1847

Mayo

STI Clinic, Mayo General Hospital, Castlebar. Tel: 094 902 1733 (ext 3501)

Monaghan

GUM Clinic, Monaghan General Hospital, Monaghan. Tel: 086 824 1847

Sligo

GUM Clinic, Sligo General Hospital, The Mall. Tel: 071 917 0473

Tipperary

STI Clinic, South Tipperary General Hospital, Clonmel. Tel: 051 842 646

STI Clinic, University Hospital Nenagh. Tel: 061 482 382

Waterford

STI Clinic, University Hospital Waterford Dunmore Road. Tel: 051 842 646

Westmeath

STI Clinic, Midland Regional Hospital, Longford Road, Mullingar. Tel: 086 416 9830"

Thanks RosyRed

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By *adylaceWoman
over a year ago

Waterford City

I’m delighted to see people talking about this subject. I know it can be very emotive and people can feel judged by some comments. The most important thing is to get as much information out there as possible. It’s everyones personal responsibility to look after their sexual health and the clinics offer a very discreet professional service. So it’s nothing to be scared of. I used to use my gp for my tests. But recently lost my medical card so I’m back out to the clinic cos it’s free and I had actually forgotten how brilliant they are out there.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I’m delighted to see people talking about this subject. I know it can be very emotive and people can feel judged by some comments. The most important thing is to get as much information out there as possible. It’s everyones personal responsibility to look after their sexual health and the clinics offer a very discreet professional service. So it’s nothing to be scared of. I used to use my gp for my tests. But recently lost my medical card so I’m back out to the clinic cos it’s free and I had actually forgotten how brilliant they are out there. "

From my own personal experience the HSE run a great service. Friendly and welcoming and professional. I can't fault them. The midwives did tell me they wished people used it for regular screenings rather than waiting for symptoms to develop.

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By *adylaceWoman
over a year ago

Waterford City

Totally agree. They’re amazing out there. There might be a lot wrong with our health service. But this is something they’re doing right.

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