FabSwingers.com forum: Academic Study Relating to Adult Venues

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

I've often been intrigued as to why swingers clubs continue to cling to the practice of charging single men ridiculous entry fees, while offering free entry to single women and heavy discounts to couples.

Recently, I came across an article in the journal of the Law School of the University of Nevada, Las Vegas, which discusses the manner in which this practice of gender-based pricing both relies upon and reinforces archaic and harmful gender stereotypes.

It's a fairly heavy read, but an interesting one.

Shana S. Brouwers, "A GUY WALKS INTO A BAR: GENDER DISCRIMINATORY PRICING AND ADMISSION POLICIES IN LAS VEGAS ESTABLISHMENTS"

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Is Las Vegas the new Sydney?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

The new Sydney?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ty31Man
over a year ago

NW London

Quite simply fewer women than men attend swinger clubs or are (generalising here) actively looking for promiscuity or sex outside of relationships so clubs have to offer a discounted rate to attract females or keep their regular custom. Supply n demand.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ndykinkyMan
over a year ago

STOKE-ON-TRENT

See the Law of Supply and Demand

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

The 'supply and demand' arguement is precisely the one that the article takes issue with.

According to the author, the disparity in pricing relies on the dual stereotype that:

a) most single men are sex-mad and lascivious, and that it is possible for those purely seeking an easy lay to be 'priced out of the market.'

b) most women are only interested in 'traditional' sexual practices, and participate in club activities only because of enticements such as free entry.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *yrdwomanWoman
over a year ago

Putting the 'cum' in Eboracum

The reasons for disparate charging in the US is probably the same as the reasons here - clubs need more women, therefore attracts them by lowering the admission fee.

By the way, as a woman, I might have a different opinion than a bloke, but my opinion is that it actually empowers me to attend a club where I can have NSA sex without being judged. If an article disagrees that's just fine.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *yrdwomanWoman
over a year ago

Putting the 'cum' in Eboracum

"b) most women are only interested in 'traditional' sexual practices, and participate in club activities only because of enticements such as free entry."

Define 'most women'.

I think the study is inherently flawed. Different conclusions can be extrapolated from the women interviewed.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"clubs need more women, therefore attracts them by lowering the admission fee"

That's one of the reasons why the author of the article (a woman) objects to the disparate pricing; because it turns women into 'free advertising' for the venue.

The article doesn't judge women for attending clubs, nor does it suggest that women shouldn't have the right to express their sexuality without being judged.

The objection being raised is that, by offering women incentives such as free entry, the clubs reinforce the idea that women have to be 'enticed' to engage in alternative sexual practices.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *yrdwomanWoman
over a year ago

Putting the 'cum' in Eboracum

"The objection being raised is that, by offering women incentives such as free entry, the clubs reinforce the idea that women have to be 'enticed' to engage in alternative sexual practices."

Her objection, I suspect.

maybe some women are encouraged to attend because of the reduced price. However there are many woman and couples who pay full attendance, if not sometimes more, at certain clubs. I wonder what their motivation is supposed to be.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ir1967Man
over a year ago

in da sticks, london, amsterdam, madrid

""clubs need more women, therefore attracts them by lowering the admission fee"

That's one of the reasons why the author of the article (a woman) objects to the disparate pricing; because it turns women into 'free advertising' for the venue.

The article doesn't judge women for attending clubs, nor does it suggest that women shouldn't have the right to express their sexuality without being judged.

The objection being raised is that, by offering women incentives such as free entry, the clubs reinforce the idea that women have to be 'enticed' to engage in alternative sexual practices."

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Also, I wasn't saying that I endorse those two stereotypes; they are simply the stereotypes that the author of the article sees the clubs as reinforcing through a disparate pricing structure.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *yrdwomanWoman
over a year ago

Putting the 'cum' in Eboracum

"Also, I wasn't saying that I endorse those two stereotypes; they are simply the stereotypes that the author of the article sees the clubs as reinforcing through a disparate pricing structure."

She's failed to take into account many other positions then.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *atEvolutionCouple
over a year ago

atlantisEVOLUTION Swingers Club. Stoke.

Most academics haven't lived in the real world since starting school aged 5. Pinch salt and take being three words you should add to every other sentence of their research.

Most of us should have died ten years ago from drinking red wine that other academics say is the best thing ever for your heart.

Turns out that saturated fats aren't that bad for you after all even though most governments have banned them from produce by 2017.

Vaping is bad for you - except it isn't.

^^^^^ Now there's the real disparity ^^^^^ EXPERTS!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *atEvolutionCouple
over a year ago

atlantisEVOLUTION Swingers Club. Stoke.

Offer anyone a lower pricing structure than others and common sense would dictate that they would take advantage of it. Male Female Cat Dog or Penguin.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *icplshropsCouple
over a year ago

Rock

Afraid this is a fact of life in all areas. Look how women pay more to have their haircut, even if their hair is shorter than men''s. Or dry cleaning: woman's blouse is more expensive to clean than a man's, although some may argue it may be due to the delicate material, though not always!!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Will have to see if I can track down the paper

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I wrote something far more brief but similar in intent with regards to swingers clubs on my FL profile some years ago.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ecretlyASoftieWoman
over a year ago

Hull but travel regularly

I'm sure when we get equal pay we'll be able to afford to pay the same. Until then...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Will have to see if I can track down the paper"

Just google the title...I included it in the OP

It's downloadable as a PDF

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I would be more interested in a study along the lines of social cohesion within the swinging world - the story of male dynamics in a female empowered circle, maybe title it I brought my balls, who will play with me

Any intellectuals interested in collaborating?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

Does the article talk about couples and single females paying a premium for nights with no single guys?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *uzy444Woman
over a year ago

in the suffolk countryside

"I would be more interested in a study along the lines of social cohesion within the swinging world - the story of male dynamics in a female empowered circle, maybe title it I brought my balls, who will play with me

Any intellectuals interested in collaborating?"

a female empowered circle..like being accused of needing enticing,os that a back hand compliment? being available to anyone that asks, or, follows us around, not being fit to date and not being marriage material...

guys dont want to have relationships, they want NSA sex, variety, they more often than not dont turn up and they have a lot on their terms. so do couples..

female empowerment circle..my ass

my opinion at times...just adding my two pennyworth... reality is only perception x

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Nobody is accusing women of needing to be enticed to attend clubs.

The argument being made is that the practice of offering financial inducements and other benefits exclusively to women reinforces the myth that they require to be bribed to participate in sexual activity.

It's like the practice of 'Ladies' Nights' in bars. Technically, these are illegal under the 2010 Equality Act, but the law is not enforced with any regularity.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Does the article talk about couples and single females paying a premium for nights with no single guys? "

Exactly the question I was going to ask. It appears that there are only 2 stereotypes in American gender bias charging structures

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I've often been intrigued as to why swingers clubs continue to cling to the practice of charging single men ridiculous entry fees, while offering free entry to single women and heavy discounts to couples.

It's a fairly heavy read, but an interesting one.

Shana S. Brouwers, "A GUY WALKS INTO A BAR: GENDER DISCRIMINATORY PRICING AND ADMISSION POLICIES IN LAS VEGAS ESTABLISHMENTS""

Because couples won't go if it's expensive ( clubs would need to be much better quality to justify the single male price for everyone)

Theyre are enough desperate male members of the zombie wanking crowd who will pay the high fees that make it a viable business.

Women attract men, men bring in the money.

To be brutally honest does any man here think him being at a club would entice women to come?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Nobody is accusing women of needing to be enticed to attend clubs.

It's like the practice of 'Ladies' Nights' in bars. Technically, these are illegal under the 2010 Equality Act, but the law is not enforced with any regularity."

Interesting as it may be, I'm wondering what your point is? Are you hoping that all the women reading it will be so incensed at being shoehorned into what would appear to be traditional gender stereotypes rather than the empowered liberated beings they imagine themselves to be, rise up and start a revolution and therefore force the clubs to review their pricing structure so you can save a fiver and get a fuck?

In the end, academics write shit loads of guff day in and day out. I imagine her sample group to be relatively small and therefore pretty unrepresentative and would be interested to see what she's done to address any underlying unconscious bias that may be playing a part in her drawing conclusions. Perhaps in the end, all she's really got to say is that we're not so far along the liberation journey as we like to think we are. Some areas of the US continue to be in the dark ages where women gender roles are concerned, they're still fighting for paid maternity leave...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Are you hoping that all the women reading it will be so incensed at being shoehorned into what would appear to be traditional gender stereotypes rather than the empowered liberated beings they imagine themselves to be, rise up and start a revolution and therefore force the clubs to review their pricing structure so you can save a fiver and get a fuck?"

No.

1. I thought the paper was interesting, so I thought I'd post a 'heads up.'

2. I rather think it's a good idea to avoid business practices that traditional gender stereotypes.

3. Why the assumption that I'm just looking to 'save a fiver and get a fuck'?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *teveanddebsCouple
over a year ago

Norwich

I think all those that argue about club pricing should stump up open their own place.

You could make a small fortune running a gender equal pricing club.

As long as you start with a large one.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

""Are you hoping that all the women reading it will be so incensed at being shoehorned into what would appear to be traditional gender stereotypes rather than the empowered liberated beings they imagine themselves to be, rise up and start a revolution and therefore force the clubs to review their pricing structure so you can save a fiver and get a fuck?"

No.

1. I thought the paper was interesting, so I thought I'd post a 'heads up.'

2. I rather think it's a good idea to avoid business practices that traditional gender stereotypes.

3. Why the assumption that I'm just looking to 'save a fiver and get a fuck'?

Because that's the usual angle with any of these 'unfair pricing discriminates against single men' threads...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Same applies to some dating sites and also nightclubs too.

Where ever there are Women the men will flock and pay to join etc.

Owners of dating sites, night clubs and swingers clubs know this so will often discount women's entrance fees or give them free entry or membership as they know by doing that its in their best interests as a business as where ever there are women the men will follow.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ndykinkyMan
over a year ago

STOKE-ON-TRENT

"I think all those that argue about club pricing should stump up open their own place.

You could make a small fortune running a gender equal pricing club.

As long as you start with a large one."

Go ahead and try it then

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

How about getting rid of the words "slag, slut and whore" and similar attitudes, and maybe more women will be happy to experiment with a range of partners without society looking down on them, and then more will want to go to clubs?

Men tend to get a pat on the back for having sex with lots of different people and become more desirable. Women tend to become less desirable (according to society stereotypes).

And to whoever complained about "experts", as far as academia goes, how about reading published papers correctly? They aren't stating absolute fact, they are discussing a "best guess hypothesis" based on the available evidence.

Others also collect evidence and test it. Science and research aren't static. Once you know our knowledge is constantly evolving.

Anyone in research knows to look at what journal the paper is published in, and the author and their affiliated institution before reading to assess the strength of the study. Oh, and the year it was published. And then they read other papers on the same topic, and get a well rounded view of our best knowledge so far.

You can't cherry pick one reticle and say the experts are saying its gospel, and then say experts are rubbish when a conflicting article comes out. *sigh*

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

""Because that's the usual angle with any of these 'unfair pricing discriminates against single men' threads..."

Thereby proving the point of the article.

Disparate pricing is discriminatory, whether you like it or not.

Aside from issues of gender stereotyping, the practice also limits single male participation in swinging to those in possession of significant disposable income.

For instance, one club I know of charges single men £50 for membership, and an entry fee of £25, and allows male non-members to enter at £50 per visit.

As such, just two visits to that particular club, either as a member or a guest, costs a single male £100.

The inbuilt assumption is that guys who are after a quick shag won't be willing to pay that kind of money.

However, while it might dissuade a lot of the 'playboy' types, an extortionate entry fee means that those guys who are 'just after sex,' and are capable of paying up, now feel even more entitled to get laid in order to 'justify their expenditure.'

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Same applies to some dating sites and also nightclubs too.

Where ever there are Women the men will flock and pay to join etc.

That's precisely what the author of the article was taking issue with: the manner in which women are turned into free advertising for these clubs.

They aren't given these discounts because the clubs are interested in enabling them to explore their sexuality; they're given these discounts because the clubs want to use them as bait for (supposedly) desperate, single, straight men.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"How about getting rid of the words "slag, slut and whore" and similar attitudes, and maybe more women will be happy to experiment with a range of partners without society looking down on them, and then more will want to go to clubs"

Couldn't agree more.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *piritsonfabCouple
over a year ago

Nottingham

I'm guessing that if clubs had equal pricing for all...the wouldn't put the male prices down, they'd increase the price for couples and ladies.... Maybe that would cause them to have a much lower number or participants?

Thereby losing money?

If instead they lowered the price for males, they'd be inundated and would have to restrict the numbers.... Thereby losing money?

Seems a difficult one for them.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Strange that a lot of popular clubs listed on this site have equivalent pricing structures. (Say, £15 for singles, £25 for couples.)

They don't seem to have lost business by adopting this model.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

"Does the article talk about couples and single females paying a premium for nights with no single guys?

Exactly the question I was going to ask. It appears that there are only 2 stereotypes in American gender bias charging structures"

OP how does this fit in with your pricing structure then?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Same applies to some dating sites and also nightclubs too.

Where ever there are Women the men will flock and pay to join etc.

That's precisely what the author of the article was taking issue with: the manner in which women are turned into free advertising for these clubs.

I'm still confused then as to what your point is on the discrimination? Are they discriminating against the women or the men? You seem to be making precise points using 2 contrasting examples...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

As far as I could tell, the article was deal ping only with events where guys - single or otherwise - paid a premium for attendance.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

The article doesn't really talk about the pricing structure being discriminatory (although charging men and women different prices for an identical service is illegal in both British Law and US Federal Law.)

The point is that the pricing structure is discriminatory in a number of different ways.

It discriminates against men and women in equal measure by reinforcing harmful stereotypes about sexuality.

It encourages heterosexual men to feel entitled to sex by promising them access to a large number of single women in return for payment of an extortionate price.

It creates an image of swinging as a pastime which can only be enjoyed by men who possess large amounts of disposable income.

It treats women as a commodity for the business by turning them into free advertising, and using them purely as bait to increase the size of the heterosexual male patronage.

It denies the legitimacy of women's sexuality by implying that they require to be plied with various perks in order to participate in the swinging scene.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *andyMooCouple
over a year ago

bedford

This subject keeps coming up.

A club has the right to discount entrance for under represented groups ie single women and couples.

It's not discriminating it's just preventing clubs from becoming sausage fests to put it crudely

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ndykinkyMan
over a year ago

STOKE-ON-TRENT

"The article doesn't really talk about the pricing structure being discriminatory (although charging men and women different prices for an identical service is illegal in both British Law and US Federal Law.)

The point is that the pricing structure is discriminatory in a number of different ways.

It discriminates against men and women in equal measure by reinforcing harmful stereotypes about sexuality.

It encourages heterosexual men to feel entitled to sex by promising them access to a large number of single women in return for payment of an extortionate price.

It creates an image of swinging as a pastime which can only be enjoyed by men who possess large amounts of disposable income.

It treats women as a commodity for the business by turning them into free advertising, and using them purely as bait to increase the size of the heterosexual male patronage.

It denies the legitimacy of women's sexuality by implying that they require to be plied with various perks in order to participate in the swinging scene."

Private members clubs can apply the pricing structures they want, it is not illegal.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *yrdwomanWoman
over a year ago

Putting the 'cum' in Eboracum

"It denies the legitimacy of women's sexuality by implying that they require to be plied with various perks in order to participate in the swinging scene."

The main problem I'm having with this article is that particular assumption.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

The article is merely observing the existence of that assumption; it's the disparate pricing structure that reinforces it and relies upon it.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"This subject keeps coming up.

A club has the right to discount entrance for under represented groups ie single women and couples.

It's not discriminating it's just preventing clubs from becoming sausage fests to put it crudely

And in doing so, they encourage the few men who do get in to the venue to feel even more entitled to receive sexual gratification.

The men who have sufficient financial capital feel that, because they've such a disproportionately high price for entry, they deserve to get more action in order to 'justify' their investment.

Conversely, men who can't afford the extortionate prices charged by the clubs feel that their value as swingers is being judged, not by their commitment to the scene, but by the size of their wage packet.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *yrdwomanWoman
over a year ago

Putting the 'cum' in Eboracum

"The article is merely observing the existence of that assumption; it's the disparate pricing structure that reinforces it and relies upon it. "

No, the pricing structure is merely good business. As was mentioned above, if you reduce single male prices you get a disproportionate amount of single males, the single females and couples stop coming, so the single males stop coming. If you increase the prices for single females and couples they stop coming, so the single males stop coming.

Of course there is an element of 'bait', but as I use the fact I am a single female on here to snag as many shags from guys as I can, I fail to see what the problem is.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

As I said, strange that so many popular clubs on here are still successful in spite of charging the same price for singles entry regardless of gender.

Also, why the assumption that women would be unwilling to pay a reasonable price for entry to a club, rather than being treated like free advertising?

I thought we lived in an age where businesses were supposed to treat men and women equally, rather than play them off against each other.

This is why I only go to clubs like my local venue, which has switched over to a system of charging £15 to both male and female singles, with a £25 couples price.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 21/05/16 17:50:44]

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

"The article is merely observing the existence of that assumption; it's the disparate pricing structure that reinforces it and relies upon it.

Of course there is an element of 'bait', but as I use the fact I am a single female on here to snag as many shags from guys as I can, I fail to see what the problem is."

exactly this. Sometimes single men actually scare people away. That's why people pay a premium to not even have them on the premises!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's a fairly heavy read, but an interesting one.

Shana S. Brouwers, "A GUY WALKS INTO A BAR: GENDER DISCRIMINATORY PRICING AND ADMISSION POLICIES IN LAS VEGAS ESTABLISHMENTS""

I;m not sure that a study of Las Vegas bars is relevant to UK swinging clubs?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Sometimes single men actually scare people away. That's why people pay a premium to not even have them on the premises!"

And thus, the clubs that engage in disparate pricing perpetuate the stereotype that single men are all predatory horndogs.

Do you not think that men who are desperate for sex are quite happy to pay premium prices? Hitting their wallets isn't going to put them off.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The reason clubs charge more for single guys is really simple. They know the guys will pay it. It really is that simple.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

It's a fairly heavy read, but an interesting one.

Shana S. Brouwers, "A GUY WALKS INTO A BAR: GENDER DISCRIMINATORY PRICING AND ADMISSION POLICIES IN LAS VEGAS ESTABLISHMENTS"

I;m not sure that a study of Las Vegas bars is relevant to UK swinging clubs?"

The study was conducted in Vegas, but many UK swingers clubs employ precisely the same unethical business practices, so a legitimate parallel can be drawn.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

If the question is really about is it right or not to charge single men more then that's when supply and demand walk in. Bottom line is this, it costs what it costs. If you don't like it then you are better off staying home and watching the telly....

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Sometimes single men actually scare people away. That's why people pay a premium to not even have them on the premises!"

Shouldn't we be doing more to quash the stereotype that single men are sexual predators, rather than engaging in unethical business practices that encourage men to feel entitled to receive sexual gratification?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 21/05/16 18:28:01]

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

""Sometimes single men actually scare people away. That's why people pay a premium to not even have them on the premises!"

How on earth do you get to men being treated as a sexual predators because they pay more to go somewhere.. The term, over analysis is at play here

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"If the question is really about is it right or not to charge single men more then that's when supply and demand walk in. Bottom line is this, it costs what it costs. If you don't like it then you are better off staying home and watching the telly...."

Hence why I only attend clubs that treat all their patrons as equally 'good for business.' Sure, the club might not be as flashy, but at least everyone in attendance is being treated as a valued member, rather than shoehorned into a 'predator/prey' dynamic.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

That I respect you for standing by your principles but suggest that you are missing out on life because of them

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

What something costs doesn't denote the personality of the person that pays it. Stereotypes are nothing more than opinions forced on a person by society. The lifestyle we lead sticks two fingers up to society so why the hell would we care about steretypes. Life is about living so live it....

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

""How on earth do you get to men being treated as a sexual predators because they pay more to go somewhere.. The term, over analysis is at play here"

I don't: the woman who wrote the article did.

Simple really: the venue assumes that if they encourage more women to attend, more men will be encouraged to pay the premium price to gain access to said women.

That is a 'predator/prey' dynamic at work. You're using women as 'bait' to attract male custom.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"What something costs doesn't denote the personality of the person that pays it. Stereotypes are nothing more than opinions forced on a person by society. The lifestyle we lead sticks two fingers up to society so why the hell would we care about steretypes. Life is about living so live it...."

I agree that our lifestyle 'sticks two fingers up to society.' That doesn't mean that aspects of our lifestyle are immune from criticism.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I know of a club that charges the same for couples and single men. And you get nice guys and predators there... This goes towards proving the fact that personality is individually defined and how much the pay to attend has nothing to do with it... mate you really nees to stop worrying about it and just live

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I agree that our lifestyle 'sticks two fingers up to society.' That doesn't mean that aspects of our lifestyle are immune from criticism."

I didn't say we are immune from anything. I'm saying it doesn't matter.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"That I respect you for standing by your principles but suggest that you are missing out on life because of them"

No, I'm missing out because most clubs don't seem to get the fact that a lot of committed swingers CANT AFFORD to pay £75 to attend their f***ing elitist venue.

At least my local club lets me in for £15. It may not be flashy, but I can go there five times as often for the same price, and I'm treated as being equally welcome as the female patrons.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"I know of a club that charges the same for couples and single men. And you get nice guys and predators there... This goes towards proving the fact that personality is individually defined and how much the pay to attend has nothing to do with it... mate you really nees to stop worrying about it and just live"

Precisely: that proves that a disparate pricing structure does NOTHING to deter predators, which is the reason given for justifying it's implementation.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ethnmelvCouple
over a year ago

Chudleigh

"The article is merely observing the existence of that assumption; it's the disparate pricing structure that reinforces it and relies upon it.

Of course there is an element of 'bait', but as I use the fact I am a single female on here to snag as many shags from guys as I can, I fail to see what the problem is."

The wisest of words as usual

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Precisely: that proves that a disparate pricing structure does NOTHING to deter predators, which is the reason given for justifying it's implementation."

As I have stated, the reason sigle men are charged more is because they will pay it. Nothing more nothing less. Any other excuse is nothing more than a smoke screen. I've been attending clubs of 16 years and I promise you that this is fact.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

"That I respect you for standing by your principles but suggest that you are missing out on life because of them

No, I'm missing out because most clubs don't seem to get the fact that a lot of committed swingers CANT AFFORD to pay £75 to attend their f***ing elitist venue.

At least my local club lets me in for £15. It may not be flashy, but I can go there five times as often for the same price, and I'm treated as being equally welcome as the female patrons."

So you would rather go to a run down, cheap club, because you can try to get your leg over 5 times more than you can in a nicer, flashier club?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"So you would rather go to a run down, cheap club, because you can try to get your leg over 5 times more than you can in a nicer, flashier club? "

No, I go because the people running it don't do what you just did, and assume that I'm so desperate for a shag that I'm willing to hand over £75 of my hard-earned cash.

Like I said, I'd rather be in a venue where men and women are treated EQUALLY, rather than the women being used as bait and free advertising and the men as cash cows.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

"So you would rather go to a run down, cheap club, because you can try to get your leg over 5 times more than you can in a nicer, flashier club?

No, I go because the people running it don't do what you just did, and assume that I'm so desperate for a shag that I'm willing to hand over £75 of my hard-earned cash.

Like I said, I'd rather be in a venue where men and women are treated EQUALLY, rather than the women being used as bait and free advertising and the men as cash cows."

It sounds like you are more interested in the £ to pussy ratio, than the male to female ratio.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So you would rather go to a run down, cheap club, because you can try to get your leg over 5 times more than you can in a nicer, flashier club?

No, I go because the people running it don't do what you just did, and assume that I'm so desperate for a shag that I'm willing to hand over £75 of my hard-earned cash.

Like I said, I'd rather be in a venue where men and women are treated EQUALLY, rather than the women being used as bait and free advertising and the men as cash cows."

Can you tell me what clubs actually charge £75 for single guy entry for one night ?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"So you would rather go to a run down, cheap club, because you can try to get your leg over 5 times more than you can in a nicer, flashier club?

No, I go because the people running it don't do what you just did, and assume that I'm so desperate for a shag that I'm willing to hand over £75 of my hard-earned cash.

Like I said, I'd rather be in a venue where men and women are treated EQUALLY, rather than the women being used as bait and free advertising and the men as cash cows.

Can you tell me what clubs actually charge £75 for single guy entry for one night ?"

They don't - they charge £50 for membership for six months, or £75 for a year. Then you still have to pay a £25 entry fee.

However, that means I'm £100/£125 out of pocket after just two visits, whereas my local club allows me to visit six to eight times for that price.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *eavenscentitCouple
over a year ago

barnstaple

I'm not paying to get shagged, I am not a man....lol

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

There is more to life than money. To be honest you sound a little tight....

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"There is more to life than money. To be honest you sound a little tight.... "

I'm not tight - I'm a f***ing student. It's called having to live on a f***ing BUDGET.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"So you would rather go to a run down, cheap club, because you can try to get your leg over 5 times more than you can in a nicer, flashier club?

No, I go because the people running it don't do what you just did, and assume that I'm so desperate for a shag that I'm willing to hand over £75 of my hard-earned cash.

Like I said, I'd rather be in a venue where men and women are treated EQUALLY, rather than the women being used as bait and free advertising and the men as cash cows.

Can you tell me what clubs actually charge £75 for single guy entry for one night ?"

So if you got annual membership and attended twice a month its actually £28.13 a visit that's a bit different to £75 I appreciate that's that depends on regular attendance but I would think if you wanted to become a member of a private members club you would want to attend fairly regularly. What price does this club charge for single females or couples ?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There is more to life than money. To be honest you sound a little tight....

I'm not tight - I'm a f***ing student. It's called having to live on a f***ing BUDGET."

Resorting to swearing really isn't helping matters. And to be honest being a student is a choice. Maybe you should stop moaning about it and go to the more expensive clubs when you get a job and can afford them...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's quite amazing how this thread started and where it has ended up. It was all about having to cough up a few quid and nothing to do with some paper based in vegas....

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

We've payed from £20 to £100 to get into clubs on different nights and in different areas it's called the free market I believe. We have to choice to attend or not

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"We've payed from £20 to £100 to get into clubs on different nights and in different areas it's called the free market I believe. We have to choice to attend or not "

Exactly

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

OP imagine if the clubs had a changed of pricing policy. Your usual club remains £15 for single men, but they put the price up to £50 for single women and £60 for couples. The other club also changes their policy so its the £75 for single males and £75 for single women and £100 for couples.

Which club would you attend?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"OP imagine if the clubs had a changed of pricing policy. Your usual club remains £15 for single men, but they put the price up to £50 for single women and £60 for couples. The other club also changes their policy so its the £75 for single males and £75 for single women and £100 for couples.

Which club would you attend?"

The cogs will be clanging over this lol

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

All business is based on exploitation, it needs to be to make any money. If businesses need to encourage females to go by lowering prices and they can make a profit by doing that then they will do just that. If a business can make a profit by charging equally it will do just that. If it can profit by charging men less then women it will do that.

There are so many variables involved in what will attract customers to a particular club that i don't believe anyone could generalise on why they do that. But it is mainly/primarily to make a profit.

I don't think the pricing structure reinforces anything about men or women apart from men are more likely to pay more for sexual activities than women will. Because the people who use these services regularly are the ones who reinforce the particular values involved, and all we've really seen is that men will pay more to go to a club.

Women can get sex easier than men, this is a given and is possibly because men tend to be more predatory and do the chasing.

A lot of men expect sex at these clubs, some do not, but i'd likely think most expect that because swinging clubs offer sex and it seems to be their main selling point. Having a good time overall will be a close second, so the customers using clubs and the staff running it and the way they run it will be important.

Women are not used at clubs. If it's to attract men so that they will pay then they're only being used as lures and it's not a given that any woman will fuck any man in these establishments, they are not prostitutes and anyone in the know would know this.

If people are thinking that women are lesser sexual beings because they pay less and are used as lures then it's not the pricings fault. It is the fault of people comparing swingers, and promiscuous people, to free prostitutes.

There is equal pricing on this site and many men think women are free prostitutes on here and we should fuck them or at least acknowledge them. This is because patriarchy has told them men are more important than women, that women who enjoy sex are sluts not worthy of marrying or even dating but should fuck anyone interested in them.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There is more to life than money. To be honest you sound a little tight....

I'm not tight - I'm a f***ing student. It's called having to live on a f***ing BUDGET."

So you can't afford to go. That's not sexist.

Maybe look for free socials, you look like you're into fetish so try out fetish munches, things like that.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Which club would you attend?"

It would be an interesting experiment if my usual club did that...I'd stop attending though, because they'd be engaging in precisely the kind of discrimination that I'm objecting to.

If they did as you suggest, I'd attend the second one, as and when I can afford it. The £75 refers only to the first visit though - male members pay £25 thereafter for the duration of their memberships.)

I don't care how much I'm being asked to pay. What I'm complaining about is the situation where the price I pay is dictated by whether or not I possess a penis.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"There is more to life than money. To be honest you sound a little tight....

I'm not tight - I'm a f***ing student. It's called having to live on a f***ing BUDGET.

So you can't afford to go. That's not sexist.

Maybe look for free socials, you look like you're into fetish so try out fetish munches, things like that."

I never said that my not being able to afford to go was sexist. I'm saying that it's sexist to charge someone a premium price because of the configuration of their genitals.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

Which club would you attend?

It would be an interesting experiment if my usual club did that...I'd stop attending though, because they'd be engaging in precisely the kind of discrimination that I'm objecting to.

I don't care how much I'm being asked to pay. What I'm complaining about is the situation where the price I pay is dictated by whether or not I possess a penis."

I wonder how many people believe you!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"There is more to life than money. To be honest you sound a little tight....

I'm not tight - I'm a f***ing student. It's called having to live on a f***ing BUDGET.

So you can't afford to go. That's not sexist.

Maybe look for free socials, you look like you're into fetish so try out fetish munches, things like that."

I was also saying that premium pricing is discriminatory AMONGST single men because it limits participation in the club scene to those men who possess large amounts of disposable income, thereby encouraging an attitude of sexual entitlement in the minds of those men who can afford to pay.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Which club would you attend?

It would be an interesting experiment if my usual club did that...I'd stop attending though, because they'd be engaging in precisely the kind of discrimination that I'm objecting to.

I don't care how much I'm being asked to pay. What I'm complaining about is the situation where the price I pay is dictated by whether or not I possess a penis.

I wonder how many people believe you!"

But you stated you are on a budget therefore you do care how much it costs

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Which club would you attend?

It would be an interesting experiment if my usual club did that...I'd stop attending though, because they'd be engaging in precisely the kind of discrimination that I'm objecting to.

I don't care how much I'm being asked to pay. What I'm complaining about is the situation where the price I pay is dictated by whether or not I possess a penis.

I wonder how many people believe you!"

Ok, so you think I'm a liar. Fair enough.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There is more to life than money. To be honest you sound a little tight....

I'm not tight - I'm a f***ing student. It's called having to live on a f***ing BUDGET.

So you can't afford to go. That's not sexist.

Maybe look for free socials, you look like you're into fetish so try out fetish munches, things like that.

So youve got a chip the size of Dover because your male. Have you considered transfender

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *eavenscentitCouple
over a year ago

barnstaple

"There is more to life than money. To be honest you sound a little tight....

I'm not tight - I'm a f***ing student. It's called having to live on a f***ing BUDGET.

So you can't afford to go. That's not sexist.

Maybe look for free socials, you look like you're into fetish so try out fetish munches, things like that.

Some will always think they are entitled

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I think you've got the answer, vote with your feet attend the club you attend now and don't attend the one you have been moaning about. One questioned the club that charges you £15 entry is that the price for single ladies and £30 for couples I take it as I suppose you would have moral objections to attending any club that has pricing disparity

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I have never been to any club that has equal charges across the board and I've been to lots both here and abroad.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

To be totally honest I don't think the op has a clue what he's going on about.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Which club would you attend?

It would be an interesting experiment if my usual club did that...I'd stop attending though, because they'd be engaging in precisely the kind of discrimination that I'm objecting to.

I don't care how much I'm being asked to pay. What I'm complaining about is the situation where the price I pay is dictated by whether or not I possess a penis.

I wonder how many people believe you!

But you stated you are on a budget therefore you do care how much it costs"

You're talking about my financial concerns, which are a different issue to my ethical concerns.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I have never been to any club that has equal charges across the board and I've been to lots both here and abroad. "

Nor me. It's Very common on the Fet scene (certainly in London and the South East) but I;ve never heard of it in a swingers club

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I have never been to any club that has equal charges across the board and I've been to lots both here and abroad.

Nor me. It's Very common on the Fet scene (certainly in London and the South East) but I;ve never heard of it in a swingers club"

The fet scene is a totally different ball game, I agree.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

The club charges £15 for single men and single women, and offers a price of £25 for couples.

Group discounts are not contrary to the Equality Act (2010); gender-based pricing is.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There is more to life than money. To be honest you sound a little tight....

I'm not tight - I'm a f***ing student. It's called having to live on a f***ing BUDGET.

So you can't afford to go. That's not sexist.

Maybe look for free socials, you look like you're into fetish so try out fetish munches, things like that.

Ok about the price thing and not be able to afford to also, i read that.

It really doesn't work like that.

Like i already said the women who go there get to choose who they have sex with. So there is no guarantee of sex for any guy who pays to enter a club where people are free to have sex.

In fact men with that attitude are very much discouraged from the swinging scene.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The club charges £15 for single men and single women, and offers a price of £25 for couples.

Group discounts are not contrary to the Equality Act (2010); gender-based pricing is."

So which club is this? Please tell us

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The club charges £15 for single men and single women, and offers a price of £25 for couples.

Group discounts are not contrary to the Equality Act (2010); gender-based pricing is.

So which club is this? Please tell us"

It's ok ive found it and they have different prices on different night depending on your gender

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Exeter Swingers

Check their website

Kink night £15 per single, £25 per couple

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The club charges £15 for single men and single women, and offers a price of £25 for couples.

Group discounts are not contrary to the Equality Act (2010); gender-based pricing is."

But are you not allowed to have reduced pricing for under represented genders ?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *eavenscentitCouple
over a year ago

barnstaple

"Exeter Swingers

Check their website

Kink night £15 per single, £25 per couple"

Women ? Are they cheaper I may go

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

"The club charges £15 for single men and single women, and offers a price of £25 for couples.

Group discounts are not contrary to the Equality Act (2010); gender-based pricing is."

But not for private members clubs

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Unless I've misread their website info, it's:

£15 for single men or women.

£25 for couples.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"The club charges £15 for single men and single women, and offers a price of £25 for couples.

Group discounts are not contrary to the Equality Act (2010); gender-based pricing is.

So which club is this? Please tell us

It's ok ive found it and they have different prices on different night depending on your gender"

I think you're referring to Azurres, who charge single men £40 and single women get in for free.

That's why I go to Exeter Swingers.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"The club charges £15 for single men and single women, and offers a price of £25 for couples.

Group discounts are not contrary to the Equality Act (2010); gender-based pricing is.

But are you not allowed to have reduced pricing for under represented genders ? "

Under the Equality Act, you are not allowed to charge men and women different prices for an identical service. Hence why 'Ladies Nights' at bars and nightclubs are technically illegal.

You are, however, permitted to offer discounts to the disabled, students, and pensioners.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Unless I've misread their website info, it's:

£15 for single men or women.

£25 for couples."

Yes you have read it wrong. They have different prices depending on the event. Its called supply and demand. May I suggest you research your facts before going off on one and claiming the higher ground.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Unless I've misread their website info, it's:

£15 for single men or women.

£25 for couples."

What are their entry fees for a non kink night I can't find any info ?

There seems to be pricing disparity on the t-girl night

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The club charges £15 for single men and single women, and offers a price of £25 for couples.

Group discounts are not contrary to the Equality Act (2010); gender-based pricing is.

But are you not allowed to have reduced pricing for under represented genders ?

Under the Equality Act, you are not allowed to charge men and women different prices for an identical service. Hence why 'Ladies Nights' at bars and nightclubs are technically illegal.

You are, however, permitted to offer discounts to the disabled, students, and pensioners."

Your club "Exeter swingers" does exactly the thing you claim the don't. Please explain

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *eavenscentitCouple
over a year ago

barnstaple

I don't mind paying £15, I expect lots of cock tho...lol

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Unless I've misread their website info, it's:

£15 for single men or women.

£25 for couples.

I know that they have disparate pricing for the T-girls and admirers night; that's why I don't attend that event.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

It's a fairly heavy read, but an interesting one.

Shana S. Brouwers, "A GUY WALKS INTO A BAR: GENDER DISCRIMINATORY PRICING AND ADMISSION POLICIES IN LAS VEGAS ESTABLISHMENTS"

I;m not sure that a study of Las Vegas bars is relevant to UK swinging clubs?

The study was conducted in Vegas, but many UK swingers clubs employ precisely the same unethical business practices, so a legitimate parallel can be drawn."

I'm not sure you are looking at this from an ethical point of view though.

I don't agree with gender specific price structures either but it is the recognised pricing structure for most if not all clubs and I can see why they do it.

But there are far worse injustices in this world than the fact that I get exploited if I choose to go to a swinging club. And I have yet to hear a convincing argument from any man complaining about it that doesn't boil down to entitlement

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The club charges £15 for single men and single women, and offers a price of £25 for couples.

Group discounts are not contrary to the Equality Act (2010); gender-based pricing is.

But are you not allowed to have reduced pricing for under represented genders ?

Under the Equality Act, you are not allowed to charge men and women different prices for an identical service. Hence why 'Ladies Nights' at bars and nightclubs are technically illegal.

You are, however, permitted to offer discounts to the disabled, students, and pensioners."

I think you need to research a little further I have read the legislation I can't recall the exact link now. I think the example was given for a private members golf club with very few female members it was said it was quite legal to offer reduced pricing to encourage female membership

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Unless I've misread their website info, it's:

£15 for single men or women.

£25 for couples.

I know that they have disparate pricing for the T-girls and admirers night; that's why I don't attend that event."

But you claimed that Exeter swingers doesn't discriminate between men and women and they do... Please explain

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Exeter Swingers

Check their website

Kink night £15 per single, £25 per couple"

Does the price apply on nights other than kink ones? As I said earlier gender neutral pricing is common on the fet scene

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Btw I'm sure that Exeter swingers are going to love you for this lol

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Exeter Swingers

Check their website

Kink night £15 per single, £25 per couple

Does the price apply on nights other than kink ones? As I said earlier gender neutral pricing is common on the fet scene"

Can I just interject that a fetish night at a swingers club and a fetish event at a fetish club are two very different things with very different views.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

We can’t really blame the OP for the pricing structure of any particular club. However I thought that people would find it interesting that their website states on couples and limited singles nights:

"Entry Price £20 for couples, £30 for Single Guys and free for single ladies"

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"We can’t really blame the OP for the pricing structure of any particular club. However I thought that people would find it interesting that their website states on couples and limited singles nights:

"Entry Price £20 for couples, £30 for Single Guys and free for single ladies""

You are quite right the op is not at all responsible for a clubs pricing structure. But he is responsible for not getting he's facts right in the first place. It appears to me that he has a problem with his wallet over his principles and that's why I take issue with him. Don't claim one thing when the truth behind it is something else completely.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The only harmful stereotype i see here is another guy moaning coz he has to fork out for some chance of socialising and to possibly get sex.

Wish i hadn't spent ages typing out my other reply now.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

So are you going to stop attending this club now that you know it plays on the "predator/prey dynamic”?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

So are you going to stop attending this club now that you know it plays on the "predator/prey dynamic”?"

We await his answer...... We might be sometime. Put the kettle on!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *piritsonfabCouple
over a year ago

Nottingham

I'm not sure how the fetish scene and events manage to run with equal pricing regardless of gender, but they do - and they're not swamped with predatory males either.

If anyone misbehaved, they'd be asked to leave.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 21/05/16 21:04:00]

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I'm not sure how the fetish scene and events manage to run with equal pricing regardless of gender, but they do - and they're not swamped with predatory males either.

If anyone misbehaved, they'd be asked to leave. "

Because most fet events aren't run to earn money. They run because they do.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

So are you going to stop attending this club now that you know it plays on the "predator/prey dynamic”?"

Oh the irony the club he attends ends up being more expensive than the club he was moaning about

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

So are you going to stop attending this club now that you know it plays on the "predator/prey dynamic”?

Oh the irony the club he attends ends up being more expensive than the club he was moaning about "

Were I to attend the £30 for single guys night:

12x30 = 360

Cupids: £75 for an annual membership

£25 per visit thereafter.

12x25 = 300 300+75 = 375.

My local club would therefore still be cheaper by £15 over the course of a year, if I attended once a month.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

I think everyone has their financial limits.

Clubs are a tricky one - all the times that I have attendended clubs, it has been through some forum-organised event and I know there will be people there that I want to meet and/or people I know who I want to catch up with, so I know I'm going to have a laugh, and if I do play theh thats a bonus.

I keep being put off the idea of going to clubs by myself because they are pretty expensive, and I could have a decent night (socially) cheaper elsewhere. I won't pretend that I don't like the idea of sex in clubs, and I have done it, but I dislike the assumption that I'll shag anyone just because I'm there, because I won't.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

So are you going to stop attending this club now that you know it plays on the "predator/prey dynamic”?"

I attended the '£30 single males, £20 couples, free single ladies' on two occasions, then stopped attending for precisely the reason I outline herein.

I attend the club very rarely, and when I do, it's SPECIFICALLY on the £15 all singles night.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

So are you going to stop attending this club now that you know it plays on the "predator/prey dynamic”?

Oh the irony the club he attends ends up being more expensive than the club he was moaning about

Were I to attend the £30 for single guys night:

12x30 = 360

Cupids: £75 for an annual membership

£25 per visit thereafter.

12x25 = 300 300+75 = 375.

My local club would therefore still be cheaper by £15 over the course of a year, if I attended once a month."

So it is all about how much it costs you rather than a principled agreement over the gender price disparity. Why don't you just admit it and be done with it...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

So are you going to stop attending this club now that you know it plays on the "predator/prey dynamic”?

I attended the '£30 single males, £20 couples, free single ladies' on two occasions, then stopped attending for precisely the reason I outline herein.

I attend the club very rarely, and when I do, it's SPECIFICALLY on the £15 all singles night."

But you started this based on principle. And the club you attend doesn't hold the same principle at all. Therefore to stand by your claimed principles you should not be attending any club or event that has a pricing structure that is different for men and women.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I was considering throwing binary into the mix but I fear that may be a step to far lmao

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

So are you going to stop attending this club now that you know it plays on the "predator/prey dynamic”?

Oh the irony the club he attends ends up being more expensive than the club he was moaning about

Were I to attend the £30 for single guys night:

12x30 = 360

Cupids: £75 for an annual membership

£25 per visit thereafter.

12x25 = 300 300+75 = 375.

My local club would therefore still be cheaper by £15 over the course of a year, if I attended once a month.

So it is all about how much it costs you rather than a principled agreement over the gender price disparity. Why don't you just admit it and be done with it..."

Even if that is his point, so what? The sorts of non-swinging nightclub that you can attend for £75 entrance fee really are pretty upmarket compared to (most) swingers clubs - theres a value for money question in there somewhere.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

So are you going to stop attending this club now that you know it plays on the "predator/prey dynamic”?

Oh the irony the club he attends ends up being more expensive than the club he was moaning about

Were I to attend the £30 for single guys night:

12x30 = 360

Cupids: £75 for an annual membership

£25 per visit thereafter.

12x25 = 300 300+75 = 375.

My local club would therefore still be cheaper by £15 over the course of a year, if I attended once a month.

So it is all about how much it costs you rather than a principled agreement over the gender price disparity. Why don't you just admit it and be done with it...

Surely value for money is purely subjective.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

And this whole thread wasn't about vfm. Anyways it's Saturday night and life goes on... lol

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

Well OP its either about ethics and principles, or its about money.

If its about money, then you can keep on going to a club that you say “isn’t very flashy”, and save yourself £1.25 per visit over a club that presumably is a bit more flashy and a more pleasant environment. I personally would prefer a nicer club for the extra £1.25, but its up to you.

Alternatively its about the ethics and principles, and it turns out that the club you attend isn’t as principled as you thought it was. Oh, actually, you said that you did attend it twice at the higher price so you must have known all along (i.e. before you started the thread) about their pricing structure being unequal. So you either have to stop going, or if you think the club is principled on some night and not others, you will have to do the same. Keep your principles, apart from the nights that you want to attend the club!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"The only harmful stereotype i see here is another guy moaning coz he has to fork out for some chance of socialising and to possibly get sex.

Wish i hadn't spent ages typing out my other reply now."

I don't have to 'fork out for a chance of socialising and possibly get sex.'

I have a perfectly satisfactory social life and sex life, thank you very much.

Yet again, someone assuming that, because I have a penis, my complaint must be driven by a desire for sex.

My objections are no different to those raised by the FEMALE lawyer who wrote the article. She benefits from the pricing structure, yet she objects to it on principle.

Why insult me by assuming that I cannot do the same, and object on principle?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Well OP its either about ethics and principles, or its about money.

Very well said

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Well OP its either about ethics and principles, or its about money.

According to the version of their website at the time of writing, the £30/£20/Free night is no longer advertised.

If, however, the club is still running this night, I shall do as you say, and not attend at all.

Considering that I've not attended for over a year due to pressures of work and financial considerations, I shan't miss it.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The only harmful stereotype i see here is another guy moaning coz he has to fork out for some chance of socialising and to possibly get sex.

Wish i hadn't spent ages typing out my other reply now.

I don't have to 'fork out for a chance of socialising and possibly get sex.'

I have a perfectly satisfactory social life and sex life, thank you very much.

Yet again, someone assuming that, because I have a penis, my complaint must be driven by a desire for sex.

My objections are no different to those raised by the FEMALE lawyer who wrote the article. She benefits from the pricing structure, yet she objects to it on principle.

Why insult me by assuming that I cannot do the same, and object on principle? "

Because you can't object to the principle and then go along with it. That makes you a hypocrite. For gods sake man grow up

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Well OP its either about ethics and principles, or its about money.

According to the version of their website at the time of writing, the £30/£20/Free night is no longer advertised.

If, however, the club is still running this night, I shall do as you say, and not attend at all.

Considering that I've not attended for over a year due to pressures of work and financial considerations, I shan't miss it."

And that's about as close to an admission as we are likely to see...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"The only harmful stereotype i see here is another guy moaning coz he has to fork out for some chance of socialising and to possibly get sex.

Wish i hadn't spent ages typing out my other reply now.

I don't have to 'fork out for a chance of socialising and possibly get sex.'

I have a perfectly satisfactory social life and sex life, thank you very much.

Yet again, someone assuming that, because I have a penis, my complaint must be driven by a desire for sex.

My objections are no different to those raised by the FEMALE lawyer who wrote the article. She

benefits from the pricing structure, yet she objects to it on principle.

Why insult me by assuming that I cannot do the same, and object on principle?

Because you can't object to the principle and then go along with it. That makes you a hypocrite. For gods sake man grow up"

I don't 'go along with it.' I attend those nights on which the price of entry reflects my principles. I have 'voted with my feet' and refused to attend their events wherein a disparate pricing structure is employed.

As to my decision to still attend their equality-priced kink events, if anyone can suggest how I can convince my flatmates to allow me to install a sex swing, bondage cross, flogging bench and dark room in our flat, and thereby eliminate my dependence on the club circuit, I welcome your input...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

"Well OP its either about ethics and principles, or its about money.

According to the version of their website at the time of writing, the £30/£20/Free night is no longer advertised.

If, however, the club is still running this night, I shall do as you say, and not attend at all.

Considering that I've not attended for over a year due to pressures of work and financial considerations, I shan't miss it."

Prices are on the website right now, I don’t have some cached version of the site from years ago just incase this debate came up! I had never even heard of the club before you mentioned it.

I can’t post a link to it due to forum rules however the prices are under the “Information” tabs (rather than the "Party Dates & Prices” tab, for some reason)

Couples and Limited Singles - Entry Price £20 for couples, £30 for Single Guys and free for single ladies

Kink Night - £15 each of £25 for a couple

Guys Night - No price (free?)

T-Girl & Admirers Daytime Event - Tgirls and Real Girls £15, Male Admirers £20, Couples £25

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Well OP its either about ethics and principles, or its about money.

According to the version of their website at the time of writing, the £30/£20/Free night is no longer advertised.

If, however, the club is still running this night, I shall do as you say, and not attend at all.

Considering that I've not attended for over a year due to pressures of work and financial considerations, I shan't miss it.

Prices are on the website right now, I don’t have some cached version of the site from years ago just incase this debate came up! I had never even heard of the club before you mentioned it.

I can’t post a link to it due to forum rules however the prices are under the “Information” tabs (rather than the "Party Dates & Prices” tab, for some reason)

Couples and Limited Singles - Entry Price £20 for couples, £30 for Single Guys and free for single ladies

Kink Night - £15 each of £25 for a couple

Guys Night - No price (free?)

T-Girl & Admirers Daytime Event - Tgirls and Real Girls £15, Male Admirers £20, Couples £25

In which case, the criticisms that I levelled earlier in the thread are applicable to my local club on all nights other than the Kink Night.

As I said, that is why I stopped attending their 'Couples/Limited Singles' event 20 months ago, after only my second visit.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Well OP its either about ethics and principles, or its about money.

According to the version of their website at the time of writing, the £30/£20/Free night is no longer advertised.

If, however, the club is still running this night, I shall do as you say, and not attend at all.

Considering that I've not attended for over a year due to pressures of work and financial considerations, I shan't miss it.

Prices are on the website right now, I don’t have some cached version of the site from years ago just incase this debate came up! I had never even heard of the club before you mentioned it.

I can’t post a link to it due to forum rules however the prices are under the “Information” tabs (rather than the "Party Dates & Prices” tab, for some reason)

Couples and Limited Singles - Entry Price £20 for couples, £30 for Single Guys and free for single ladies

Kink Night - £15 each of £25 for a couple

Guys Night - No price (free?)

T-Girl & Admirers Daytime Event - Tgirls and Real Girls £15, Male Admirers £20, Couples £25

In which case, the criticisms that I levelled earlier in the thread are applicable to my local club on all nights other than the Kink Night.

As I said, that is why I stopped attending their 'Couples/Limited Singles' event 20 months ago, after only my second visit."

So as has already been said, you knew all along that the club you attend has different entry fees for men and women.. that's the point.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"So as has already been said, you knew all along that the club you attend has different entry fees for men and women.. that's the point."

I knew that their 'Couples and Limited Singles' event uses disparate entry fees; however, that's precisely why I haven't attended that event for 20 months.

Also, earlier in this thread, I made it clear that I was addressing my support for their £15 singles/£25 couples Kink Night, and comparing it to the price of attendance as other, more 'exclusive clubs.'

Personally, I did not feel it to be hypocritical to support the club insofar as its practices comply with my views on equivalence pricing.

However, if others on this thread see differently, I would be happy to adopt a more strict interpretation of my principles, and cease attendance at the Kink Night as well.

As I've said, they will hardly miss my monthly £15, and my sex life and social life will not be appreciably diminished either...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Evidently, part of my earlier discussion in this thread was based on inaccurate info, insofar as comparing my local venue to larger ones elsewhere in the country.

However, I stand by what I said regarding disparate pricing, and my agreement with the conclusions drawn in the paper cited in my OP

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Yawn

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *LCCCouple
over a year ago

Cambridge

Attend the club, have fun, and just accept that in swingers clubs, men pay more.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *at69driveMan
over a year ago

Wisbech and A47 corridor

It's a fairly heavy read, but an interesting one.

Shana S. Brouwers, "A GUY WALKS INTO A BAR: GENDER DISCRIMINATORY PRICING AND ADMISSION POLICIES IN LAS VEGAS ESTABLISHMENTS""
I don't think many men would want prices for men to be lowered as it would simply mean a club full of men which defeats the purpose .

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *imiUKMan
over a year ago

Hereford

"Attend the club, have fun, and just accept that in swingers clubs, men pay more.

Or don't. Apart from the circumstances mentioned in my last post, I don't bother.

I think clubs in general (most, not all) need to up their game a bit.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ethnmelvCouple
over a year ago

Chudleigh

The only thing that is interesting in clubs is 'will the single guys grow some balls and come and say hi!?

Forget the crap about entry fees, you could pay nothing or £1m but if you won't talk to a girl it won't happen!!!

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"So it is all about how much it costs you rather than a principled agreement over the gender price disparity. Why don't you just admit it and be done with it..."

No, I included the math because you claimed that "the club I attend ends up being more expensive than the club I was moaning about."

My calculations show that you were wrong in making that claim.

In any case, just because I take financial matters into consideration DOES NOT MEAN that I don't also refrain from attending certain events because of my principles concerning gendered pricing.

The two are not mutually exclusive.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ethnmelvCouple
over a year ago

Chudleigh

"So it is all about how much it costs you rather than a principled agreement over the gender price disparity. Why don't you just admit it and be done with it...

No, I included the math because you claimed that "the club I attend ends up being more expensive than the club I was moaning about."

My calculations show that you were wrong in making that claim.

In any case, just because I take financial matters into consideration DOES NOT MEAN that I don't also refrain from attending certain events because of my principles concerning gendered pricing.

The two are not mutually exclusive."

...principles...., hmmm

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"...principles...., hmmm"

Yes, principles. I happen to have some.

Some people in this thread continue to assume that I'm only capable of thinking with my cock, and characterise my objection to disparate pricing as evidence of my desire to get laid as cheaply as possible.

It is clearly impossible for me to convince those people to interpret my criticisms of disparate pricing in any other light, but if they wish to shove me into a neat little gender-stereotyped box, that's their business.

Since I've never going to be asking said people to meet, or encounter them on the club circuit, I don't care if they think I'm sincere or not.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ethnmelvCouple
over a year ago

Chudleigh

Me think you protest too much..., why not just enjoy this life rather than bitch about it?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Me think you protest too much..., why not just enjoy this life rather than bitch about it?"

I think he's got "issues"

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Me think you protest too much..., why not just enjoy this life rather than bitch about it?"

Aha, the old 'why not just enjoy it?' Jibe.

Maybe because, while I may be a hedonist and a swinger, I believe that it's still important to question why we do what we do.

Obviously, you've made your mind up about me though, so I really don't know why you continue to bait me...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ethnmelvCouple
over a year ago

Chudleigh

Continue, I'm not sure we even started...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Me think you protest too much..., why not just enjoy this life rather than bitch about it?

I think he's got "issues""

Oh really Dr. Freud?

Should I lie on the couch and tell you about my childhood, or would you prefer to hear about my dreams?

I would be quite fascinated to receive your diagnosis of my mental state...tell me, from what 'issues' am I suffering?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Continue, I'm not sure we even started..."

'Principles...hmmm...' And 'methinks you do protest too much'

I call those baiting...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Me think you protest too much..., why not just enjoy this life rather than bitch about it?

I think he's got "issues"

Oh really Dr. Freud?

Should I lie on the couch and tell you about my childhood, or would you prefer to hear about my dreams?

I would be quite fascinated to receive your diagnosis of my mental state...tell me, from what 'issues' am I suffering?

There is no need to analyse you, you are doing a fine job all on your own x

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"There is no need to analyse you, you are doing a fine job all on your own x"

Well why bait me by implying that I have 'issues'?

If you've got something to say, then say it.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *piritsonfabCouple
over a year ago

Nottingham

At least it's a more interesting topic than the endless kiss fuck or avoid threads.....

Surely having an opinion on a common club complaint and pondering the reasons is worthy of debate and not put downs?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"There is no need to analyse you, you are doing a fine job all on your own x

Well why bait me by implying that I have 'issues'?

If you've got something to say, then say it."

To be honest I think I've already said it...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"There is no need to analyse you, you are doing a fine job all on your own x

Well why bait me by implying that I have 'issues'?

If you've got something to say, then say it.

To be honest I think I've already said it..."

I'm just intrigued by what you meant by 'issues'...

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"At least it's a more interesting topic than the endless kiss fuck or avoid threads.....

Surely having an opinion on a common club complaint and pondering the reasons is worthy of debate and not put downs?

Whether you agree with me or not, thank you for your support.

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *ethnmelvCouple
over a year ago

Chudleigh

Opinions are fine, listening to alternative views is what makes you realise people have two ears and one mouth. Sadly the OP only has one....

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By *piritsonfabCouple
over a year ago

Nottingham

Can't remember what your position was lol

But it's still more interesting than crap about football....

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

"Opinions are fine, listening to alternative views is what makes you realise people have two ears and one mouth. Sadly the OP only has one...."

I thought you just told me to "just enjoy this life rather than bitch about it"?

If you want me to 'just enjoy life,' and 'stop bitching,' why should I care about listening to other people's views?

(closed, thread got too big)

Reply privately