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Enoch Burke High Court hearing

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By *ubal1 OP   Man
over a year ago

Newry Down

I spend the last two days listening to and carefully observing some of the Burke family who appeared before Mr Justice Dignam in Court 29 within the historic Four Courts.

Although Enoch Burke was very well prepared, in fact more prepared than all the LIPs,unrepresented litigants, whom I have ever seen before; they made the fundamental error of trying to bully the judge, whom they should have shown more respect.

Crucially, Burke's error is as follows: how can he ask a judge to injunct a school when he had shown contempt for the school's injunctions.

This is fundamental to the law of Equity in the courts: the applicant has to have clean hands, to coin a phrase.

Enoch Burke does not!

Finally, the manner in which Burke's mother, Martina, and his sister, Ammi berated and badgered the judge was shocking and probably unprecedented in an Irish court.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ursecretmischiefCouple
over a year ago

The West

That wasn't a fundamental error, that is who they are and how they think.

They genuinely believe they're above the law and above everybody else also. Seeking the injunction is perfectly reasonable, in their eyes.

Like all fundamentally religious people or groups, it has litle to do with their belief system...its about control.

A lot of people still can't see that!

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"That wasn't a fundamental error, that is who they are and how they think.

They genuinely believe they're above the law and above everybody else also. Seeking the injunction is perfectly reasonable, in their eyes.

Like all fundamentally religious people or groups, it has litle to do with their belief system...its about control.

A lot of people still can't see that!"

Yep

They already tried exactly the same tactics in Ammi's unfair dismissal action, which resulted in the case being thrown out.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ay_Gatsby_D4Man
over a year ago

City Centre, Dublin

The bit that does it for me is that they’re all reported to be highly educated and clever yet they end up with their ma screaming in court because her kids aren’t getting it easy

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I spend the last two days listening to and carefully observing some of the Burke family who appeared before Mr Justice Dignam in Court 29 within the historic Four Courts.

Although Enoch Burke was very well prepared, in fact more prepared than all the LIPs,unrepresented litigants, whom I have ever seen before; they made the fundamental error of trying to bully the judge, whom they should have shown more respect.

Crucially, Burke's error is as follows: how can he ask a judge to injunct a school when he had shown contempt for the school's injunctions.

This is fundamental to the law of Equity in the courts: the applicant has to have clean hands, to coin a phrase.

Enoch Burke does not!

Finally, the manner in which Burke's mother, Martina, and his sister, Ammi berated and badgered the judge was shocking and probably unprecedented in an Irish court. "

If any judge let’s this happen in their court then they should be removed from the case

Any judge should have held the sister and mother in contempt of court for shouting from the gallery if that’s what we are led too believe

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ubal1 OP   Man
over a year ago

Newry Down

Crucially, Enoch's brother Isaac and his sister Ammi were sitting beside him in their capacity as McKenzie Friends (legal assistants) without having the right to speak (no right of audience).

But seated right behind the three children were the two parents, in the seats that SCs, Senior Counsel, normally occupy.

Very unusual and very intriguing; Mr. Justice Dignam showed restraint, and essentially gave them enough rope to hang themselves.

I predict, with confidence that the Burke family are going to be classified as Vexatious Litigants: this is very serious because you have to obtain special permission to instigate any legal action in any court anywhere in Ireland, if classified as such.

They are on the cusp of this, from my experience.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Gubu comes to mind.... grotesque, unprecedented, bizarre, unbelievable

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ofusplusCouple
over a year ago

Limerick


"The bit that does it for me is that they’re all reported to be highly educated and clever yet they end up with their ma screaming in court because her kids aren’t getting it easy"

Intelligence and common sense are completely different things.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *og-ManMan
over a year ago

somewhere

Jubal

I presume its a hobby of yours to go to various course cases

Do you just go to the high profile ones or do you go to all sorts

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *olouWoman
over a year ago

Swords

Very interesting read ,thank you Jubai,I followed a case in the courts and attended a little part of it in the public area. It was interesting but god the benches were very hard,bring a cushion

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ubal1 OP   Man
over a year ago

Newry Down


"Jubal

I presume its a hobby of yours to go to various course cases

Do you just go to the high profile ones or do you go to all sorts "

I have been to tens of thousands of court hearings all over Ireland, north and south and also in London.

Truthfully, I have had conversations, on the public street, with senior judges including the former Lord Chief Justice of NI.

On one occasion, a judge came down from the Bench and asked for my opinion of his performance, that I provided, bluntly and to the point.

My presence at hearings arouses a lot of interest, from many different people

On one occasion, in NI, several years ago, because of unusual circumstances I was the only member of the public permitted to sit in the public gallery in a serious trial.

I have also acted as a McKenzie Friend, an unpaid legal assistant to a self-represented litigant, with success.

At one time, I used to go to court hearings on six days per week.

If I reveal any more details I would not be difficult to ascertain my real identity. Nuff said!

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Jubal

I presume its a hobby of yours to go to various course cases

Do you just go to the high profile ones or do you go to all sorts

I have been to tens of thousands of court hearings all over Ireland, north and south and also in London.

Truthfully, I have had conversations, on the public street, with senior judges including the former Lord Chief Justice of NI.

On one occasion, a judge came down from the Bench and asked for my opinion of his performance, that I provided, bluntly and to the point.

My presence at hearings arouses a lot of interest, from many different people

On one occasion, in NI, several years ago, because of unusual circumstances I was the only member of the public permitted to sit in the public gallery in a serious trial.

I have also acted as a McKenzie Friend, an unpaid legal assistant to a self-represented litigant, with success.

At one time, I used to go to court hearings on six days per week.

If I reveal any more details I would not be difficult to ascertain my real identity. Nuff said! "

The man is entitled to his views

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Jubal

I presume its a hobby of yours to go to various course cases

Do you just go to the high profile ones or do you go to all sorts

I have been to tens of thousands of court hearings all over Ireland, north and south and also in London.

Truthfully, I have had conversations, on the public street, with senior judges including the former Lord Chief Justice of NI.

On one occasion, a judge came down from the Bench and asked for my opinion of his performance, that I provided, bluntly and to the point.

My presence at hearings arouses a lot of interest, from many different people

On one occasion, in NI, several years ago, because of unusual circumstances I was the only member of the public permitted to sit in the public gallery in a serious trial.

I have also acted as a McKenzie Friend, an unpaid legal assistant to a self-represented litigant, with success.

At one time, I used to go to court hearings on six days per week.

If I reveal any more details I would not be difficult to ascertain my real identity. Nuff said!

The man is entitled to his views "

And privacy

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ubal1 OP   Man
over a year ago

Newry Down


"Gubu comes to mind.... grotesque, unprecedented, bizarre, unbelievable "

The case was unusual in the manner in which the murderer Malcolm McArthur was found in the Irish Attorney-General's house!

I think the latter's name was Connolly.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Gubu comes to mind.... grotesque, unprecedented, bizarre, unbelievable

The case was unusual in the manner in which the murderer Malcolm McArthur was found in the Irish Attorney-General's house!

I think the latter's name was Connolly.

"

Google is up the walls over ya jubal I’m fla’d out

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ubal1 OP   Man
over a year ago

Newry Down

I went onto Google Video to check out footage of Enoch, but came across a mass of material about the Burkes in Castlebar, in particular footage of the mother, Martina and Simon, another son, complaining about the conduct of an inquest in their home town

Their reputation certainly precedes them: dogmatic, opinionated, insulting, and certainly unsuited to be in employment. They have to be firmly in control.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *dfabMan
over a year ago

Dunboyne

They have a long history of pure gobshiteness

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I went onto Google Video to check out footage of Enoch, but came across a mass of material about the Burkes in Castlebar, in particular footage of the mother, Martina and Simon, another son, complaining about the conduct of an inquest in their home town

Their reputation certainly precedes them: dogmatic, opinionated, insulting, and certainly unsuited to be in employment. They have to be firmly in control."

I’m supposed too be in bed and in my opinion this guy is just another wako and cult related

That’s just my opinion

S

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Gubu comes to mind.... grotesque, unprecedented, bizarre, unbelievable

The case was unusual in the manner in which the murderer Malcolm McArthur was found in the Irish Attorney-General's house!

I think the latter's name was Connolly.

"

Thats it, exactly....

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ind PaddyMan
over a year ago

South County Dublin


"Crucially, Enoch's brother Isaac and his sister Ammi were sitting beside him in their capacity as McKenzie Friends (legal assistants) without having the right to speak (no right of audience).

But seated right behind the three children were the two parents, in the seats that SCs, Senior Counsel, normally occupy.

Very unusual and very intriguing; Mr. Justice Dignam showed restraint, and essentially gave them enough rope to hang themselves.

I predict, with confidence that the Burke family are going to be classified as Vexatious Litigants: this is very serious because you have to obtain special permission to instigate any legal action in any court anywhere in Ireland, if classified as such.

They are on the cusp of this, from my experience. "

They might have an Iasac Wonder order made against them.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ubal1 OP   Man
over a year ago

Newry Down

The judiciary have now put into a difficult position: we will not give you the injunction you seek, if you will not comply with the school's injunction!

Touche, Enoch! (And Martina, Ammi and Isaac)

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *itemeagainMan
over a year ago

Wexford


"Crucially, Enoch's brother Isaac and his sister Ammi were sitting beside him in their capacity as McKenzie Friends (legal assistants) without having the right to speak (no right of audience).

But seated right behind the three children were the two parents, in the seats that SCs, Senior Counsel, normally occupy.

Very unusual and very intriguing; Mr. Justice Dignam showed restraint, and essentially gave them enough rope to hang themselves.

I predict, with confidence that the Burke family are going to be classified as Vexatious Litigants: this is very serious because you have to obtain special permission to instigate any legal action in any court anywhere in Ireland, if classified as such.

They are on the cusp of this, from my experience. "

Allowing such seating arrangements and allowing enough rope to hang oneself Hints at the possibility of archistration behind such events.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *itemeagainMan
over a year ago

Wexford


"Jubal

I presume its a hobby of yours to go to various course cases

Do you just go to the high profile ones or do you go to all sorts

I have been to tens of thousands of court hearings all over Ireland, north and south and also in London.

Truthfully, I have had conversations, on the public street, with senior judges including the former Lord Chief Justice of NI.

On one occasion, a judge came down from the Bench and asked for my opinion of his performance, that I provided, bluntly and to the point.

My presence at hearings arouses a lot of interest, from many different people

On one occasion, in NI, several years ago, because of unusual circumstances I was the only member of the public permitted to sit in the public gallery in a serious trial.

I have also acted as a McKenzie Friend, an unpaid legal assistant to a self-represented litigant, with success.

At one time, I used to go to court hearings on six days per week.

If I reveal any more details I would not be difficult to ascertain my real identity. Nuff said! "

Why do you do this and how do you fund this ?

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Jubal

I presume its a hobby of yours to go to various course cases

Do you just go to the high profile ones or do you go to all sorts

I have been to tens of thousands of court hearings all over Ireland, north and south and also in London.

Truthfully, I have had conversations, on the public street, with senior judges including the former Lord Chief Justice of NI.

On one occasion, a judge came down from the Bench and asked for my opinion of his performance, that I provided, bluntly and to the point.

My presence at hearings arouses a lot of interest, from many different people

On one occasion, in NI, several years ago, because of unusual circumstances I was the only member of the public permitted to sit in the public gallery in a serious trial.

I have also acted as a McKenzie Friend, an unpaid legal assistant to a self-represented litigant, with success.

At one time, I used to go to court hearings on six days per week.

If I reveal any more details I would not be difficult to ascertain my real identity. Nuff said!

Why do you do this and how do you fund this ? "

I imagine he works or used to work in the legal profession!

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ubal1 OP   Man
over a year ago

Newry Down

I have never worked in the legal profession nor do I have any legal background, but the so-called criminal justice system and also the civil system are of particular interest to me; as are many other aspects of society and humanity.

I could be accurately said to be an observer of human behaviour, and participate too!

Life is interesting and I have been around here for a long time, which I find surprising; that I have managed to last so long!

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *itemeagainMan
over a year ago

Wexford


"I have never worked in the legal profession nor do I have any legal background, but the so-called criminal justice system and also the civil system are of particular interest to me; as are many other aspects of society and humanity.

I could be accurately said to be an observer of human behaviour, and participate too!

Life is interesting and I have been around here for a long time, which I find surprising; that I have managed to last so long!"

Interesting

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *og-ManMan
over a year ago

somewhere


"Jubal

I presume its a hobby of yours to go to various course cases

Do you just go to the high profile ones or do you go to all sorts

I have been to tens of thousands of court hearings all over Ireland, north and south and also in London.

Truthfully, I have had conversations, on the public street, with senior judges including the former Lord Chief Justice of NI.

On one occasion, a judge came down from the Bench and asked for my opinion of his performance, that I provided, bluntly and to the point.

My presence at hearings arouses a lot of interest, from many different people

On one occasion, in NI, several years ago, because of unusual circumstances I was the only member of the public permitted to sit in the public gallery in a serious trial.

I have also acted as a McKenzie Friend, an unpaid legal assistant to a self-represented litigant, with success.

At one time, I used to go to court hearings on six days per week.

If I reveal any more details I would not be difficult to ascertain my real identity. Nuff said!

Why do you do this and how do you fund this ?

I imagine he works or used to work in the legal profession!"

Beginning to think hes a prisoner

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ubal1 OP   Man
over a year ago

Newry Down


"Jubal

I presume its a hobby of yours to go to various course cases

Do you just go to the high profile ones or do you go to all sorts

I have been to tens of thousands of court hearings all over Ireland, north and south and also in London.

Truthfully, I have had conversations, on the public street, with senior judges including the former Lord Chief Justice of NI.

On one occasion, a judge came down from the Bench and asked for my opinion of his performance, that I provided, bluntly and to the point.

My presence at hearings arouses a lot of interest, from many different people

On one occasion, in NI, several years ago, because of unusual circumstances I was the only member of the public permitted to sit in the public gallery in a serious trial.

I have also acted as a McKenzie Friend, an unpaid legal assistant to a self-represented litigant, with success.

At one time, I used to go to court hearings on six days per week.

If I reveal any more details I would not be difficult to ascertain my real identity. Nuff said!

Why do you do this and how do you fund this ? "

It doesn't cost anything to go to the courts: they are the best free show in town; and travel is no problem as I have a free pensioner's travel pass, that is known in the Republic as a PSC. Public Service Card.

On one occasion a judge took objection to the fact that I was turning up so often, that he threw me unto the cells for three hours, and for a few days, in unusual circumstances, I was banned from every court building in NI.

If I told the whole story of what I have done, you would not believe me.

It is not something that I would recommend to anyone.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *adger BrocMan
over a year ago

Co. Cork

[Removed by poster at 17/01/23 22:50:29]

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By *adger BrocMan
over a year ago

Co. Cork

Ah.

A pensioner and not a prisoner.

Not doing time but with lots of free time.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ubal1 OP   Man
over a year ago

Newry Down

Time is the most precious commodity in everyone's lives, and you have to make the most use of it.

I am 67 later this year and I am out and about every single day, watching participating, resolving issues or at least trying to, and making the most constructive use of my valuable time.

I sincerely hope that I die "in harness" to use an old bucolic metaphor.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *winger20212021Man
over a year ago

Malahide

All valid points, buy frankly I'm fed up of hearing about this judgemental dick. Look, he doesn't have to like trans people, but he cannot discriminate or spread hatred full stop.

Does he fhink he's the next Madeba or something?! Sorry Madeba for the association..

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *ursecretmischiefCouple
over a year ago

The West

Despite all the ranting and raving about beliefs and free speech etc.

The last two months has just been a legal/insurance game of cat and mouse, and Burke lost.

He needed his employers to fire him while he was in jail (they were too well advised for that).

The judge needed to be seen upholding his court by holding him in contempt. The judge took the higher ground by realeasing him for Christmas and all was forgotten.

Burke went to the school again,in the hope of being jailed. Its his only avenue for legal proceedings down the line.

But the school legal and insurance teams would not pursue and the judge has stepped away to allow disciplinary hearing to proceed.

Its all just a matter of process now.

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *og-ManMan
over a year ago

somewhere

One thing that's good coming out of the pricks court case

People that never had to think of the issues previously are now thinking of their own families and grandchildren and are saying that if they were transitioning they'd have full family support

My parents in their mid 80's have changed their minds or opened their minds completely and voted yes to Divorce,Abortion,Same sex marriage simply because of their grandchildren and great grandchildren

They also think Burke is a gobshite

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *itemeagainMan
over a year ago

Wexford


"One thing that's good coming out of the pricks court case

People that never had to think of the issues previously are now thinking of their own families and grandchildren and are saying that if they were transitioning they'd have full family support

My parents in their mid 80's have changed their minds or opened their minds completely and voted yes to Divorce,Abortion,Same sex marriage simply because of their grandchildren and great grandchildren

They also think Burke is a gobshite "

The bit that I don't like is that everyone jumps on the lynch wagon when someone goes against the grain .

Granted its not anyone's place to impose their morals/beliefs onto anyone else.

By doing so you must accept the consequences.

However this applies to us all surly .

In the vain if this man took his own life tonight , because the lynch mob imposed their morals/beliefs onto him, it would be a consequence of their making .

Would those who impose their way of thinking on him be ok with his consequential death ?

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *itemeagainMan
over a year ago

Wexford

In that vain ...

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *og-ManMan
over a year ago

somewhere


"One thing that's good coming out of the pricks court case

People that never had to think of the issues previously are now thinking of their own families and grandchildren and are saying that if they were transitioning they'd have full family support

My parents in their mid 80's have changed their minds or opened their minds completely and voted yes to Divorce,Abortion,Same sex marriage simply because of their grandchildren and great grandchildren

They also think Burke is a gobshite

The bit that I don't like is that everyone jumps on the lynch wagon when someone goes against the grain .

Granted its not anyone's place to impose their morals/beliefs onto anyone else.

By doing so you must accept the consequences.

However this applies to us all surly .

In the vain if this man took his own life tonight , because the lynch mob imposed their morals/beliefs onto him, it would be a consequence of their making .

Would those who impose their way of thinking on him be ok with his consequential death ?

"

Isn't he trying to impose his moral beliefs on to everyone else

I mean I don't believe in God and think the whole religion thing is just a fairy tale to control people,make money and r**e children but I just think him and his whole family are pricks

I also believe it's down to the mother and father for brainwashing the kids in the first place

If he takes his own life its down to them but Id imagine its against their religious beliefs anyway

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *andytownMan
over a year ago

Gods Own Country


"Time is the most precious commodity in everyone's lives, and you have to make the most use of it.

I am 67 later this year and I am out and about every single day, watching participating, resolving issues or at least trying to, and making the most constructive use of my valuable time.

I sincerely hope that I die "in harness" to use an old bucolic metaphor."

For a moment there I thought you were Bryson

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *itemeagainMan
over a year ago

Wexford


"One thing that's good coming out of the pricks court case

People that never had to think of the issues previously are now thinking of their own families and grandchildren and are saying that if they were transitioning they'd have full family support

My parents in their mid 80's have changed their minds or opened their minds completely and voted yes to Divorce,Abortion,Same sex marriage simply because of their grandchildren and great grandchildren

They also think Burke is a gobshite

The bit that I don't like is that everyone jumps on the lynch wagon when someone goes against the grain .

Granted its not anyone's place to impose their morals/beliefs onto anyone else.

By doing so you must accept the consequences.

However this applies to us all surly .

In the vain if this man took his own life tonight , because the lynch mob imposed their morals/beliefs onto him, it would be a consequence of their making .

Would those who impose their way of thinking on him be ok with his consequential death ?

Isn't he trying to impose his moral beliefs on to everyone else

I mean I don't believe in God and think the whole religion thing is just a fairy tale to control people,make money and r**e children but I just think him and his whole family are pricks

I also believe it's down to the mother and father for brainwashing the kids in the first place

If he takes his own life its down to them but Id imagine its against their religious beliefs anyway "

Yes I agree too a point . I don't know that he is imposing his beliefs on all of us are just wanting to live his life through his own beliefs. However I can't see whatever doubt we as a society are imposing certain beliefs on everyone.

If we take your point that he is imposing his beliefs and morals on us on others If we take your point that he is imposing his beliefs and morals on us or others, Then surely we are doing the same and 2 wrongs never make anything right.

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By *itemeagainMan
over a year ago

Wexford

Just to add in my opinion if he takes his own life it is down to himself however If the catalyst for this decision was as a result of mob mentality in society then Understandably we are all in part to blame.

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By *hilaboutMan
over a year ago

kilkenny

What bugs me is the amount of money being spent on all this between injunctions n different varieties of courts the judicial are really raking it in

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By *ursecretmischiefCouple
over a year ago

The West


"Just to add in my opinion if he takes his own life it is down to himself however If the catalyst for this decision was as a result of mob mentality in society then Understandably we are all in part to blame."

Whatever he does is his problem and his choice. Absolutely nobody else is to blame, but himself.

He has spent his whole adult life at this nonsense. To be honest about it, fuck himamd his family, I couldn't care less.

I'd have considerable more concern for the child which his self-promoting ego has dragged all this attention onto!

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *itemeagainMan
over a year ago

Wexford


"Just to add in my opinion if he takes his own life it is down to himself however If the catalyst for this decision was as a result of mob mentality in society then Understandably we are all in part to blame.

Whatever he does is his problem and his choice. Absolutely nobody else is to blame, but himself.

He has spent his whole adult life at this nonsense. To be honest about it, fuck himamd his family, I couldn't care less.

I'd have considerable more concern for the child which his self-promoting ego has dragged all this attention onto!"

There's enough compassion in the world to see everyone evolved needs some , no ?

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By *ursecretmischiefCouple
over a year ago

The West


"

There's enough compassion in the world to see everyone evolved needs some , no ? "

You'll have to ask his mother that!

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By *itemeagainMan
over a year ago

Wexford


"

There's enough compassion in the world to see everyone evolved needs some , no ?

You'll have to ask his mother that!"

Not evolved... involved... sorry .

It was a question for you .

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By *ind PaddyMan
over a year ago

South County Dublin


"What bugs me is the amount of money being spent on all this between injunctions n different varieties of courts the judicial are really raking it in"

The Judicial are not making any money from this, they get paid a set salary, as public servant. It would be the law society or bar Council members who make money. Only one side has barrister the school, who have to pay her fee. The school receives funds from Department of Education. Where the Burkes get there money?

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By *eth TVTV/TS
over a year ago

Mid Meath

[Removed by poster at 18/01/23 18:23:01]

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By *eth TVTV/TS
over a year ago

Mid Meath


"What bugs me is the amount of money being spent on all this between injunctions n different varieties of courts the judicial are really raking it in

The Judicial are not making any money from this, they get paid a set salary, as public servant. It would be the law society or bar Council members who make money. Only one side has barrister the school, who have to pay her fee. The school receives funds from Department of Education. Where the Burkes get there money?"

Well supposedly he represented himself, but his sister is a solicitor. Unsure what her specialty is though, so she may well be of little use to him.

As regards general funding, a few sources suggest that they are getting some donations from sympathetic right wing sources, some of which is from the US.

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By *rusader1Man
over a year ago

Dublin


"Crucially, Enoch's brother Isaac and his sister Ammi were sitting beside him in their capacity as McKenzie Friends (legal assistants) without having the right to speak (no right of audience).

But seated right behind the three children were the two parents, in the seats that SCs, Senior Counsel, normally occupy.

Very unusual and very intriguing; Mr. Justice Dignam showed restraint, and essentially gave them enough rope to hang themselves.

I predict, with confidence that the Burke family are going to be classified as Vexatious Litigants: this is very serious because you have to obtain special permission to instigate any legal action in any court anywhere in Ireland, if classified as such.

They are on the cusp of this, from my experience. "

Great insight...

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By *ubal1 OP   Man
over a year ago

Newry Down

I again attended Court 29 within the old Four Courts complex in Dublin to hear both sides' reaction to Mr Justice Dignam's judgment that had been sent to the Burke family and Rosemary Mallon SC and her legal team, last evening.

The Burkes (Enoch, Isaac, Mother Martina and Ammi) were very subdued but Ms. Mallon was visibly pleased with the result.

The Ratio Decidendi of the judgement is as follows: if Enoch Burke will never comply with the injunction granted to the school, he cannot be granted his own injunction to stop the Board of Governors from carrying out a hearing to determine whether Enoch had behaved egregiously by confronting the former principal, Niamh McShane, about her request that a transitioning pupil be addressed as they, rather than he or she.

Enoch Burke had never met this pupil nor taught them

The Burkes looked rather sheepish today, but they do have three potential levels of appeal: to the Court of Appeal, to the Irish Supreme Court and finally to the Strasbourg court of Human Rights.

The issue of costs was briefly mentioned: see any of Thursday's Irish daily newspapers or the RTE site for more compete details.

The judge, Judge Dignam, spoke surprisingly quietly and had his own microphone pushed away, so his voice was almost impossible to hear. Rosemary Mallon was visibly ebullient as was her junior (barrister) and instructing solicitor.

Be assured this story has a lot of mileage in it, possibly for many years!

Cases to Strasbourg can take ten years, because of the massive backlog of cases to be heard from 27 jurisdictions in Europe.

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By *og-ManMan
over a year ago

somewhere

So as expected the family turned up at the hotel in Mullingar and started shouting in the hotel corridor to stop the meeting of the board of management from going ahead

5 Gardai standing between them on the room

The meeting was cancelled and the board left but they're still there shouting

Waste of Gardai time for a start but getting your ma to fight your battles ....scarlet for ya

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By *ofusplusCouple
over a year ago

Limerick


"So as expected the family turned up at the hotel in Mullingar and started shouting in the hotel corridor to stop the meeting of the board of management from going ahead

5 Gardai standing between them on the room

The meeting was cancelled and the board left but they're still there shouting

Waste of Gardai time for a start but getting your ma to fight your battles ....scarlet for ya "

Despicable behaviour.

Feel so sorry for the BoM. Plus the school will suffer with a smaller enrolment in September.

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By *ursecretmischiefCouple
over a year ago

The West

All obviously orchestrated, but you'd have to wonder why they were not just arrested and brought to a station to be processed.

Hearing could proceed and be over before they're released.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

You have to wonder if those children (by which I mean the Burke offspring) have any thoughts of their own or are they complete puppets

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By *iscuits8Man
over a year ago

Meath / Dublin / Birmingham

Absolutely nailed on his ma washes and dresses him in the mornings

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By *adger BrocMan
over a year ago

Co. Cork

Perhaps the Burkes could look for inspiration to Jacinda Ardern, soon to be former Prime Minister of New Zealand, who renounced her family religion in favour of supporting the LGBTQ community.

A woman of principle who recognised the limits of organised religion when it comes to living in the real world.

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By *unsigntwoCouple
over a year ago

athlone

Funny thing is my Dad was there ! He lives opposite the hotel.

He said it was like a traveller funeral ....gardai trying to keep the sides appart lol .

Worst thing is if this keeps happening every time the BoM tries to have the hearing .....but he is NOT going to be allowed to teach there again unless its resolved.....after all he did technically assault the principal.

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By *itemeagainMan
over a year ago

Wexford

I'm going to through a cat in here ... as a genuine question.

If I wanted to be referred to as "it" , "the cat" or even "him and her" or "nutural"... would I or society have the right to enforce this want on everyone?

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By *og-ManMan
over a year ago

somewhere


"I'm going to through a cat in here ... as a genuine question.

If I wanted to be referred to as "it" , "the cat" or even "him and her" or "nutural"... would I or society have the right to enforce this want on everyone? "

Not sure if I understand but if you wanted to be know as anything in real life ....and you were a friend ...out of respect I'd use whatever pronoun you asked me to.I guarantee Id get it wrong a few times but I'd do my best

I've had my son bring home his best female friend when they were 15

She asked my family to call her by her new male name and him....very easy thing to do apart from the six year old getting confused one day and he has transitioned.....that started over 10 yrs ago ......the sky didnt fall in and my son and himself are still best friends ......we get one chance on this earth....be the best version of you that you can be and help others do the same

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I'm going to through a cat in here ... as a genuine question.

If I wanted to be referred to as "it" , "the cat" or even "him and her" or "nutural"... would I or society have the right to enforce this want on everyone? "

Define enforce in this instance

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I'm going to through a cat in here ... as a genuine question.

If I wanted to be referred to as "it" , "the cat" or even "him and her" or "nutural"... would I or society have the right to enforce this want on everyone? "

This ridiculous argument again. Have you any idea how incredibly insensitive, insulting and completely trivialising this question is? Always posed as a "genuine question" but with language so barbed and devoid of empathy.

As yesterday proved, no attempt to educate made any difference and that was me with my experienced HR hat on. This one is too close to my heart to even try to be reasonable, especially today.

So here's my advice...try Googling it instead of trying to be edgy and inflammatory

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I'm going to through a cat in here ... as a genuine question.

If I wanted to be referred to as "it" , "the cat" or even "him and her" or "nutural"... would I or society have the right to enforce this want on everyone?

Not sure if I understand but if you wanted to be know as anything in real life ....and you were a friend ...out of respect I'd use whatever pronoun you asked me to.I guarantee Id get it wrong a few times but I'd do my best

I've had my son bring home his best female friend when they were 15

She asked my family to call her by her new male name and him....very easy thing to do apart from the six year old getting confused one day and he has transitioned.....that started over 10 yrs ago ......the sky didnt fall in and my son and himself are still best friends ......we get one chance on this earth....be the best version of you that you can be and help others do the same "

Beautifully put my friend

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By *iscuits8Man
over a year ago

Meath / Dublin / Birmingham

Bog and B&H above - 100%, great posts

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By *ofusplusCouple
over a year ago

Limerick


"Funny thing is my Dad was there ! He lives opposite the hotel.

He said it was like a traveller funeral ....gardai trying to keep the sides appart lol .

Worst thing is if this keeps happening every time the BoM tries to have the hearing .....but he is NOT going to be allowed to teach there again unless its resolved.....after all he did technically assault the principal."

How did they know the details of the meeting? Only members of the BoM needed to know the where and when, surely? They need to inform the school community of the meeting but would only need to inform them of the date.

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By *ananaman41Man
over a year ago

Dublin


"Perhaps the Burkes could look for inspiration to Jacinda Ardern, soon to be former Prime Minister of New Zealand, who renounced her family religion in favour of supporting the LGBTQ community.

A woman of principle who recognised the limits of organised religion when it comes to living in the real world."

A specialist in woke identity politics, good riddance to her

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By *ursecretmischiefCouple
over a year ago

The West


"I'm going to through a cat in here ... as a genuine question.

If I wanted to be referred to as "it" , "the cat" or even "him and her" or "nutural"... would I or society have the right to enforce this want on everyone?

Define enforce in this instance "

Good question, but you see that's how the whole culture war "debate" works. Just try and frame stupid questions as debate worthy.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Hopefully none of these people are gonna be there by the time I go to work haha

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By *ursecretmischiefCouple
over a year ago

The West


"

How did they know the details of the meeting? Only members of the BoM needed to know the where and when, surely? They need to inform the school community of the meeting but would only need to inform them of the date."

It's a disciplinary hearing as far as I know, so Enoch was probably there, accompanied by Mammy!

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By *ofusplusCouple
over a year ago

Limerick


"

How did they know the details of the meeting? Only members of the BoM needed to know the where and when, surely? They need to inform the school community of the meeting but would only need to inform them of the date.

It's a disciplinary hearing as far as I know, so Enoch was probably there, accompanied by Mammy!"

Mammy seems to be trying to control everything. I do feel sorry for him tbh, he is a victim of his upbringing, fear of his mother and his own lack of common sense, a bit of all three I think

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By *antas_number_one_elfWoman
over a year ago

dublin

The entire situation is beyond bizarre. Professional, educated adults attending work related meetings (WRC/Disciplinary hearings) with their mother in tow? Can she not see how she is destroying her children’s chances of employment and the prospect of a decent career/life?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The entire situation is beyond bizarre. Professional, educated adults attending work related meetings (WRC/Disciplinary hearings) with their mother in tow? Can she not see how she is destroying her children’s chances of employment and the prospect of a decent career/life? "

I suspect she sees this as a necessary sacrifice for the cause.

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By *ursecretmischiefCouple
over a year ago

The West


"The entire situation is beyond bizarre. Professional, educated adults attending work related meetings (WRC/Disciplinary hearings) with their mother in tow? Can she not see how she is destroying her children’s chances of employment and the prospect of a decent career/life?

I suspect she sees this as a necessary sacrifice for the cause."

The reason he stayed in Jail was because the school would not hold this hearing without him being present. Their insurance and legal team wouldn't allow it. Its all just following the process.

The hearing will happen eventually, with or without them now as they've proven totally unreasonable.

He'll be sacked and most legal avenues will be closed. He won't go to the school after his contract is terminated.

The Burkes will then move onto their next grift. I wouldn't like to be Senior management in Maynooth Uni right now!!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"The entire situation is beyond bizarre. Professional, educated adults attending work related meetings (WRC/Disciplinary hearings) with their mother in tow? Can she not see how she is destroying her children’s chances of employment and the prospect of a decent career/life? "

He's making a good go of that himself. Her MO seems to be control, control her children's schooling, their career choices and any conflict they may come across. If Enoch or his mother have a profile I'd love to hear your thoughts.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

They all need a kick in the hole

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By *adger BrocMan
over a year ago

Co. Cork


"Perhaps the Burkes could look for inspiration to Jacinda Ardern, soon to be former Prime Minister of New Zealand, who renounced her family religion in favour of supporting the LGBTQ community.

A woman of principle who recognised the limits of organised religion when it comes to living in the real world.

A specialist in woke identity politics, good riddance to her"

.........

Strong gun control laws.

Decisive Covid control measures.

Strong leadership in the face of human tragedy and natural disaster.

Promoter of a global campaign to end online hate....(might be relevant on here from time to time).

If that's being woke then I am happy to support her and all aware and well informed politicians.

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By *unsigntwoCouple
over a year ago

athlone


"Funny thing is my Dad was there ! He lives opposite the hotel.

He said it was like a traveller funeral ....gardai trying to keep the sides appart lol .

Worst thing is if this keeps happening every time the BoM tries to have the hearing .....but he is NOT going to be allowed to teach there again unless its resolved.....after all he did technically assault the principal.

How did they know the details of the meeting? Only members of the BoM needed to know the where and when, surely? They need to inform the school community of the meeting but would only need to inform them of the date."

Ask yourself who benefits from the publicity?

Media were there......who do you think tipped them off? .......my Dad was there for the leisure facilities

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By *iscuits8Man
over a year ago

Meath / Dublin / Birmingham

The whole labelling people "woke" thing is gas.

The majority of times I see it used it seems to be as a negative reaction to people showing empathy towards a cause or a group of people - whether it's climate causes, the LGBT community or whatever

It's absolutely rubbish as an insult

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By *unsigntwoCouple
over a year ago

athlone


"The entire situation is beyond bizarre. Professional, educated adults attending work related meetings (WRC/Disciplinary hearings) with their mother in tow? Can she not see how she is destroying her children’s chances of employment and the prospect of a decent career/life? "

Well said ....a point misses in all the noise

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By *og-ManMan
over a year ago

somewhere

Last November, four of the siblings, Enoch, Ammi, Isaac and Kezia, lost a High Court action they had brought to challenge a lifetime ban from membership of college societies in NUI Galway some years previously. The siblings were members of the Christian Union Society (CUS) in the college and claimed the ban was discriminatory under the Equal Status Act on the grounds of religion.

Judge Raymond Groarke found there were procedural issues around the ban, but there were also “aggravating circumstances”. These included the failure of the siblings to co-operate with an investigation, their efforts to hinder it, their failure to give a truthful account of matters, their fabrication of accounts and their misuse of CUS funds.

Not very Christian stealing funds

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By *ananaman41Man
over a year ago

Dublin


"Perhaps the Burkes could look for inspiration to Jacinda Ardern, soon to be former Prime Minister of New Zealand, who renounced her family religion in favour of supporting the LGBTQ community.

A woman of principle who recognised the limits of organised religion when it comes to living in the real world.

A specialist in woke identity politics, good riddance to her

.........

Strong gun control laws.

Decisive Covid control measures.

Strong leadership in the face of human tragedy and natural disaster.

Promoter of a global campaign to end online hate....(might be relevant on here from time to time).

If that's being woke then I am happy to support her and all aware and well informed politicians."

A veneer of 'compassion' hiding the realities of rising child poverty, particularly amongst indigenous people, soft on crime stance leading to soaring violent crime, not to mention her ridiculous covid policies which surprise surprise have been rowed back, and at one point led to protests at parliament lasting for 3 whole weeks.

Her polls are sinking fast and she was on track to lose the next election in october.

But hey, shes the darling of the vax and lockdown brigade and she wants us all to be nice to each other, so screw the other issues. They obviously dont matter.

Maybe she'll retire to hollywood to seek out some of that quiet life harry and meghan are enjoying

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By *ind PaddyMan
over a year ago

South County Dublin


"The entire situation is beyond bizarre. Professional, educated adults attending work related meetings (WRC/Disciplinary hearings) with their mother in tow? Can she not see how she is destroying her children’s chances of employment and the prospect of a decent career/life? "

There are always work related issues within all professions. Even the best place to work can have HR issues, we are all human.

I think the children, now adults can make up their own minds. The family are shower of hypocrites, not that I go to mass often, but does it not say in the bible love thy neighbour, well this student is not getting much love from the Burkes. I would hate to be an employer who employes one of them. The Burkes would drive you to drink.

The Burkes seeking there costs, any costs the Burkes are seeking are their own expenses. The school has to hire a Solicitor and Barrister. As I posted earlier the Dept of Education pays the teachers salaries in that school. The taxpayer ie Sean and Josephine citizen have to foot the bill of these court appearances and it is not cheap to take a case to the high court.

The Burkes leave a lot to be desired there is a housing crisis, hospital trolley crisis and the Burkes are getting worked up over one student.

The student who has done little wrong.

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By *eth TVTV/TS
over a year ago

Mid Meath


"Last November, four of the siblings, Enoch, Ammi, Isaac and Kezia, lost a High Court action they had brought to challenge a lifetime ban from membership of college societies in NUI Galway some years previously. The siblings were members of the Christian Union Society (CUS) in the college and claimed the ban was discriminatory under the Equal Status Act on the grounds of religion.

Judge Raymond Groarke found there were procedural issues around the ban, but there were also “aggravating circumstances”. These included the failure of the siblings to co-operate with an investigation, their efforts to hinder it, their failure to give a truthful account of matters, their fabrication of accounts and their misuse of CUS funds.

Not very Christian stealing funds "

Apparently one of the Burkes was a signatory for the bank account and took it upon themselves funds given to the society for admin and day to day bills (room hire, tea and coffee, stationary etc) for anti abortion material during the 2018 referendum. When caught out they took the non cooperative high ground, which is their modus operandi for all and any of their tirades.

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By *adger BrocMan
over a year ago

Co. Cork


"Perhaps the Burkes could look for inspiration to Jacinda Ardern, soon to be former Prime Minister of New Zealand, who renounced her family religion in favour of supporting the LGBTQ community.

A woman of principle who recognised the limits of organised religion when it comes to living in the real world.

A specialist in woke identity politics, good riddance to her

.........

Strong gun control laws.

Decisive Covid control measures.

Strong leadership in the face of human tragedy and natural disaster.

Promoter of a global campaign to end online hate....(might be relevant on here from time to time).

If that's being woke then I am happy to support her and all aware and well informed politicians.

A veneer of 'compassion' hiding the realities of rising child poverty, particularly amongst indigenous people, soft on crime stance leading to soaring violent crime, not to mention her ridiculous covid policies which surprise surprise have been rowed back, and at one point led to protests at parliament lasting for 3 whole weeks.

Her polls are sinking fast and she was on track to lose the next election in october.

But hey, shes the darling of the vax and lockdown brigade and she wants us all to be nice to each other, so screw the other issues. They obviously dont matter.

Maybe she'll retire to hollywood to seek out some of that quiet life harry and meghan are enjoying "

Perhaps for a different thread.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Jubal

I presume its a hobby of yours to go to various course cases

Do you just go to the high profile ones or do you go to all sorts

I have been to tens of thousands of court hearings all over Ireland, north and south and also in London.

Truthfully, I have had conversations, on the public street, with senior judges including the former Lord Chief Justice of NI.

On one occasion, a judge came down from the Bench and asked for my opinion of his performance, that I provided, bluntly and to the point.

My presence at hearings arouses a lot of interest, from many different people

On one occasion, in NI, several years ago, because of unusual circumstances I was the only member of the public permitted to sit in the public gallery in a serious trial.

I have also acted as a McKenzie Friend, an unpaid legal assistant to a self-represented litigant, with success.

At one time, I used to go to court hearings on six days per week.

If I reveal any more details I would not be difficult to ascertain my real identity. Nuff said!

Why do you do this and how do you fund this ?

I imagine he works or used to work in the legal profession!

Beginning to think hes a prisoner "

Do you just shoot everyone or has it come with your time on here

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Jubal

I presume its a hobby of yours to go to various course cases

Do you just go to the high profile ones or do you go to all sorts

I have been to tens of thousands of court hearings all over Ireland, north and south and also in London.

Truthfully, I have had conversations, on the public street, with senior judges including the former Lord Chief Justice of NI.

On one occasion, a judge came down from the Bench and asked for my opinion of his performance, that I provided, bluntly and to the point.

My presence at hearings arouses a lot of interest, from many different people

On one occasion, in NI, several years ago, because of unusual circumstances I was the only member of the public permitted to sit in the public gallery in a serious trial.

I have also acted as a McKenzie Friend, an unpaid legal assistant to a self-represented litigant, with success.

At one time, I used to go to court hearings on six days per week.

If I reveal any more details I would not be difficult to ascertain my real identity. Nuff said!

Why do you do this and how do you fund this ?

I imagine he works or used to work in the legal profession!

Beginning to think hes a prisoner

Do you just shoot everyone or has it come with your time on here "

You call the Burke family pricks

But you are on here spreading your beliefs or thoughts do you not feel like your contradicting yourself

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Time is the most precious commodity in everyone's lives, and you have to make the most use of it.

I am 67 later this year and I am out and about every single day, watching participating, resolving issues or at least trying to, and making the most constructive use of my valuable time.

I sincerely hope that I die "in harness" to use an old bucolic metaphor."

We hope you have many more years of happiness to do what your doing enjoy

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By *dfabMan
over a year ago

Dunboyne

I feel sorry for anyone going for a job with Burke as a surname. You can bet that whatever HR department is involved will be doing more than the normal background checks for the next few years.

Also for any student in the same situation.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Stick up for your rights Mr Burke well done need more like you

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By *iscuits8Man
over a year ago

Meath / Dublin / Birmingham


"Stick up for your rights Mr Burke well done need more like you"

Yes Mr Burke, you stand up for your right to bully school children you brave soldier!

Yikes

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By *ananaman41Man
over a year ago

Dublin


"Stick up for your rights Mr Burke well done need more like you"

Are they the wife's shoes on the ground in your pic?

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By *ananaman41Man
over a year ago

Dublin


"Stick up for your rights Mr Burke well done need more like you

Yes Mr Burke, you stand up for your right to bully school children you brave soldier!

Yikes "

Where has it been alleged that he bullied the child?

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By *3nsesMan
over a year ago

Dublin


"Stick up for your rights Mr Burke well done need more like you"

His right as a grown man to be told how to live his life by his Mammy and Daddy?

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By *og-ManMan
over a year ago

somewhere


"Stick up for your rights Mr Burke well done need more like you

Yes Mr Burke, you stand up for your right to bully school children you brave soldier!

Yikes

Where has it been alleged that he bullied the child? "

Do you think the child feels bullied or how do you think they feel going to school everyday

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By *og-ManMan
over a year ago

somewhere

Where's John Rogers thats what I want to know

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By *ananaman41Man
over a year ago

Dublin


"Stick up for your rights Mr Burke well done need more like you

Yes Mr Burke, you stand up for your right to bully school children you brave soldier!

Yikes

Where has it been alleged that he bullied the child?

Do you think the child feels bullied or how do you think they feel going to school everyday "

Ive no idea, and I've every sympathy for the child, but 'feeling' bullied and being bullied and two completely different things.

My understanding is mr burke has had zero contact with the child so i fail to see how you could add bullying to his list of perceived crimes

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By *og-ManMan
over a year ago

somewhere


"Stick up for your rights Mr Burke well done need more like you

Yes Mr Burke, you stand up for your right to bully school children you brave soldier!

Yikes

Where has it been alleged that he bullied the child?

Do you think the child feels bullied or how do you think they feel going to school everyday

Ive no idea, and I've every sympathy for the child, but 'feeling' bullied and being bullied and two completely different things.

My understanding is mr burke has had zero contact with the child so i fail to see how you could add bullying to his list of perceived crimes "

Genuinely believe that he's trying to bully everyone at this stage ....Thats what a solicitor accused him of yesterday and called the Guards to walk her out

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By *ursecretmischiefCouple
over a year ago

The West


"Stick up for your rights Mr Burke well done need more like you

Yes Mr Burke, you stand up for your right to bully school children you brave soldier!

Yikes

Where has it been alleged that he bullied the child?

Do you think the child feels bullied or how do you think they feel going to school everyday

Ive no idea, and I've every sympathy for the child, but 'feeling' bullied and being bullied and two completely different things.

My understanding is mr burke has had zero contact with the child so i fail to see how you could add bullying to his list of perceived crimes "

Ya, a teacher in the school you attend along with his whole family have just built their latest grift on the back of you. First in front of the whole school and their parents and then afterwards on a national stage.

The child may feel bullied but they are not actually being bullied, is that what your saying?

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By *ananaman41Man
over a year ago

Dublin


"Stick up for your rights Mr Burke well done need more like you

Yes Mr Burke, you stand up for your right to bully school children you brave soldier!

Yikes

Where has it been alleged that he bullied the child?

Do you think the child feels bullied or how do you think they feel going to school everyday

Ive no idea, and I've every sympathy for the child, but 'feeling' bullied and being bullied and two completely different things.

My understanding is mr burke has had zero contact with the child so i fail to see how you could add bullying to his list of perceived crimes

Ya, a teacher in the school you attend along with his whole family have just built their latest grift on the back of you. First in front of the whole school and their parents and then afterwards on a national stage.

The child may feel bullied but they are not actually being bullied, is that what your saying?"

Your last sentence, yes thats what im saying

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By *unsigntwoCouple
over a year ago

athlone


"Stick up for your rights Mr Burke well done need more like you

Yes Mr Burke, you stand up for your right to bully school children you brave soldier!

Yikes

Where has it been alleged that he bullied the child?

Do you think the child feels bullied or how do you think they feel going to school everyday

Ive no idea, and I've every sympathy for the child, but 'feeling' bullied and being bullied and two completely different things.

My understanding is mr burke has had zero contact with the child so i fail to see how you could add bullying to his list of perceived crimes "

.....once again folks ....

Mr Burkes legal problems have NOTHING to do with the student in question.......

He allegedly assaulted the principal,was suspended,......then all hell broke loose

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By *ilthyNightsCouple
over a year ago

East / North, Cork

I suspect it's fair to say that Mr burkes actions have led to the child feeling bad, and that he knowingly caused this, regardless of whether they physically stood in front of each other.

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By *adger BrocMan
over a year ago

Co. Cork

Where are John Waters and Gemma O'Doherty when the Burkes need them.

Or is it a job for Mick Wallace and Clare Daly?

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By *ergalMan
over a year ago

East Cork


"Stick up for your rights Mr Burke well done need more like you"

Rights ? For ignoring injunctions against him, and expecting injunctions to be applied to others? When he doesn't respect injunctions?

Or for harassing the school principle....

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By *heoldhippyMan
over a year ago

Midleton


"Where are John Waters and Gemma O'Doherty when the Burkes need them.

Or is it a job for Mick Wallace and Clare Daly?"

I'd say more Waters and O'Doherty. One pair are run of the mill nutcases who probably have more in common with Enoch. The others are more into tyranical political regimes. They have a lot in common though.

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By *adger BrocMan
over a year ago

Co. Cork


"Where are John Waters and Gemma O'Doherty when the Burkes need them.

Or is it a job for Mick Wallace and Clare Daly?

I'd say more Waters and O'Doherty. One pair are run of the mill nutcases who probably have more in common with Enoch. The others are more into tyranical political regimes. They have a lot in common though."

....

I wonder if either of them have couples profiles on here.

Now those would be some very interesting meets....

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By *he Gent 78Man
over a year ago

Dublin


"Stick up for your rights Mr Burke well done need more like you"

We really don’t !

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By *itemeagainMan
over a year ago

Wexford


"I'm going to through a cat in here ... as a genuine question.

If I wanted to be referred to as "it" , "the cat" or even "him and her" or "nutural"... would I or society have the right to enforce this want on everyone?

Define enforce in this instance "

I guess I would define it as forcing one to comply or give up their livelihood. Forcing one to act in a way contrary to their beliefs or be socially condemned.

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By *itemeagainMan
over a year ago

Wexford


"I'm going to through a cat in here ... as a genuine question.

If I wanted to be referred to as "it" , "the cat" or even "him and her" or "nutural"... would I or society have the right to enforce this want on everyone?

This ridiculous argument again. Have you any idea how incredibly insensitive, insulting and completely trivialising this question is? Always posed as a "genuine question" but with language so barbed and devoid of empathy.

As yesterday proved, no attempt to educate made any difference and that was me with my experienced HR hat on. This one is too close to my heart to even try to be reasonable, especially today.

So here's my advice...try Googling it instead of trying to be edgy and inflammatory "

Ok so its not an inflammatory from my perspective no insensitive. Your making this personal when I'm actually asking questions about the topic, not the individuals.

You might need to recognize that if you are taking about the individuals ... they all deserve empathy. Through empathy isn't to understand those whom you agree with but to have understanding for all. It goes without saying we can all understand why someone may want to be referred to as something different from their birth sex,, the questions I ask are to try and explore understanding and fairness for all.

Oh and on a personal note .... I don't need your moral advice thanks .

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By *itemeagainMan
over a year ago

Wexford


"I'm going to through a cat in here ... as a genuine question.

If I wanted to be referred to as "it" , "the cat" or even "him and her" or "nutural"... would I or society have the right to enforce this want on everyone?

Define enforce in this instance

Good question, but you see that's how the whole culture war "debate" works. Just try and frame stupid questions as debate worthy.

"

Look because you can't see that there are no stupid questions if we are really looking to explore a topic , dosnt make a question stupid .

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I'm going to through a cat in here ... as a genuine question.

If I wanted to be referred to as "it" , "the cat" or even "him and her" or "nutural"... would I or society have the right to enforce this want on everyone?

This ridiculous argument again. Have you any idea how incredibly insensitive, insulting and completely trivialising this question is? Always posed as a "genuine question" but with language so barbed and devoid of empathy.

As yesterday proved, no attempt to educate made any difference and that was me with my experienced HR hat on. This one is too close to my heart to even try to be reasonable, especially today.

So here's my advice...try Googling it instead of trying to be edgy and inflammatory

Ok so its not an inflammatory from my perspective no insensitive. Your making this personal when I'm actually asking questions about the topic, not the individuals.

You might need to recognize that if you are taking about the individuals ... they all deserve empathy. Through empathy isn't to understand those whom you agree with but to have understanding for all. It goes without saying we can all understand why someone may want to be referred to as something different from their birth sex,, the questions I ask are to try and explore understanding and fairness for all.

Oh and on a personal note .... I don't need your moral advice thanks . "

It was practical advice, not moral

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By *itemeagainMan
over a year ago

Wexford


"The whole labelling people "woke" thing is gas.

The majority of times I see it used it seems to be as a negative reaction to people showing empathy towards a cause or a group of people - whether it's climate causes, the LGBT community or whatever

It's absolutely rubbish as an insult "

I think and I'm open to correction the reason the word woke has become a negative is because most of the people using it to express empathy or understanding as the consequential result express a lack of empathy and understanding to the opposition. It has now come to the point where if you aren't accepting of absolutely everything all are being discriminatory. This in itself is the scrimmitory to those who don't accept everything. So the word walk itself has become a bit of a catch-22.

Are we really woke and pathetic or accepting if we can't accept others expressing and believing things differently?

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By *itemeagainMan
over a year ago

Wexford


"I'm going to through a cat in here ... as a genuine question.

If I wanted to be referred to as "it" , "the cat" or even "him and her" or "nutural"... would I or society have the right to enforce this want on everyone?

This ridiculous argument again. Have you any idea how incredibly insensitive, insulting and completely trivialising this question is? Always posed as a "genuine question" but with language so barbed and devoid of empathy.

As yesterday proved, no attempt to educate made any difference and that was me with my experienced HR hat on. This one is too close to my heart to even try to be reasonable, especially today.

So here's my advice...try Googling it instead of trying to be edgy and inflammatory

Ok so its not an inflammatory from my perspective no insensitive. Your making this personal when I'm actually asking questions about the topic, not the individuals.

You might need to recognize that if you are taking about the individuals ... they all deserve empathy. Through empathy isn't to understand those whom you agree with but to have understanding for all. It goes without saying we can all understand why someone may want to be referred to as something different from their birth sex,, the questions I ask are to try and explore understanding and fairness for all.

Oh and on a personal note .... I don't need your moral advice thanks .

It was practical advice, not moral "

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *itemeagainMan
over a year ago

Wexford


"The whole labelling people "woke" thing is gas.

The majority of times I see it used it seems to be as a negative reaction to people showing empathy towards a cause or a group of people - whether it's climate causes, the LGBT community or whatever

It's absolutely rubbish as an insult

I think and I'm open to correction the reason the word woke has become a negative because in most cases people using it to express empathy or understanding, inadvertently as a consequential result express a lack of empathy and understanding to the opposition. It has now come to the point where if you aren't accepting of absolutely everything and all , you are labeled as being discriminatory. This in itself is discrimination to those who don't accept everything. So the word wolk itself has become a bit of a catch-22.

Are we really woke and empathetic or accepting if we can't accept others expressing and believing things differently?"

think and I'm open to correction the reason the word woke has become a negative is because most of the people using it to express empathy or understanding as the consequential result express a lack of empathy and understanding to the opposition. It has now come to the point where if you aren't accepting of absolutely everything all are being discriminatory. This in itself is the scrimmitory to those who don't accept everything. So the word walk itself has become a bit of a catch-22.

Are we really woke and pathetic or accepting if we can't accept others expressing and believing things differently?

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By *itemeagainMan
over a year ago

Wexford


"I suspect it's fair to say that Mr burkes actions have led to the child feeling bad, and that he knowingly caused this, regardless of whether they physically stood in front of each other."

Maybe , one could argue thats down to childhood as some children would feel bad others wouldn't give a fuck. If the child dosnt feel bad or even care ,,,, should it have never been an issue ??

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By *itlbeeCouple
over a year ago

.

Fascinating topic to see discussed on Fab.

I think it's really important to note that he did not teach this child.

He was never asked to directly referred to that child as any different pronoun.

An email was sent out to the teachers saying a student was identifying as trans. And wished for staff to use a gender NEUTRAL pronoun.

(So even if you really can't accept a gender identity being different to biological sex, saying "they" should be entirely possible.)

He went off at the principal and other staff saying no one on the school should be respecting that's students wishes.

So Enoch really was the one imposing his own beliefs on the entire school.

Every single trans person I have personally met has been a very shy and sweet person. They really do live their lives in fear of harassment.

But those who oppose their right to be themselves push this narrative that their existence is something aggressively forced on the rest of the world. The Burke family were just looking for any opportunity to make themselves the victim of some imaginary trans agenda.

I feel sorry for the poor kid who is just trying to get by.

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By *adger BrocMan
over a year ago

Co. Cork

I think I'm sleepwalking....

Somebody please woke me.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I suspect it's fair to say that Mr burkes actions have led to the child feeling bad, and that he knowingly caused this, regardless of whether they physically stood in front of each other.

Maybe , one could argue thats down to childhood as some children would feel bad others wouldn't give a fuck. If the child dosnt feel bad or even care ,,,, should it have never been an issue ?? "

Yes, because to do nothing leaves the next child vulnerable. A school cannot and should not put itself in that position

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By *unsigntwoCouple
over a year ago

athlone


"Fascinating topic to see discussed on Fab.

I think it's really important to note that he did not teach this child.

He was never asked to directly referred to that child as any different pronoun.

An email was sent out to the teachers saying a student was identifying as trans. And wished for staff to use a gender NEUTRAL pronoun.

(So even if you really can't accept a gender identity being different to biological sex, saying "they" should be entirely possible.)

He went off at the principal and other staff saying no one on the school should be respecting that's students wishes.

So Enoch really was the one imposing his own beliefs on the entire school.

Every single trans person I have personally met has been a very shy and sweet person. They really do live their lives in fear of harassment.

But those who oppose their right to be themselves push this narrative that their existence is something aggressively forced on the rest of the world. The Burke family were just looking for any opportunity to make themselves the victim of some imaginary trans agenda.

I feel sorry for the poor kid who is just trying to get by.

"

This ...100%

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By *ilthyNightsCouple
over a year ago

East / North, Cork


"I suspect it's fair to say that Mr burkes actions have led to the child feeling bad, and that he knowingly caused this, regardless of whether they physically stood in front of each other.

Maybe , one could argue thats down to childhood as some children would feel bad others wouldn't give a fuck. If the child dosnt feel bad or even care ,,,, should it have never been an issue ?? "

It's preposterous to suggest that the child isn't aware of this idiots little crusade, and that they haven't been exposed to transphobia as a result of this being put into the national media and the resultant public and online discourse.

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By *og-ManMan
over a year ago

somewhere

He's just been sacked from his job in the school.

He's now unemployable as a teacher in Ireland

Well done mammy Burke ....2 kids sacked from good jobs and unemployable in their chosen field

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By *ubal1 OP   Man
over a year ago

Newry Down

I specically spoke to an experienced guy at two hearings in Court one and Court 27 atthe Four Courts

His theory is that Enoch knows full well that he will never work as a teacher in Ireland again.

Enoch's plan is that now that he had done time in an Evangelical Christian cause (in Mountjoy for three months) he will go on the lecture circuit in America's so-called Bible Belt, with some of his siblings in tow, and make a fortune.

He is only 29, so he has many decades of earning potential left in him.

He will be made very very welcome according to the court observer I spoke to.

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By *og-ManMan
over a year ago

somewhere

He's still going to try to get into the school on Monday with the rest of the family and their plastic boxes

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By *ay_Gatsby_D4Man
over a year ago

City Centre, Dublin

Aaaaaaaand he’s gone

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By *ubal1 OP   Man
over a year ago

Newry Down

Be assured of a certainty: this case is going to run and run for a long time!

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By *og-ManMan
over a year ago

somewhere

Pro nouns: Un/Employed

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

He'll endup a politician and being on the late late show with a book launch called Detention

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By *ubal1 OP   Man
over a year ago

Newry Down

I have personally watched Enoch and his family in action, in court; these are exceptional people who are going to doggedly pursue this issue; another hearing is scheduled to take place next week, and another in three weeks.

Blocking is not a word the Burke family members have any regard for!

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By *adger BrocMan
over a year ago

Co. Cork

Bit of a coincidence that he was named Enoch and then ends up as a teacher. With that kind of foresight the parents should be able to give everybody the Lotto numbers every week, no problem.

Excessive parental influence me thinks.

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By *ubal1 OP   Man
over a year ago

Newry Down


"Bit of a coincidence that he was named Enoch and then ends up as a teacher. With that kind of foresight the parents should be able to give everybody the Lotto numbers every week, no problem.

Excessive parental influence me thinks."

Unquestionably, Martina Burke, the matriarch, wears the trousers in that family; her husband looks cowed and sheepish!

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By *ancy38Woman
over a year ago

galway


"I specically spoke to an experienced guy at two hearings in Court one and Court 27 atthe Four Courts

His theory is that Enoch knows full well that he will never work as a teacher in Ireland again.

Enoch's plan is that now that he had done time in an Evangelical Christian cause (in Mountjoy for three months) he will go on the lecture circuit in America's so-called Bible Belt, with some of his siblings in tow, and make a fortune.

He is only 29, so he has many decades of earning potential left in him.

He will be made very very welcome according to the court observer I spoke to. "

I'm one of very few who knows nothing about this case. I just never got into reading up about it. With that said, have you any evidence from this experienced guy in the court. You know, anyone can make things up

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By *ursecretmischiefCouple
over a year ago

The West

An extremely strange family, no doubt. I have no time for them whatsoever.

However, I do admire their intelligence. The mother is a crackpot, but she home-schooled her children to a very, very high standard, academically!

All have 1st Class Honours degrees in Physics, Maths, Finance, Business, Politics and History. That should give an insight to there supporters of who they really are.

They're not stupid follow the €€€€

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By *ubal1 OP   Man
over a year ago

Newry Down


"I specically spoke to an experienced guy at two hearings in Court one and Court 27 atthe Four Courts

His theory is that Enoch knows full well that he will never work as a teacher in Ireland again.

Enoch's plan is that now that he had done time in an Evangelical Christian cause (in Mountjoy for three months) he will go on the lecture circuit in America's so-called Bible Belt, with some of his siblings in tow, and make a fortune.

He is only 29, so he has many decades of earning potential left in him.

He will be made very very welcome according to the court observer I spoke to.

I'm one of very few who knows nothing about this case. I just never got into reading up about it. With that said, have you any evidence from this experienced guy in the court. You know, anyone can make things up"

The experienced elderly and distinguished looking man, who was permitted to take notes in court, which is highly unusual, was very au fait with all the nuances of the case. and I had no reason to doubt his opinion about Enoch's future options in the U S.

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By *itemeagainMan
over a year ago

Wexford


"Fascinating topic to see discussed on Fab.

I think it's really important to note that he did not teach this child.

He was never asked to directly referred to that child as any different pronoun.

An email was sent out to the teachers saying a student was identifying as trans. And wished for staff to use a gender NEUTRAL pronoun.

(So even if you really can't accept a gender identity being different to biological sex, saying "they" should be entirely possible.)

He went off at the principal and other staff saying no one on the school should be respecting that's students wishes.

So Enoch really was the one imposing his own beliefs on the entire school.

Every single trans person I have personally met has been a very shy and sweet person. They really do live their lives in fear of harassment.

But those who oppose their right to be themselves push this narrative that their existence is something aggressively forced on the rest of the world. The Burke family were just looking for any opportunity to make themselves the victim of some imaginary trans agenda.

I feel sorry for the poor kid who is just trying to get by.

"

Nicely put ...

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *unsigntwoCouple
over a year ago

athlone


"I specically spoke to an experienced guy at two hearings in Court one and Court 27 atthe Four Courts

His theory is that Enoch knows full well that he will never work as a teacher in Ireland again.

Enoch's plan is that now that he had done time in an Evangelical Christian cause (in Mountjoy for three months) he will go on the lecture circuit in America's so-called Bible Belt, with some of his siblings in tow, and make a fortune.

He is only 29, so he has many decades of earning potential left in him.

He will be made very very welcome according to the court observer I spoke to. "

On the button!.....

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By *itemeagainMan
over a year ago

Wexford


"I suspect it's fair to say that Mr burkes actions have led to the child feeling bad, and that he knowingly caused this, regardless of whether they physically stood in front of each other.

Maybe , one could argue thats down to childhood as some children would feel bad others wouldn't give a fuck. If the child dosnt feel bad or even care ,,,, should it have never been an issue ??

It's preposterous to suggest that the child isn't aware of this idiots little crusade, and that they haven't been exposed to transphobia as a result of this being put into the national media and the resultant public and online discourse. "

It's not preposterous... I've had talks with trans teens ... been at info meetings ... had presentation from the mother of a trans autistic girl... within the people I met I've always encountered some who don't care what others think cause those around them do !

They tend to be on a whole accepting of different view points and people people. Sometimes we can get cought up it defending what we see as an offense , that we become blinkered to how liner our thinking gets .

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By *heoldhippyMan
over a year ago

Midleton


"Where are John Waters and Gemma O'Doherty when the Burkes need them.

Or is it a job for Mick Wallace and Clare Daly?

I'd say more Waters and O'Doherty. One pair are run of the mill nutcases who probably have more in common with Enoch. The others are more into tyranical political regimes. They have a lot in common though.

....

I wonder if either of them have couples profiles on here.

Now those would be some very interesting meets.... "

Too much hair!

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By *ilthyNightsCouple
over a year ago

East / North, Cork


"I suspect it's fair to say that Mr burkes actions have led to the child feeling bad, and that he knowingly caused this, regardless of whether they physically stood in front of each other.

Maybe , one could argue thats down to childhood as some children would feel bad others wouldn't give a fuck. If the child dosnt feel bad or even care ,,,, should it have never been an issue ??

It's preposterous to suggest that the child isn't aware of this idiots little crusade, and that they haven't been exposed to transphobia as a result of this being put into the national media and the resultant public and online discourse.

It's not preposterous... I've had talks with trans teens ... been at info meetings ... had presentation from the mother of a trans autistic girl... within the people I met I've always encountered some who don't care what others think cause those around them do !

They tend to be on a whole accepting of different view points and people people. Sometimes we can get cought up it defending what we see as an offense , that we become blinkered to how liner our thinking gets ."

I don't buy that at all. I don't know the child in question, and neither do you so this is all speculation... but I can't believe that they are unaffected by all this.

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By *og-ManMan
over a year ago

somewhere


"Where are John Waters and Gemma O'Doherty when the Burkes need them.

Or is it a job for Mick Wallace and Clare Daly?

I'd say more Waters and O'Doherty. One pair are run of the mill nutcases who probably have more in common with Enoch. The others are more into tyranical political regimes. They have a lot in common though.

....

I wonder if either of them have couples profiles on here.

Now those would be some very interesting meets....

Too much hair!"

To much screeching

 (closed, thread got too big)

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By *adger BrocMan
over a year ago

Co. Cork


"Where are John Waters and Gemma O'Doherty when the Burkes need them.

Or is it a job for Mick Wallace and Clare Daly?

I'd say more Waters and O'Doherty. One pair are run of the mill nutcases who probably have more in common with Enoch. The others are more into tyranical political regimes. They have a lot in common though.

....

I wonder if either of them have couples profiles on here.

Now those would be some very interesting meets....

Too much hair!

To much screeching "

...

Ponytail pulling, especially during doggie, can often lead to a bit of high pitched moaning in my experience.....and it's never a bad thing.

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By *heoldhippyMan
over a year ago

Midleton


"Where are John Waters and Gemma O'Doherty when the Burkes need them.

Or is it a job for Mick Wallace and Clare Daly?

I'd say more Waters and O'Doherty. One pair are run of the mill nutcases who probably have more in common with Enoch. The others are more into tyranical political regimes. They have a lot in common though.

....

I wonder if either of them have couples profiles on here.

Now those would be some very interesting meets....

Too much hair!

To much screeching

...

Ponytail pulling, especially during doggie, can often lead to a bit of high pitched moaning in my experience.....and it's never a bad thing. "

True, on the other hand can you imagine a foursome with them? The mind boggles at the thought of them nude, not to mention the stomach churning!

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By *itemeagainMan
over a year ago

Wexford


"I suspect it's fair to say that Mr burkes actions have led to the child feeling bad, and that he knowingly caused this, regardless of whether they physically stood in front of each other.

Maybe , one could argue thats down to childhood as some children would feel bad others wouldn't give a fuck. If the child dosnt feel bad or even care ,,,, should it have never been an issue ??

It's preposterous to suggest that the child isn't aware of this idiots little crusade, and that they haven't been exposed to transphobia as a result of this being put into the national media and the resultant public and online discourse.

It's not preposterous... I've had talks with trans teens ... been at info meetings ... had presentation from the mother of a trans autistic girl... within the people I met I've always encountered some who don't care what others think cause those around them do !

They tend to be on a whole accepting of different view points and people people. Sometimes we can get cought up it defending what we see as an offense , that we become blinkered to how liner our thinking gets .

I don't buy that at all. I don't know the child in question, and neither do you so this is all speculation... but I can't believe that they are unaffected by all this."

That's not the point I'm making point I'm making is your beliefs are blinkering you to the possibility of them being wrong or in fact of them being less important to the child than they are to you

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By *og-ManMan
over a year ago

somewhere

The student council wrote to Burke to explain their concerns about what effect he was having on the students in the school with his protest last week

He refused to take the letter off a student

Hope he's arrested for trespass tomorrow when he shows up with his dad

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By *itemeagainMan
over a year ago

Wexford


"The student council wrote to Burke to explain their concerns about what effect he was having on the students in the school with his protest last week

He refused to take the letter off a student

Hope he's arrested for trespass tomorrow when he shows up with his dad "

Now thats the way it should be imo .. we ask those that we feel offended for ... how dose this make you feel and what would you like to see happen ?

Its not a new concept. It also provides the most healing to those who have been done wrong .

Rather than the current situation of " society is best placed to judge weather you should be offended or not, and inturn society will decide the best punishment "

Sometimes it feels like we are still in the dark ages when it comes to justice .

When you take the decision from the person wronged , or worse you make it for them , your actually ignoring and Disempowering them .

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Which is all well and good but doesn't take into account the onus for schools for safeguarding.

Your view is admirable on the face of it. But how many children have said they're OK when they're not. How many have said they're not bothered when they're hurting inside. How many children say nothing out of fear.

This is why safeguarding exists.

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By *itemeagainMan
over a year ago

Wexford


"Which is all well and good but doesn't take into account the onus for schools for safeguarding.

Your view is admirable on the face of it. But how many children have said they're OK when they're not. How many have said they're not bothered when they're hurting inside. How many children say nothing out of fear.

This is why safeguarding exists."

This dosnt fall under a safeguarding concern as the legal requirements of safeguarding.

There is no child that imminent risk of abuse neglect or harm.

Being offended isn't child abuse.

Granted there are many children who hide their hurt. More often a result of not having a safe place to express it. That's up to us as adults to provide. However to tink and talk for teenagers and adolescents in my opinion is to assume that we know how they should feel and that we know what they want. It honestly has never worked in the past that's why we always end up with teenagers and adolescents feeling misunderstood and never heard.. I would say it's not admirable but practical if we are ever to have a society to genuinely me wants to understand things from each other's point of view.

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By *ubal1 OP   Man
over a year ago

Newry Down

Tomorrow is going to be an interesting day, because the injunction is still extant; if Enoch turns up at the school, Mountjoy beckons, and also possibly for anyone with him.

Three court hearings are in train and disciplinary appeal to be organised by the Minister for Education who appoints the Chairman.

Today I listened to an old Liveline broadcast which was interesting in that both Enoch and Martina, the mother, phoned Joe on the same issue, but both bizarrely said they did not know each other.

Martina is exceptionally articulate and intelligent but did sound slightly deluded, obsessive and unhinged.

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By *ursecretmischiefCouple
over a year ago

The West


"Tomorrow is going to be an interesting day, because the injunction is still extant; if Enoch turns up at the school, Mountjoy beckons, and also possibly for anyone with him.

Three court hearings are in train and disciplinary appeal to be organised by the Minister for Education who appoints the Chairman.

Today I listened to an old Liveline broadcast which was interesting in that both Enoch and Martina, the mother, phoned Joe on the same issue, but both bizarrely said they did not know each other.

Martina is exceptionally articulate and intelligent but did sound slightly deluded, obsessive and unhinged. "

There is no doubt she is a very intelligent woman.

It's something I've always felt; I don't trust intelligent people who claim to be very religious. It just doesn't sit with me!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"Tomorrow is going to be an interesting day, because the injunction is still extant; if Enoch turns up at the school, Mountjoy beckons, and also possibly for anyone with him.

Three court hearings are in train and disciplinary appeal to be organised by the Minister for Education who appoints the Chairman.

Today I listened to an old Liveline broadcast which was interesting in that both Enoch and Martina, the mother, phoned Joe on the same issue, but both bizarrely said they did not know each other.

Martina is exceptionally articulate and intelligent but did sound slightly deluded, obsessive and unhinged.

There is no doubt she is a very intelligent woman.

It's something I've always felt; I don't trust intelligent people who claim to be very religious. It just doesn't sit with me!"

And people in the pub not drinking

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By *ursecretmischiefCouple
over a year ago

The West


"

There is no doubt she is a very intelligent woman.

It's something I've always felt; I don't trust intelligent people who claim to be very religious. It just doesn't sit with me!

And people in the pub not drinking "

I don't them, they're the smart ones!

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By *itemeagainMan
over a year ago

Wexford


"Tomorrow is going to be an interesting day, because the injunction is still extant; if Enoch turns up at the school, Mountjoy beckons, and also possibly for anyone with him.

Three court hearings are in train and disciplinary appeal to be organised by the Minister for Education who appoints the Chairman.

Today I listened to an old Liveline broadcast which was interesting in that both Enoch and Martina, the mother, phoned Joe on the same issue, but both bizarrely said they did not know each other.

Martina is exceptionally articulate and intelligent but did sound slightly deluded, obsessive and unhinged.

There is no doubt she is a very intelligent woman.

It's something I've always felt; I don't trust intelligent people who claim to be very religious. It just doesn't sit with me!"

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By *iscuits8Man
over a year ago

Meath / Dublin / Birmingham

I see this fucking loser turned up to school driven by his daddy again today

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By *og-ManMan
over a year ago

somewhere


"I see this fucking loser turned up to school driven by his daddy again today"

The daddy drove off and left him in there

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By *iscuits8Man
over a year ago

Meath / Dublin / Birmingham

I'm sure he'll be back to collect him later and bring him home in time for breastfeeding with his ma

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By *og-ManMan
over a year ago

somewhere


"I'm sure he'll be back to collect him later and bring him home in time for breastfeeding with his ma"

You'd think the fucker would take driving lessons now that hes not working

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By *iscuits8Man
over a year ago

Meath / Dublin / Birmingham

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I'm sure he'll be back to collect him later and bring him home in time for breastfeeding with his ma

You'd think the fucker would take driving lessons now that hes not working "

Well at least we'll never meet him out dogging

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By *iscuits8Man
over a year ago

Meath / Dublin / Birmingham


"I'm sure he'll be back to collect him later and bring him home in time for breastfeeding with his ma

You'd think the fucker would take driving lessons now that hes not working

Well at least we'll never meet him out dogging"

Maybe you would but the whole family would still be with him

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By *th dub buddiesCouple
over a year ago

Dundrum


"Jubal

Privacy????and the chap is looking for coffee meets??just saying...

I presume its a hobby of yours to go to various course cases

Do you just go to the high profile ones or do you go to all sorts

I have been to tens of thousands of court hearings all over Ireland, north and south and also in London.

Truthfully, I have had conversations, on the public street, with senior judges including the former Lord Chief Justice of NI.

On one occasion, a judge came down from the Bench and asked for my opinion of his performance, that I provided, bluntly and to the point.

My presence at hearings arouses a lot of interest, from many different people

On one occasion, in NI, several years ago, because of unusual circumstances I was the only member of the public permitted to sit in the public gallery in a serious trial.

I have also acted as a McKenzie Friend, an unpaid legal assistant to a self-represented litigant, with success.

At one time, I used to go to court hearings on six days per week.

If I reveal any more details I would not be difficult to ascertain my real identity. Nuff said!

The man is entitled to his views

And privacy "

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"I'm sure he'll be back to collect him later and bring him home in time for breastfeeding with his ma

You'd think the fucker would take driving lessons now that hes not working

Well at least we'll never meet him out dogging

Maybe you would but the whole family would still be with him "

Now that's kinky

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By *og-ManMan
over a year ago

somewhere

Hope the Guards tell his dad that he's been arrested and taken away from the school

Don't want him turning up after school to collect him like all the other parents collecting their sons

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By *ilthyNightsCouple
over a year ago

East / North, Cork

From... https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2023/0124/1350483-enoch-burke/

The schools STUDENT council wrote a letter that "said that for many LGBTQI+ students, Mr Burke's presence in the school "is a daily reminder of the prejudices they feel".

We should indeed listen to what the students themselves say, and surprise surprise they feel the prejudice.

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By *ofusplusCouple
over a year ago

Limerick


"From... https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2023/0124/1350483-enoch-burke/

The schools STUDENT council wrote a letter that "said that for many LGBTQI+ students, Mr Burke's presence in the school "is a daily reminder of the prejudices they feel".

We should indeed listen to what the students themselves say, and surprise surprise they feel the prejudice."

For anyone with an ounce of humanity, this comes as no surprise.

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By *urfdudeMan
over a year ago

WEXFORD

What are the chances of him turning up at the school again tomorrow ?

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By *ubal1 OP   Man
over a year ago

Newry Down

Enoch Burke turned up at his former school today, twice, but didn't turn up on Monday because the gates were closed-training day taking place inside.

It is hard to judge how this case is ever going to be resolved; the Burke's do like a fight, either at disciplinary hearings or in the Four Courts, Dublin

Enoch's case has multiple levels of appeal(s) to progress through over the forthcoming years: at least five.

The chair of the first levelbof appeal has to be appointed by the Minister for Education; and thence into the court system with satellite litigation also taking place.

An interesting development is that the Teachers'union has expressed 'concern' about how Burke has been treated by the school.

This case is going to run and run,possibly for years

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By *ananaman41Man
over a year ago

Dublin


"Enoch Burke turned up at his former school today, twice, but didn't turn up on Monday because the gates were closed-training day taking place inside.

It is hard to judge how this case is ever going to be resolved; the Burke's do like a fight, either at disciplinary hearings or in the Four Courts, Dublin

Enoch's case has multiple levels of appeal(s) to progress through over the forthcoming years: at least five.

The chair of the first levelbof appeal has to be appointed by the Minister for Education; and thence into the court system with satellite litigation also taking place.

An interesting development is that the Teachers'union has expressed 'concern' about how Burke has been treated by the school.

This case is going to run and run,possibly for years "

Have they? Do you have a link for that somewhere? I haven't seen that. Interesting

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By *ubal1 OP   Man
over a year ago

Newry Down

Mr Justice Dignam last week said that Enoch Burke had a very strong case regarding the flaws in the school's disciplinary process, but on an Equity basis, did not grant his own injunction, because he had disrespected the Hospital school's.

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By *og-ManMan
over a year ago

somewhere

Enoch is not a member of any teachers union

The union didn't make an official complaint but it was made known by leaking of their concern

The absolute gobshite was stopped trying to get back in the 3rd time today by the headmaster at the gates and then insisted on standing there and shouting to the media that he was unlawfully arrested over and over again

It was like looking at a child having a temper tantrum ...once again everyone else is wrong and he's right

I wonder when his patents die will he look back in anger at the way his life turns out

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By *ay_Gatsby_D4Man
over a year ago

City Centre, Dublin

If the media would just ignore him he’d give up and fuck off home

If he gets coverage and attention for screaming and shouting and stamping his feet, he’ll keep on doing it

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By *ubal1 OP   Man
over a year ago

Newry Down

I applaud Enoch Burke's determination in pursuing his views, whilst not necessarily agreeing with them, per se.

As an unrepresented litigant, with relatives as McKenzie friends, they are, by a long chalk, the best I have ever seen or heard. They are truly a phenomenon.

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By *ananaman41Man
over a year ago

Dublin


"Enoch is not a member of any teachers union

The union didn't make an official complaint but it was made known by leaking of their concern

The absolute gobshite was stopped trying to get back in the 3rd time today by the headmaster at the gates and then insisted on standing there and shouting to the media that he was unlawfully arrested over and over again

It was like looking at a child having a temper tantrum ...once again everyone else is wrong and he's right

I wonder when his patents die will he look back in anger at the way his life turns out "

Interesting how the teachers union so appear to have concern with how he was treated

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By *ursecretmischiefCouple
over a year ago

The West


"If the media would just ignore him he’d give up and fuck off home

If he gets coverage and attention for screaming and shouting and stamping his feet, he’ll keep on doing it"

The family are complete media whores. Their profile and cash flow relies on it.

It's noticeable how many of their initial supporters got bored or grew tired and moved on to emigration or something else.

Time for the media to do likewise.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago


"If the media would just ignore him he’d give up and fuck off home

If he gets coverage and attention for screaming and shouting and stamping his feet, he’ll keep on doing it

The family are complete media whores. Their profile and cash flow relies on it.

It's noticeable how many of their initial supporters got bored or grew tired and moved on to emigration or something else.

Time for the media to do likewise."

Yes but it’s all intertwined isn’t it

S

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By *urfdudeMan
over a year ago

WEXFORD

Guess what, he is back at the school gates looking for attention again.

He cant drive so his parents dropped him off.

He is distracting students and wasting Garda time.

Would 100 days in Mountjoy not cop you on ? One minute would be enough for most people.

What a family, his sister also lost her job as a solicitor with a big firm 3 years ago and has been blaming them ever since.

They will both be unemployable in Ireland

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By *ensualandslow321Man
over a year ago

Tullamore


"Guess what, he is back at the school gates looking for attention again.

He cant drive so his parents dropped him off.

He is distracting students and wasting Garda time.

Would 100 days in Mountjoy not cop you on ? One minute would be enough for most people.

What a family, his sister also lost her job as a solicitor with a big firm 3 years ago and has been blaming them ever since.

They will both be unemployable in Ireland"

Totally agree with you. Lots of room for self righteous, rabid, evangelical Christians in the US

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By *itemeagainMan
over a year ago

Wexford


"From... https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2023/0124/1350483-enoch-burke/

The schools STUDENT council wrote a letter that "said that for many LGBTQI+ students, Mr Burke's presence in the school "is a daily reminder of the prejudices they feel".

We should indeed listen to what the students themselves say, and surprise surprise they feel the prejudice.

For anyone with an ounce of humanity, this comes as no surprise."

Surly up until this issue this teacher has been considered to "at least an ounce of humanity " given he was appointed as a teacher to these students in the first place... or are we to believe teachers without "an ounce of humanity " are given this important role?

To suggest there is no humidity is to stand on the highest pedestal you can find , hide all your own prejudices and mistakes and start chucking rocks

I believe its a lack of Decency, on the teachers part too not call a person by what they would like. This can be done out of respect for your fellow human without changing your beliefs. The unfortunate fact about this whole case is it now has left both parties feeling as if they have to defend their beliefs and feeling punished because of those beliefs.

This should have and could have been handled and sorted within the school . To some extent it looks as if the school wanted a more legitimate case that would justify sacking. . Its a shity indication for us all that we still can't believe different things and respect eachother at the same time

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By *ubal1 OP   Man
over a year ago

Newry Down

Purely speculatively, I went to the Four Courts today to see if Enoch and family were there, but the case regarding seizure of his assets was not listed.

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By *antas_number_one_elfWoman
over a year ago

dublin


"From... https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2023/0124/1350483-enoch-burke/

The schools STUDENT council wrote a letter that "said that for many LGBTQI+ students, Mr Burke's presence in the school "is a daily reminder of the prejudices they feel".

We should indeed listen to what the students themselves say, and surprise surprise they feel the prejudice.

For anyone with an ounce of humanity, this comes as no surprise.

Surly up until this issue this teacher has been considered to "at least an ounce of humanity " given he was appointed as a teacher to these students in the first place... or are we to believe teachers without "an ounce of humanity " are given this important role?

To suggest there is no humidity is to stand on the highest pedestal you can find , hide all your own prejudices and mistakes and start chucking rocks

I believe its a lack of Decency, on the teachers part too not call a person by what they would like. This can be done out of respect for your fellow human without changing your beliefs. The unfortunate fact about this whole case is it now has left both parties feeling as if they have to defend their beliefs and feeling punished because of those beliefs.

This should have and could have been handled and sorted within the school . To some extent it looks as if the school wanted a more legitimate case that would justify sacking. . Its a shity indication for us all that we still can't believe different things and respect eachother at the same time "

Given the fact the entire family seem to run into difficulties no matter where they venture outside the family home, and a number of his family members have ended up in court and losing their job, losing out on how exciting first year of college would be, and the likes, I doubt the school would have sorted this quietly. This family is a drain on public resources and for someone who is so fond of their “rights” they seem to lack any regard for their responsibilities, respecting court orders, understanding that when you’re fired, you don’t show up the next day. They are awful people.

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