FabSwingers.com forum: TS/TV

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

I do wish the site would differentiate between Transsexuals and Transvestites, it might help people understand that the two are in no way related and that no, most transsexuals do not have a cock that wants sucking!

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By *rs DCouple
over a year ago

far

"I do wish the site would differentiate between Transsexuals and Transvestites, it might help people understand that the two are in no way related and that no, most transsexuals do not have a cock that wants sucking! "
theres mr Ds dream gone out the window then

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By *Carver-Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

Definitely. It really is my biggest complaint about the site - not just that it's a headache, but it really reinforces the hurtful stereotype of trans women essentially being just "men in dresses".

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It will never happen.

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By *andb69Couple
over a year ago

leeds

Fully agree!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

There is an earlier thread, called separate TS/TV (I would prefer TG to TS). Last comment about a week ago, maybe add to that discussion?

But yes, it's poor from a perspective of doing the search, and it's really annoying when people expect you to fit their preconceptions

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By *Carver-Man
over a year ago

Glasgow

"There is an earlier thread, called separate TS/TV (I would prefer TG to TS). Last comment about a week ago, maybe add to that discussion?

But yes, it's poor from a perspective of doing the search, and it's really annoying when people expect you to fit their preconceptions"

Off-topic, but Helena, I just read your profile and you sound like the coolest person to know irl. Have a rad day.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

So many threads on this, wonder if Admin would care to comment? x

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I don't think they ever have.

To split TS/TV into 2 separate orientations only requires minor code additions but hardly anything has changed in the years I've been on here.

It's a very basic old style of forums but they seem to want to stick with it.

There's thousands of forums far more modern with much smaller revenues than what this site looks like it can / could generate.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Faceless coward x don't let it get u down x

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

You may have to do a spell on the naughty step tho for posting it x hope not x

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Faceless coward x don't let it get u down x "

Eh ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Not you Andy, OP posted re an abusive message she'd received but admin have now deleted the post x sorry if u felt I was getting at you, not the case lol xxx

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

No problems just didn't seem to fit right but happens when posts get removed, been called worse anyway

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By *enny79TV/TS
over a year ago

chesterfield

Amen to that I hate my clit("cock") being involved in any way personally

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By *inkyChrissy99TV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol

If you're meeting and you are TV/ts can tou not just state that on your profile.... If they ask silly questions then just direct them...

I don't want it split personally- i'm TV/cd so a 'man in a dress' but I certainly don't act or look like one.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 01/10/16 10:20:20]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Let's unpick some of the arguments against separating the categories of "transvestite" and "transgender".

"It's a sex site. No one is interested in the difference between a pre-op/non-op transwoman and a cross-dresser, because they have the same genitals."

Some people actually look for more in a partner than their genitals, even for the most casual of encounters. You don't know what most people on the site want, because you never asked them. You can only go off threads like this, where people actually care enough to express their opinion. And where there's overwhelming support for separating the two categories. If people don't want to make the distinction, they can always search for both.

"If they were separate, then people searching for TG wouldn't see my profile"

Yes, because THEY'RE NOT LOOKING FOR YOU.

"How would you police it?"

Well principally, the whole idea of wanting to police gender is wrong, because, a person's gender isn't up to anyone apart from THAT PERSON. But, as it happens, there is nothing currently to stop:

Any man putting himself in any other gender category he doesn't belong (including having a TV/TS profile whilst presenting and dressing like a man, which I've seen done a lot.)

A man who looks convincingly like a woman being photo verified as one, either single or as part of a couple.

The verification system may help to stop this kind of thing, but it can never be foolproof.

"It's a slippery slope to..."

No it isn't. This is a request for ONE specific, and very simple change to be made to the site. And anyway, if people wanted to put themselves in one a multitude of genders, or wanted to look for one of those genders, and people who wanted to stay as M or F, looking for M or F, could still go about using the site in the same way they've always done, without noticing any real difference. As everyone who got up in arms about OKC doing it soon realised. Except that you might not come across feminazi tumblr-using gender abolitionists like myself. Which only upsets and offends you anyway.

At the end of the day, gender is much more than the label that meat-market consumers want to put on you.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Off-topic, but Helena, I just read your profile and you sound like the coolest person to know irl. Have a rad day.

Thank you. If all guys were like you, then I wouldn't have to block all of yous.

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By *ougar_n_TILFCouple
over a year ago

Burton on Trent

I think the argument for this split is being fought on two fronts, only one of which has any sort of real justification, the other is just selfish.

Firstly, the transgender people who dislike being lumped in the same category as CD/TV. And rightly so as they are entirely different things, and it is this side of the argument I would support as it's entirely justified.

Then there are the people looking for TG people (mainly Trans-women) to indulge their own sexual fetishes, who simply dislike having to wade through hundreds of CD/TV profiles to find the one or two proper TG in their area. So their opinion on the matter is driven by the desire to save them time. Not very justifiable really.

The whole thing seems designed to push the CD/TV people further into the bottom of the FAB pecking order. And if the site owners did separate the categories then people would be free to self certify what they are anyway. We know several girls who would certify as TG rather than TV, as they are non-binary. But suspect that as they do not fit into most people's fetishised ideal of what transwoman is, i.e-'passes' as a woman, big cock, big tits etc, then their profile would be reported umpteen times. Simply for not conforming to some bullshit ideal.

So I suspect the decision to leave things as they are is purely to save them a shit-load of extra admin that a split would generate.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So I suspect the decision to leave things as they are is purely to save them a shit-load of extra admin that a split would generate."

Thing is though, even if NO adminning was done at all, and there were cross-dressers who put themselves as TG, the problem would still be a lesser one than what's happening already.

Thank you for your support on the matter.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Also, our trans brothers deserve a shout out here. In an earlier thread on the same topic, one has commented that he has to categorise himself as a woman in order to use the site with any effectiveness.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Also, our trans brothers deserve a shout out here. In an earlier thread on the same topic, one has commented that he has to categorise himself as a woman in order to use the site with any effectiveness."

Absolutely this is really unacceptable x

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By *ougar_n_TILFCouple
over a year ago

Burton on Trent

"So I suspect the decision to leave things as they are is purely to save them a shit-load of extra admin that a split would generate.

Thing is though, even if NO adminning was done at all, and there were cross-dressers who put themselves as TG, the problem would still be a lesser one than what's happening already.

Thank you for your support on the matter."

You're welcome, but I think you missed my point.

The level of profile reports would go up for people who ARE transgendered. Because those that are looking for them for sex are looking for a certain unrealistic ideal, and if you don't fit that ideal, then a lot would see you only as CD/TV. Not to mention the number of malicious reports they'd get when they turn people down.

I think it would be a lot of hassle to implement and police. And the only positive benefit would be to achieve a separation of TG from the others. But commendable as that would be, this is a site about having sex with multiple partners, I hardly think it's breaking down any 4th walls in society.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It would be saddening to see that Trans heirarchy imposed here, that sordid pecking order were some are considered superior to the majority of us, seen this continually on Trans websites and Trans groups...

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By *enny79TV/TS
over a year ago

chesterfield

Too true hon get it all the time and hate it grrrrr

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"It would be saddening to see that Trans heirarchy imposed here, that sordid pecking order were some are considered superior to the majority of us, seen this continually on Trans websites and Trans groups..."

It's not about a "hierarchy" it's about, it's the fact that being a cross-dresser and being a transgender person are two cometely different things, and that people might want to meet one and not the other. Should we just abolish the gender categories altogether?

On the subject if malicious reporting, you might have a point, although, but are people really going to get that petty? I mean do people get reported much already as being a "fake profile" just because someone got turned down?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I know from using other sites that , where there's a multitude of gender options (that are completely self-defined, and not "policed", that male cross-dresser s use labels like TG, or MtF, and that will happen here. I think you have to take it in conjunction with you what's written on a the profile. But in the vast majority of cases, people will pick the category that they feel most accurately describes them. People who don't understand the difference, I'd have thouht, wouldn't be bothered to report a profile that they think is in the "wrong" category.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I just want to add a couple of points here.

Cross-dessing men who are trying to argue that separating is divisive and hierarchical: aren't you, by labelling yourself as a TS/TV, making the point that you are "different to other men"? What's the difference please?

Secondly, the reason that transgressions from gender norms is that people read gender indentity and gender presentation as being an indicator of what someone has inside their pants, as though it was something that you're entitled to know the moment you see them. IT ISN'T.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

OK one last point, I promise.

A post-op transwoman is likely be inundated with requests with requests to do things with the penis that she doesn't have if she puts herself down as a TS/TV, so it would be far more practical at the moment to define themselves a woman. But she might still receive hostility for doing so, and I think she has a right to prevent this by labelling herself as TG.

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By *ougar_n_TILFCouple
over a year ago

Burton on Trent

If we are going to stick labels on things (waits for the "don't label people BS), then as soon as a post-op M2F sets her profile as TS or TG then she is opening herself up to the fetishization of her trans situation.

Because why else would a male, couple or whatever look specifically for a TS/TG (pre or post-op) if it wasn't because they had a fetish about it?

And if you put yourself as Female? Well you must have heard the horror stories from Trans-women who've gone to bed with a guy, who has then reacted badly to being 'tricked'?

It unfortunately becomes a far more complex subject when you take into account the reason for this site's existence, than rightly not wanting to be in the same category with the TV/CD.

To which there is a hierarchy unfortunately. Have heard similar phrases to "Oh Her! She's JUST a CD", used before now.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

@WildernessCouple You've hit the nail on the head here. Being open about being trans can have dangerous consequences. Not being open about being trans can have dangerous consequences.

Just to clarify, in case there was any ambiguity, I don't believe that a post-op trans woman should HAVE to state it, but for reasons discussed, should have that option. And there's always going to be someone who will start being aggressive for daring to be attractive and trans.

And in terms of why people "have to label themselves", well my question is, why should people have to accept the labels that other people have foisted upon you, which will always be the inevitable outcome of not labelling yourself.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

To those that are effected and to those that care a breakdown of classifications as suggested would make sense . . but . .

The issue we think to both Admin and to Users isn't one of "physical demarcation", that's all "cut and dried" . . sorry for the bad pun, it's much more a case of how do you prevent the whole idea being ruined by "recreational demarcation"?

To quote one simple example . . look how many "HPW's" (hairy pantie wearers) on Tv(Chix) describe themselves as "Pre-Op Transsexuals".

Not easy, is it?

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By *ayde BlanchardTV/TS
over a year ago

lancashire

I completely agree with you and the tv/ts spectrum on here is way to varied. I personally hate messages that I get from people e.g love to suck your cock. My block list just gets bigger and bigger.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I raised this about a year ago under our last name. A bunch of retards tried arguing against it back then. I can't even remember what idiocy they went on with.

Anyways, moral of this story is: nothing's changed and nothing does.

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By *ylonSlutTV/TS
over a year ago

Durham

I completely agree with you and the tv/ts spectrum on here is way to varied. I personally hate messages that I get from people e.g love to suck your cock. My block list just gets bigger and bigger. "

They goes the problem a guy watches some "transsexual" porn and assumes every transsexual looks like that and has massive fake tits and a huge always hard cock.

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By *ayde BlanchardTV/TS
over a year ago

lancashire

I think that's why more and more tv/ts are only meeting other tv/ts. I get fed up with these Neanderthals that send you a cock pic with the line meet now?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

We are, as a couple, very sympathetic to the TS community yet despite our openness and better understanding than many we have real problems trying not to "put our foot in it".

. . if ever one aspect of human sexuality deserves the sub-title "How long is a piece of string" it's this category.

I was going to paste in some quick definitions from Wiki to try to show the demarcation between Transvestite and Transsexual but even that idea was almost impossible.

Perhaps the greater public awareness of "Transgender issues" today does mean that so many previously acceptable "handles", such as TV, CD, TS and so on, are now not only dated but, to many, can be taken as an offence.

But, please read our posting above, not one of you has any hope in hell of forming something more accurate for the 21st Century as long as the most popular TV UK dating site has NO ISSUES with a married male donning his wife's undies and tights, blissfully ignorant of the label HPW, and adding himself to the list as a . . "pre-op transsexual" . . whereupon he will go on to meet other similarly dressed married men so equally described for mutual cock sucking sessions . . and how many times in their profiles does one read the words : "Men? Yuk!!!"

Gurls? You have to get together and sort our your own community I think before you change the attitude of general swingers . . not sure whether you build on "TS" or "TG" . . think both have now become tainted. Find another fresh handle and police it for HPW's.

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By *hloe sussexTV/TS
over a year ago

Larne

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By *ayde BlanchardTV/TS
over a year ago

lancashire

No I realise not everyone knows the difference.

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By *inkyChrissy99TV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol

This is an impossible area to police as everybody is different.

TV/cds and ts come in a broad spectrum and often cross over boundaries.

For example I take hormones and have laser treatments so I have ts tendancies but see myself as more of gender fluid tv really.

Maybe we just need a few more categories?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This is an impossible area to police as everybody is different . . .

Maybe we just need a few more categories? "

We think that one important "chioce" needs to be established in whatever "handle" is used for sites such as this . . "sex or no sex". This thought is prompted by many of the earlier comments on this thread and, if there was just one "choice" that causes more frustration and/or anger than any other, then it's the assumption made by many in answering the question.

Not able to tell - obviously - but Gurls here may be able to do so . . the "popular TV web-site for chix" does have a "chioce" that can be used in ones profile that states : "Not looking to meet"? Does it work? What about one that states : "Not looking for sex".

It's for YOUR community to band together and sort something out that works and it has to be CLEAR . . after all maybe more will want to meet guys for sex as those who don't? As a group, if you will, these guys are only reacting to what they see and read?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The badges looking to meet, no males please and no tgirls please does not stop most people on that site. They 'just try on the off chance as they thought there may be an exception'.

I agree with a split. And on a more selfish note, it would stop me (maybe) receiving at least one mail per day asking if I have breasts.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"This is an impossible area to police as everybody is different . . .

Maybe we just need a few more categories?

Yeah, but you think saying not looking for sex will stop the muppets from messaging. No chance!

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By *ylonSlutTV/TS
over a year ago

Durham

"The badges looking to meet, no males please and no tgirls please does not stop most people on that site. They 'just try on the off chance as they thought there may be an exception'.

I agree with a split. And on a more selfish note, it would stop me (maybe) receiving at least one mail per day asking if I have breasts."

That would help not all TS have breasts and some TVs do.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

". . . We think that one important "chioce" needs to be established in whatever "handle" is used for sites such as this . . "sex or no sex". . . .

Yeah, but you think saying not looking for sex will stop the muppets from messaging. No chance!"

Regrettably . . no.

But such a feature would be a start, wouldn't it?

Nothing, short of removing ones profile, stops ALL muppties asking stupid questions BUT if a gurl's profile had such things shown clearly perhaps even used as a filter . . then at the "point of source" interested persons wishing contact could choose which group to pester . . sex or no sex.

. . and you just know which group will get pestered more BUT isn't that an improvement for the "other group"?

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By *eordie JoJoTV/TS
over a year ago

Newcastle

Intergration not segregation ....

Why oh why does our society love to "pigeon hole" folk? .... why do we need to fit into a box? ....

If we all loved ourselves and didn't worry as much what the majority thinks then regardless if your a TS or TV or gender fluid ... what's the issue ...

Surely it's up to individuals to state exactly what they like their terminology to be ... and this would show on a profile...

To be honest to split or not to split ... I couldn't careless ... I'm here for ME! .. not for anyone else ... spend a bit more time on your profile ... as you do in your make up and those that look at your profile should be able to distinguish exactly what you are ... or even better educate them if they ask or just block

.... for me I would like to see a chat room as their is a political chat room on a sex site

therefore can't see why TS/TV can't have a chat room

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By *irceWoman
over a year ago

Gloucester

Good luck, have tried for 12 months to get a change on here, also transphobic comments i have reported stay on...something is defo wrong on FaB take our money and ignore a problem which would help many out.....or have with a issue with ""LGB............(T)""

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

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By *ISTRESSBISUBCouple
over a year ago

Newark Lincoln

Well we find transsexuals tell us before hand and then that is respected at all times and from experience its 50/50

end of debate?

suck -sorry Such tasks are a joy btw

xxxxx

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Intergration not segregation ....

Why oh why does our society love to "pigeon hole" folk? .... why do we need to fit into a box? ....

If we all loved ourselves and didn't worry as much what the majority thinks then regardless if your a TS or TV or gender fluid ... what's the issue ...

Surely it's up to individuals to state exactly what they like their terminology to be ... and this would show on a profile...

.... for me I would like to see a chat room as their is a political chat room on a sex site

therefore can't see why TS/TV can't have a chat room

There is no politics chatroom on here however there is a politics forum two different things

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I started a thread like this before myself. As a transsexual woman myself I get very frustrated with this subject on this website, and I have found that most cross dressers and transvestites are the ones on the other side telling us that we shouldn't be splitting up.

I personally believe for this reason cross dressers/transvestites do not actually dress up as biological women, but mostly dress up as this concept of "she males", I would also say that 80% of transvestites are also into transsexual women. One has to wonder why they are the ones arguing against leaving transsexual spaces?

And before anyone throws the "I'm gender queer" "I'm non binary" bullshit at me, I would like to see scientific studies that back this up. Because transsexualism has been studied and has medical backup yet non binary people use the social gender spectrum as their excuse. Whilst calling themselves trans? If you do not follow the gender binary, then you are not transGENDERED considering tranSEXuals stick to the gender binary and transition from one sex or the other, and if not medically transitioned they have still show signs of having the same brain waves of the desired sex.

TV/TS needs to be split up, this is an arguement that has happened on this website for a long time and it's about time that fabswingers caters to all of its users rather than tailor to cis men.

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By *inkyChrissy99TV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol

"I started a thread like this before myself. As a transsexual woman myself I get very frustrated with this subject on this website, and I have found that most cross dressers and transvestites are the ones on the other side telling us that we shouldn't be splitting up.

TV/TS needs to be split up, this is an arguement that has happened on this website for a long time and it's about time that fabswingers caters to all of its users rather than tailor to cis men.

Take a look at what you have wrote.

Your view is just like that of transphobic people that have discriminated against you or people like you for years- just for being you.

Now for being me and feeling gender neutral and not fitting either gender binary its a mental issue and therefore I should be ignored and segragated- i'm not even trans now????

I'm sure I have just angered you but please stop and think- if only for a second.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

TV/TS needs to be split up, this is an arguement that has happened on this website for a long time and it's about time that fabswingers caters to all of its users rather than tailor to cis men.

Fabswingers is wise in keeping us all clumped together

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yes, I said it. Non binary people are NOT trans.

I'm sorry if you do not like this, but I work with facts and not feelings.

1 There have been studies done on actual transsexual people, and not once have they concluded from any of the studies that a person does not have a gender. They were able to validate transsexual people, but not non binary as it does not exist.

The human body has chromosomes and hormones, you and I would not be alive without them. Therefore the idea that agender and non binary exist as a legit medical condition delusional.

2 Trans works synonymous with transformation in regards to the gender binary, if you are not part of the gender binary then you have not transformed into anything. Therefore you are not trans. You are cis, who likes to play on socitial constructs of masculinity and feminity. There is nothing wrong with that, but again do not perpetuate and appropirate the struggle that real transsexual people have endured through gender dysphoria. Because transsexual people usually tend to stick to the gender binary, transitioning from one sex to the other. Non binary people have no intention to transition because they do not have gender dysphoria to motivate them.

3 "Trans" is synonymous and widely used to describe transsexuals.

transsexual

trans's?k???l,tr??ns-,-nz-,-sj??l/

noun

a person who emotionally and psychologically feels that they belong to the opposite sex.

"a pre-operative male-to-female transsexual"

adjective

trans person

'tranzp??s

noun

noun: trans person

a person who is transgender or transsexual.

"a female-to-male transperson"

you can't accuse me of being transphobic because you are not trans.

If you want to respond to this, then please make sure you provide me legitimate sources.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 19/11/16 00:38:00]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I can see that those in this forum that identify themselves as transsexual women/men are backing the idea of splitting up the TS/TV sections.

Though transvestites - who usually put on a costume and take it off at night, then socialise in their day to day lives as men are the ones shouting us down for having the conversation.

Talk about the patriachy.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

For those of you not grasping the issue here then watch this video, explains it better than I could

https://youtu.be/x5mlNZ6J7Ck

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Could we not try and give each other the confidence and support to describe our gender specifics to each other, i mean if no others give a toss except for counting spuds? Then its really surely about , giving each other a hand to help gain some invaluable opportunity to describe ourselves to someone who isnt judging immediately.

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By *inkyChrissy99TV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol

"For those of you not grasping the issue here then watch this video, explains it better than I could

https://youtu.be/x5mlNZ6J7Ck"

Oh do be quiet your ignorance is deafening.

And I am trans, I do have daily struggles with my gender.

So do many that you mock.

But you can't see past your own nose.

The evidence was created to support trans an create a black and white: to make life easier for professionals to diagnose.

Teansphobic people could chuck plenty of evidence at you to prove you have nothing genetically different and its all in your head so don't even try and play that 'card'

Its amazing how many trans are now above others with gender issues once diagnosed, really is pathetic.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

You do not even know anything about me. I was the biggest supporter of non-binary individuals and was inclusive to everyone identifying as whatever they want. I even have friends who identify as such (more about that when I share my opinion at the end)

It was through transphobia that motivated me to go into research in transgender issues and I read hours, upon hours of medical research regarding transgender issues. I did this so I would be able to back up and fight against transphobia.

Now, I will provide you the opportunity to provide legitimate sources for a third and final time to change my heart, blow my mind which will inevitably have me giving you an apology, yet you have yet to do so... why? why is this? instead you call me ignorant, yet between you and myself I am the one talking facts whilst you are talking feelings. I am asking you to provide this because I want to believe you.

Did you watch the super simplistic video that I had linked? because I have the feeling you did not. You are the ignorant one here.

You can identify and support the trans movement if you please, but it does not mean you are transsexual, and therefore arguing against transsexual people on trans issues is counterproductive and does more damage than good.

We want the TS/TV separated in this instance, yet you are the one who knows better than us and arguing against it. That is quite trans-misogynistic.

Now, from talking to my friends who identify themselves as non-binary, I have come to the conclusion that they are non op transsexuals, they are still sticking to the gender binary however. But do not transition due to societal marginalization, family or other reasons - but it still does not mean that they do not have a gender, or sex or are BOTH sexes.

Again; I will repeat - no human being has been born without a sex or gender. And feeling masculine or feminine is not a basis to say you are trans. It just means you're either a tomboy or a feminine man.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I am a female TV, not a full time TS so daytime meets are very unlikely unless you wanna play with me as a guy too

- Source: your profile.

So much for being non-binary considering you, yourself are sticking to the gender binary and have even described yourself as a transvestite.

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By *ELLONS AND CREAMWoman
over a year ago

stourbridge area

Oh dear ... handbags at dawn

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By *inkyChrissy99TV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol

I understand exactly what you mean, I see you have looked long and hard for facts.

You also have lots of people round you that identify as I do.

That just leaves me confused as to why you are so angry and wish TV/ts's to be separated in such an aggressive manner.

We are not that dissimilar and probably think very alike and have the same issues with our genders.

Lucky you that your situation is so black and white- I envy you just as much as people with no gender issues that fit the gender stereotypes so perfectly.

""I am a female TV, not a full time TS so daytime meets are very unlikely unless you wanna play with me as a guy too

- Source: your profile.

So much for being non-binary considering you, yourself are sticking to the gender binary and have even described yourself as a transvestite. "

Thats my profile on fab.... Really you're gonna judge me on that?

That high horse just got a lot smaller.

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By *s.KerryTV/TS
over a year ago

Blackpool

Is it just me or is this thread just going round and round in circles?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I am not angry at you personally, you were the one that came for me, I'm just responding to you. I am not "angry" I'm just being blunt.

"We are not that dissimilar and probably think very alike and have the same issues with our genders."

The subject here is if transvestites and transsexuals should be categorised together. Now the reason why the trans community are against this is due to the fact that transvestites and transsexuals are two different groups of people.

Transvestites are typically cross dressers, drag queens or performers who typically are cis people that dress up for entertainment, sexual or cultural reasons.

People in this group essentially wear a costume.

Transsexuals are individuals that need medical intervention, identify, and live as the opposite sex they were assigned at birth. They also have scientific data backing up that this is a condition that started in the womb and is neurological.

The fact that Fabswingers is basically catering towards cis men, and categorising both transvestites and transsexuals together is invalidating transsexual people, and basically saying that "transsexuals are essentially men in costume too" - THAT IS TRANSPHOBIA.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Why stop at splitting tv and ts,s why not add all the other genres like fluids

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By *inkyChrissy99TV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol

"I am not angry at you personally, you were the one that came for me, I'm just responding to you. I am not "angry" I'm just being blunt.

"We are not that dissimilar and probably think very alike and have the same issues with our genders."

Transvestites are typically cross dressers, drag queens or performers who typically are cis people that dress up for entertainment, sexual or cultural reasons.

People in this group essentially wear a costume.

The problem is I don't see transvestites and transsexuals as black and white like you do.

Its that simple.

Many transvestites have gender issues and many transsexuals decide they have to be transexual to conform and be taken serious as a trans individual.

Thats the hard truth whether you like it or not.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

These many "transvestites" who have gender issues are non op "transsexuals"

It is that black and white.

No one DECIDES to be transsexual, that's how you are born, you either chose to transition or not, but regardless of transitioning or not they are still transexual.

It is that black or white. And clearly, you are not trans after all considering you can not comprehend this.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Why stop at splitting tv and ts,s why not add all the other genres like fluids"

Because these "fluid" genders do not exist. That's social constructs that people who are nonconforming have created and attached themselves to the transgender train.

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By *inkyChrissy99TV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol

"These many "transvestites" who have gender issues are non op "transsexuals"

It is that black and white.

No one DECIDES to be transsexual, that's how you are born, you either chose to transition or not, but regardless of transitioning or not they are still transexual.

It is that black or white. And clearly, you are not trans after all considering you can not comprehend this."

its not, its just not.

and what a sweeping statement.

I have said many times in this thread i have gender issues but classify myself as a transvestite.

you then say all these types of people are non op transexuals.

Then you go on to say i am obviously not trans.......

So easy, black and white yet you just completly contradicted yourself

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The problem is I don't see transvestites and transsexuals as black and white like you do.

Its that simple." "

Of course you don't, cause you are not trans.

"Many transvestites have gender issues and many transsexuals decide they have to be transexual to conform and be taken serious as a trans individual.

Thats the hard truth whether you like it or not."

Like non op transsexuals? they are still transsexual wherever they transition or not. Thats called gender dysphoria, something that is associated to transsexuals, not transvestites.

(http://www.nhs.uk/conditions/gender-dysphoria/Pages/Introduction.aspx)

Please introduce me to these people who are adamant that they are both cis men in dresses, and transsexual at the same time?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Why stop at splitting tv and ts,s why not add all the other genres like fluids

Because these "fluid" genders do not exist. That's social constructs that people who are nonconforming have created and attached themselves to the transgender train.

"
so how do u describe yourself

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By *loria JamesTV/TS
over a year ago

Durham

I agree there is a big difference between the two and do think there should be a separate category.

However I also think there is a big difference between a tv and some hairy guy who wears his wife's panties...perhaps another category required there too.

While I acknowledge the difference between someone who has transitioned and myself, I do wish the trans community could stick together.

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By *inkyChrissy99TV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol

"Why stop at splitting tv and ts,s why not add all the other genres like fluids

Because these "fluid" genders do not exist. That's social constructs that people who are nonconforming have created and attached themselves to the transgender train.

Yes they do exist!! you have even said you have friends that identify as such!! jeese you're unbeleivable

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I have said many times in this thread i have gender issues but classify myself as a transvestite.

you then say all these types of people are non op transexuals.

Then you go on to say i am obviously not trans.......

So easy, black and white yet you just completly contradicted yourself

No, you said you were non-binary. I argued that non binary does not exist. Because... it doesnt. Again still wanting this research to back up your claim.

I'm only going with what you have told me, so are you non binary or just non op transsexual? because you are the one getting this concept misconstrued.

wherever or not your trans is for you to admit, but again you are either trans or you arent, you're not non binary because that does not exist. FACT.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Yes they do exist!! you have even said you have friends that identify as such!! jeese you're unbeleivable

First of all, since you can not spell I will also presume you can not read. So one more time I will copy and paste what I said regarding my "non binary" friends

"Now, from talking to my friends who identify themselves as non-binary, I have come to the conclusion that they are non op transsexuals, they are still sticking to the gender binary however. But do not transition due to societal marginalization, family or other reasons - but it still does not mean that they do not have a gender, or sex or are BOTH sexes.

Again, I have stated in the original post that non binary people DO NOT EXIST. Please read.

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By *inkyChrissy99TV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol

"Yes they do exist!! you have even said you have friends that identify as such!! jeese you're unbeleivable

First of all, since you can not spell I will also presume you can not read. So one more time I will copy and paste what I said regarding my "non binary" friends

Again, I have stated in the original post that non binary people DO NOT EXIST. Please read. "

That's your personal conclusion therefore that is fact now is it?

Even if they themselves identify as non binary? oh right it doesn't exist

posting the same things makes no difference we will have to agree to disagree.

I apologise if i have offended you or anybody else i just wanted to offer my views.

as i don't exist i will now be quiet.

i will not say i am a non op transexual as that's a gender identity that really doesn't exist.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

We are allowed to agree to disagree. But it does not negate from the fact that there are only two genders - male and female = FACT.

I consider myself a woman who happens to be trans, I am still using the gender binary = fact.

There has not been a living person born without hormones or chromosomes to say that they are 100% scientifically proven to be genderfluid = FACT

Transgender in general is sticking to the gender binary, and its polar opposite is "cisgender", transgender is not synonymous with non binary = FACT.

If I were a cisgender person calling myself an airplane, expecting other people to call me a airplane, and give me pronouns of an airplane then it does not mean that I can attach myself to the transgender community (which is about gender identity, which means gender binary) considering being a plane is NOT A GENDER. = fact.

Therefore, In conclusion - NON BINARY IS NOT A TRANSGENDER IDENTITY = FACT.

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By *enard ArgenteMan
over a year ago

London and France

No idea where you are going with this; as your arguments are confused;

But there are multiple versions of intersex and ambiguous sex;

For XX females there are various forms of " masculinisation", due to CAH,( additional masculine hormones in utero), and other conditions;

For XY males; some have androgen insensitivity syndrome, which means they will ( in varying degrees) have female characteristics, body shapes, and various degrees of apparent female genitalia ( up to and including full) though they are infertile.

There are several other syndromes which prevent male genitals from developing, or cause female ones to develop, as well as feminising the XY males body.( and behaviour)

There are also various chromosome faults possible on to of the usual XX and XY;

XO; XXY, XXXY, XXYY, and the XX male.

All are possible and are regularly diagnosed nowadays.

As is the "Chimera" who has mixed cells; some with XX and some with XY

All give various degrees of ambiguous gender; ( mostly usually more tendency to be " feminised males)

So there is a huge range of people with ambiguous physical gender, ( and this often results in mentally confused gender identity)

In addition to those who have gender identity issues which are not related to anything physical

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By *loria JamesTV/TS
over a year ago

Durham

Think we need Doctor Phil to sort this one out x

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

If we can't say "there are 2 genders" because of intersex people, then technically we shouldn't be able to say "humans have 2 arms" either, because polymelia means that some babies are born with 3 arms.

There are 2 genders. Humans have 2 arms. These are facts.

Also, I haven't actually heard of anyone claiming to be genderfluid because they were medically-diagnosed as intersex. Genderfluid and intersex are, in my opinion, two separate issues, and even if someone is intersex, it still wouldn't lend itself to changing back and forth between genders so frequently that gender-identifying themselves as gender fluid. Do not even bring them into this, as that is an issue of its own.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Whilst there have been studies done on intersex people, as well as transsexual people, we have found nothing on gender fluidity or agender, because it does not exist.

Gender fluidity plays on the societal construct of masculine and feminine, yet both masculine and feminine are not biological genders.

Example: a man who likes to paint his nails does not automatically make him genderfluid, it just makes him a man who likes feminine things.

So, Just because someone is born intersex does not mean that they are any less a man or woman nor does it make them an It.

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By *ayde BlanchardTV/TS
over a year ago

lancashire

TV/TS needs to be split up, this is an arguement that has happened on this website for a long time and it's about time that fabswingers caters to all of its users rather than tailor to cis men.

I could not agree more how many times a week do you get a message from some Neanderthal in a pair of knickers?

There's a theory where they come from they desire to meet true ts girls but for some reason can't. So they attempt to become and the mess you see is the result.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I can see that those in this forum that identify themselves as transsexual women/men are backing the idea of splitting up the TS/TV sections.

Though transvestites - who usually put on a costume and take it off at night, then socialise in their day to day lives as men are the ones shouting us down for having the conversation.

Talk about the patriachy. "

I would be considered a Transexual, but am one that considers Fabswingers wise in keeping the Trans community together

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

there should be a definitive difference between trans gendered people who are on or had GRS or transition drugs such as hrt drs name from a gender service or copy of Proof that they are transgender, for post op transsexuals they should be classed uner the female id as surgery would have given them the genitalia of that of a female. transvestites and crossdressers should be labelled un the CD id. lettering and fonts a different colour these are not difficult site improvements but please do not take the opportunity to seperate transsexuals from transvestites simply on the grounds that transsexuals have no penis when in actual fact only Post op transsexuals have no penis . ,

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By *enard ArgenteMan
over a year ago

London and France

"there should be a definitive difference between trans gendered people who are on or had GRS or transition drugs such as hrt drs name from a gender service or copy of Proof that they are transgender, for post op transsexuals they should be classed uner the female id as surgery would have given them the genitalia of that of a female. transvestites and crossdressers should be labelled un the CD id. lettering and fonts a different colour these are not difficult site improvements but please do not take the opportunity to seperate transsexuals from transvestites simply on the grounds that transsexuals have no penis when in actual fact only Post op transsexuals have no penis . , "

Some post op transsexuals have penises;

Their newly made ones; it's not a one way street ( though the majority of the " traffic" goes a certain way )

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I no I love ts and TV but I wish they had the 2 on this site

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By *eordie JoJoTV/TS
over a year ago

Newcastle

TV/TS needs to be split up, this is an arguement that has happened on this website for a long time and it's about time that fabswingers caters to all of its users rather than tailor to cis men.

I could not agree more how many times a week do you get a message from some Neanderthal in a pair of knickers?

There's a theory where they come from they desire to meet true ts girls but for some reason can't. So they attempt to become and the mess you see is the result. "
hahahahahaha what a theory ... and what a load parcel of shite! ... again within our "own community" ... there is a superiority that certain TS think they are better than everyone else and sit at the top of the tree! ... FYI take a good long hard look in the mirror pet ... as honestly you ain't all that ... and you look like a TV Hun apart from you have ya own hair

bless .... so sit on your perch and look down on other folk ... as one day someone is going to knock you clean off it .... I honestly really don't see the issue ... if your a post TS you complete a female profile ... I really couldn't careless whether you keep or split TV/TS ... as it would have no impact on my life whatsoever .... therefore it's irrelevant ... but the bitter TS who sucks on a lemon and the lemon goes yuk! ... well there will always be something for them to whinge about .... and honestly pet ... you can stick your theory right up your crimpa as like you it's floored

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By *ougar_n_TILFCouple
over a year ago

Burton on Trent

"We are allowed to agree to disagree. But it does not negate from the fact that there are only two genders - male and female = FACT.

I consider myself a woman who happens to be trans, I am still using the gender binary = fact.

There has not been a living person born without hormones or chromosomes to say that they are 100% scientifically proven to be genderfluid = FACT

Transgender in general is sticking to the gender binary, and its polar opposite is "cisgender", transgender is not synonymous with non binary = FACT.

Therefore, In conclusion - NON BINARY IS NOT A TRANSGENDER IDENTITY = FACT.

This is the sort of post that ends up on a Dave Gorman found poem.

What a load of tripe.

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By *ELLONS AND CREAMWoman
over a year ago

stourbridge area

I thought this was a swinging site ... personally I get tired of hearing the tvs and ts folk fighting with therir handbags ....give it a rest.... go and play somewhere else ..... its starting to smell like a charity shop in here .

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Have a friend who would love to be Ts yet has had to settle to being TV. Means they make the effort to look and act as much as they can female when dressed just wondering where they would stand in all this?

Are we saying Ts are pre op/post op only?

While we're at it and seeing it's only such a small change split TV's and CD's up. After all there's surely a big difference from the husband who likes to put on his wife's undies to the person who spends a couple of hours getting ready?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

" hahahahahaha what a theory ... and what a load parcel of shite! ... again within our "own community" ... there is a superiority that certain TS think they are better than everyone else and sit at the top of the tree! ... FYI take a good long hard look in the mirror pet ... as honestly you ain't all that ... and you look like a TV Hun apart from you have ya own hair

Was that comment directed at me? Because with all due respect, I dress 24/7 and pass as biological female out in the mainstream without any second glances. In fact, other than openly labelling myself as trans on fabswingers and my close friends I live in stealth.

So... awkward.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

No it doesn't matter if you have had surgery or not had surgery. A transsexual person is not defined by surgical procedures or by how they look... more... who they are as a person. Surgery is only a thing that is done in a means of correcting distress, however it is not nessesery.

So if your friend is ts but living as a tv, then they really aren't a tv considering they are most likely dressing for different reasons compared to someone else whom identifys themself as a tv... if you get me?

The reason why I think that the ts/tv section should be split up is due to the fact that it categorises two groups into one.

I do not dislike transvestites, just in case someone gets that misconstrued, my frustration merely comes from the fact that most TVs can take off their makeup and hair and put it into a wardrobe. With transsexuals... it's for life, no matter how we look or whatever. And it's not easy.

So when we are grouped into this, it invalidates the shit we have gone through to be ourselves, because transsexuals are not costumes or caricatures.

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By *eordie JoJoTV/TS
over a year ago

Newcastle

So... awkward."
nope that wasn't directed at you. It was directed at the person who wrote about "the theory"

Not ...awkward ..

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Oh right. I think she's beautiful, I wish I had long legs like she does. Instead I have two short stubs

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Oh right. I think she's beautiful, I wish I had long legs like she does. Instead I have two short stubs

Wash that mouth out, stubs as if!!

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By *eordie JoJoTV/TS
over a year ago

Newcastle

"Oh right. I think she's beautiful, I wish I had long legs like she does. Instead I have two short stubs

"
it's the reference to "they" (who are "They" and while yes everyone has an opinion ... what I dislike is barating TV's to make a point and then generalising everyone as hairy pantie wearing men. Have an opinion by all means but don't knock another group whilst doing so ... as the theory I only wish to be a TS but instead I'm a TV can't be further from the truth and it gets tedious that TS's feel the need to pull down TV's for some strange reason that's the point I was trying to make ....

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"No it doesn't matter if you have had surgery or not had surgery. A transsexual person is not defined by surgical procedures or by how they look... more... who they are as a person. Surgery is only a thing that is done in a means of correcting distress, however it is not nessesery.

The reason why I think that the ts/tv section should be split up is due to the fact that it categorises two groups into one.

So when we are grouped into this, it invalidates the shit we have gone through to be ourselves, because transsexuals are not costumes or caricatures. "

Get what you mean about my friend but also illustrates how hard it is and why things have probably stayed the same because how does someone who potentially has never met a TS or TV make the call whether they've selected the right box.

The present scheme is not done to take away from the daily struggle a TS goes through knowing that they are the wrong gender to what they were born in yet trying to make the people around them understand that their not a 'freak'.

There are TV's on here who wish it wasn't just a costume that hate having to wipe off the make up and put everything back in the wardrobe and then there's hpw's who wish they could be more but due to wife, family etc can't.

Did a bit of research and looked at every TS/TV profile on this thread and everyone of you had put effort in to be who you wanted to be whether that was TS or TV.

All can say is perhaps they could code in a 'warning' so that if you tick TV/TS says something like "Please remember these girls are gorgeous because they put a lot of effort into being so. If you're not prepared to put in the same amount effort then please rethink as Admin have right to change any profiles that have been categorised incorrectly"

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By *ayde BlanchardTV/TS
over a year ago

lancashire

The reason why I think that the ts/tv section should be split up is due to the fact that it categorises two groups into one.

So when we are grouped into this, it invalidates the shit we have gone through to be ourselves, because transsexuals are not costumes or caricatures.

Did a bit of research and looked at every TS/TV profile on this thread and everyone of you had put effort in to be who you wanted to be whether that was TS or TV.

Brilliantly put

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I agree. I am a transgender man and find it ridiculous that tg and tv are mixed together

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Totally agree x

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Ones birth certificate legally defines ones gender. TV/TS is not a gender but a classification found only on sex sites. I am female because my birth certificate states so and also because my body is that of a female.

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By *inkyChrissy99TV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol

The reason why I think that the ts/tv section should be split up is due to the fact that it categorises two groups into one.

So when we are grouped into this, it invalidates the shit we have gone through to be ourselves, because transsexuals are not costumes or caricatures.

Did a bit of research and looked at every TS/TV profile on this thread and everyone of you had put effort in to be who you wanted to be whether that was TS or TV.

Couldn't agree more with all you have put andbi wish admin did take more active role with certain profiles.

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By *eordie JoJoTV/TS
over a year ago

Newcastle

"Ones birth certificate legally defines ones gender. TV/TS is not a gender but a classification found only on sex sites. I am female because my birth certificate states so and also because my body is that of a female."
WTF you chuntting on about .... TV/TS classification can only be found on sex sites ... hahaha are you having a laugh?! ... my my ... isn't one a silly twat!! ... as for birth certificate ... hahahaha in fact know what ... it's too early and obviously one is as thick as fuk .... heffer... errm I mean Heather

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By *ayde BlanchardTV/TS
over a year ago

lancashire

Post op Hun that's got a grc so that's what she is hinting at. she presumes others don't and presumes wrong.

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By *eordie JoJoTV/TS
over a year ago

Newcastle

"Post op Hun that's got a grc so that's what she is hinting at. she presumes others don't and presumes wrong. "
ignorance is bliss Jade .... but at 53 I would have thought she might be a bit more educated ... but guess not ... too many glasses of sherry me thinks

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By *ayde BlanchardTV/TS
over a year ago

lancashire

Possibly Hun but the lack of any photos and any verification tells its own story.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I was tempted to take up admins offer of a female profile a while back but, I don't fulfil the criteria so turned it down.

I don't really care that it says tv/ts on my profile. I'm me and proud to be. If someone likes me for who I am with any luck they'll read my profile and know enough to start a conversation without offending me. Sensitive little soul that I am

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Also make CD option x

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By *inkyChrissy99TV/TS
over a year ago

Bristol

"I was tempted to take up admins offer of a female profile a while back but, I don't fulfil the criteria so turned it down.

Hehe thats awesome you are so proud of what you are but I do often wonder why post of tvs don't just say they are female an be done with it..... Its what they are striving for surely.

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By *ayde BlanchardTV/TS
over a year ago

lancashire

"I was tempted to take up admins offer of a female profile a while back but, I don't fulfil the criteria so turned it down.

Hehe thats awesome you are so proud of what you are but I do often wonder why post of tvs don't just say they are female an be done with it..... Its what they are striving for surely."

Absolutely agree and possibly has all the same attributes as most of the females appear to be the size of Worcestershire.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I was tempted to take up admins offer of a female profile a while back but, I don't fulfil the criteria so turned it down.

Hehe thats awesome you are so proud of what you are but I do often wonder why post of tvs don't just say they are female an be done with it..... Its what they are striving for surely."

I'm not a tv. I'm not post op either.

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By *tace 309TV/TS
over a year ago

durham

Im a TV but I feel all woman I am what I am. take it or leave it.Ive never wanted to go for the full change but I have many female mannerisms .I know I look a woman.I accept being part of a TV/ TS category so why is there a need to break it down any further.when you look at the LBGT scene in general the T stands for transgender and as far as I am concerned that covers both TS and TV .and before any TS gets on my back you can always state the facts to anyone who messages you its that simple.we are all on this site as swingers no matter who or what you are.why dissect the profiles any more.I'm more than happy to go down as TV/TS on here

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By *ayde BlanchardTV/TS
over a year ago

lancashire

Well said and all respect to you

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I'm me. I identify as transgender.

I'm on hormones. I have the support of my wife and family.

I don't get off on dressing I just dress appropriately to my situation. If I'm seducing I wear provocative clothing. Mostly I just wear beautiful things.

I'm dedicating more and more of my time to supporting others to find the courage to step out and be themselves sane as I have.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Same. I make no claim to being sane

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley

"Possibly Hun but the lack of any photos and any verification tells its own story."

Couldn't agree more

The story its tellin' is that she can't whip the wig orf, pop the falsies out, untuck the penis, scrape off the half a centimetre of polyfiller (sorry, makeup), wait a couple of hours for the 5 o'clock shadow to reappear and return to 'bloke-mode' again

0-100 (or 0-62) from Betty to Bob the Builder in under a minute

shame on you 'girls'; even a Trabant is faster

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By *ayde BlanchardTV/TS
over a year ago

lancashire

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. I just think it's funny that you think yours really matters.

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley

"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. I just think it's funny that you think yours really matters."

Ofcourse mine doesn't any more than anyone else's does. I was just telling the story you were about to tell. Was I right?

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By *eordie JoJoTV/TS
over a year ago

Newcastle

"Possibly Hun but the lack of any photos and any verification tells its own story.

Couldn't agree more

0-100 (or 0-62) from Betty to Bob the Builder in under a minute

shame on you 'girls'; even a Trabant is faster

"
.

Semi right ... I don't "untuck" my penis as let it hang loose and it would take sum tucking

... I'm not a drag queen or coco the clown ... so no trowel used here

....

but when your 6ft 3 with 34 inch legs and size 6-8 dress size ... with the body stats of a supermodel and sexual skill set of a porn star

.... bitches are always going to hate!

.. anyways I'm away for a shave

toodles x x

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley

"Possibly Hun but the lack of any photos and any verification tells its own story.

Couldn't agree more

0-100 (or 0-62) from Betty to Bob the Builder in under a minute

shame on you 'girls'; even a Trabant is faster

Semi right ... I don't "untuck" my penis as let it hang loose and it would take sum tucking

... I'm not a drag queen or coco the clown ... so no trowel used here

....

but when your 6ft 3 with 34 inch legs and size 6-8 dress size ... with the body stats of a supermodel and sexual skill set of a porn star

.... bitches are always going to hate!

.. anyways I'm away for a shave

toodles x x "

Good for you; ta ta

I am away for a shave too

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By *ayde BlanchardTV/TS
over a year ago

lancashire

"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. I just think it's funny that you think yours really matters.

Ofcourse mine doesn't any more than anyone else's does. I was just telling the story you were about to tell. Was I right?

Wrong A tiger doesn't lose sleep over the opinion of a sheep.

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By *osieWoman
over a year ago

Wembley

"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. I just think it's funny that you think yours really matters.

Ofcourse mine doesn't any more than anyone else's does. I was just telling the story you were about to tell. Was I right?

Wrong A tiger doesn't lose sleep over the opinion of a sheep."

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By *ayde BlanchardTV/TS
over a year ago

lancashire

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

We contributed to this thread what now seems ages ago, it's proven to be a genuine eye-opener to the varied opinions - as well as some possible naive attitudes - on this subject.

But it's also shown recently that maybe Admin should introduce an extension to the removal of input to this site from a user that leaves . . maybe that should include ALL comments that the ex-user leaves in forum threads?

It'll help reduce the flaming.

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