FabSwingers.com forum: Attention to a potential problem

By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

*please read and share with fellow swingers at all levels of experience *

My deepest apologies for being intrusive and having no choice but to seriously draw your attention to some less attractive aspects to swinging and its community. I'm saddened and sickened why i must do this here and run the risk of even the slightest chance of pissing on someone fire and spoiling anyone's fun.

The one and only rule we are asked to take responsibility for and to always respect, in exchange for our individual maximum pleasures and whims catered for at all times, as a swingers community. Its very simple and of positive impact to all of us as a whole community and as individuals to explore without judgement or restrictions. Safely, without detrimental risk to health, welbeing or long term damage, caused by, at times blurred lines of self exploration at cost to others for our end gain. Very important and absolutely vital as a safety net and method of communitcation clearly stating someones personal space or boundaries under threat or at risk. This rule should infact give every individual ownership and personal responsibilty for avoiding and never being party to another having to point out the lack of respect for personal and individual freedom when some lose sight of this rule and the responsibilty we all have whilst playing in the swinging community.

"Always ask permission at all times and wait for clear consent and permission is given before you touch or join in"

At all times,in every scenario, in every play or any scene. We must clearly ask for consent to join, or respectfully watch from a distance,until or unless a very clear request is offered to join in and a clear response from all party's that permission is freely given.

Sorry for the long winded, simplification outlining of an obvious and absolute swingers code of conduct,and universal law of engagement across the whole scene. clearly understood and acted upon by virtually 99% of the whole community.Showing appreciation for others personal space and private intimacy,if the ultimate privilege is freely given to join that unique scene for mutual gratification then that is the holy grail and ultimate in swingers paradise.

So now i am in disbelief and slight shock, to now be pointing out why it is of vital importance and our ultimate responsibility to ourselves and others to report immediately and without discussion or hesitation, directly to management, any infringement or apparent disregard for outlined code of conduct. as unacceptable behavior, with immediate removal from premise and membership revoked.With as little disturbance to other members as possible.

So Why after 22 years of involvement at differing levels as a swinger and member of the community and having never in that time, witnessing a single incident of this happening and at a blatant disregard for any one other than their own selfish self gratification being there intended motif behind visiting a club, or invading a scene etc.

I am stunned and speechless when i try to understand this kind of mindset and justification, for my experiance of tonights club and expriance with someone that didnt just invade my space, disrespect my rights to be shown respect and ask permission to join in, but felt it his personal right to, whilst in outer space of orgasmic bliss and riding the hitch hikers love shuttle of shameless hedonism with absolute gratitude for what i was recieving as the only thing to occupy my mind at that moment, did i suddenly become aware that the hand that was enjoying my breast and showing manly appreciation at my immersion in the orgasm that was mindblowing btw, was a startling reality when i could clearly feel both his hand around my thighs and had been since he moved between my legs, i opened my eyes and froze when a foot away a stranger i had neither spoken to or was aware he was even in the room at any point, never saying he ways there or was it ok, but he had been enjoying my breast and orgasm for quite some time without know it, not entertaining anything other that my partner was enjoying my breast as i enjoyed his attention to my pleasure as his sole purpose in life, What the fuck. I am furious and concerned that this could be a more common accurance and sign that the code of conduct might now be needed to read for new members or at every visit and plastered every where for obvious and inescapble reality. I've not been regular on the scene for a short while 7/8 attendances in 18 months, please let me unfortunate and exceptionally unlucky at bein g in the wrong place at the wrong time with this rare one off freaks infaltrating the scene undected and not a feared indicater that the foreign gentleman, who understood perfect english but tried the i dont understand excuse for actions as justifcation, but he clearly indicated a very real fact that eastern europian men, with no respect for women, have become a problematic pest and threat to womens safety in some notable bars in manchester and concerning cases of abuse in young d*unken girls inexperianced and vulnerable, is widly reported in papers and reported to police stations, i really hope im being nurotic and over analylical in thinking this might be a sign of things to come and an unwelcome preditory new comer in our midst. I am happy to be the unhinged hysterical worrier if im complete wrong on this, but would have a real challenge in acceoting or saying this in any other setting.

The added addition to this story which gave weight to my conclusion and fear of what might be unfolding in the scene, is earlier in the eveing a couple in the couples room, where pry to the very same invasion of space and apparent use for his pleasure and without thought for the womens feelings or right to be asked etc, only difference between my experiance is that he didnt intimatly touch and did happen for long, i was out of it inself absorbtion for quite awhile no idea of time frame only when i became conciously aware that there was a 3rd hand involed and my partners were where they had always been, and after reporting him to the management it became evidant and more worrying that and earlier incedent of gropping without permission whilst in towel and platfully exploring the club not long after arrival was his friend and partner in crime and worried me that they had ignored each other all night as if strangers but when dressed and about to lweave the managemnet pulled the first one to the side it was very clear they where there together and from same country and had a very transparent set of excuses that sounded well versed and used before, using almost word for word, its not my fault i didnt know,mi didnt understand, etc.

Please, please please my friends, without hesitation or wait, report and problems imediatly and to the management and then alert fellow swingers if any description can be remembered and hopefully if my fears have any weight, the managements and owners and staff can collectivley ban and remove from the whole scene so safe gaurding every ones happy and unapologetic self gratification at the wonderful swingers clubs.

Thank you for indulging me and my worries, in reading this, if you got that far. but please take responsibility that we all have in removing predators from the scene and and new inexperienced newbies falling pry to an even worse outcome. That is my motif for writing this and leaves me with gratitude in your kind consideration when not responding with negative thoughts or personal opinion on anything other than my message and my only impetus for bringing seriousness into a play of fun for considered thought, thank you x

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Sorry just way too long to read, the gist of the story would have been so much easier

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Sorry just way too long to read, the gist of the story would have been so much easier"

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

well - blimey i read it all but a lot wont and it wasnt all necessary - id trim it to get the point across - whilst i agree with you and what happened was wrong i have to ask about your partner you were with - no way would my fella let anybody into a private room with us, touch me, or anything without my knowing and saying was ok - if i was so into my orgasm that i was unaware then more so he would look out for me - part of the partnership is this and why i play with only him there

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By *et a roomCouple
over a year ago

Leeds

Zzzzzz

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Yeah, i wanted to read read after i furiously spewed it out, could do with leaving 1/5 but i hadnt long been home from the club and was still in rant disbelief and anger mode, so thanks for your kind and consrtuctive critism, its duely noted, i couldnt be arsed re reading it all then editing it, might after sleep, the act of what happened wasnt my focus for sitting with it to write and post, but the preditory and tag team tactics were really worrying and even though i know the post with get more negative responses i diont care, its just a warning that if my over analytically worries arent unfounded and based in any fact, then we all need to take equal responsiblitiy at clubs and look out for others with less experiance or vulnerable, i couldnt sleep with that on my mind, thanks once againx p.s the room was a couples room but the way the unusual bed was arranged and how sneaky this guy had crawled in and monovered himself was less appent than it might sound, it was me that went mental, it was a good job i didnt have my strapon with me, i wounded have stopped till id done some damage, the guy wasnt my parner, and i think i scared him when i let rip lol x

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By *bi HaiveMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Cheeseville, Somerset

"Please respect peoples boundaries and always obtain consent before touching others" - would have used far less internet ink and paper.

Plus I doubt your target audience will be forum users.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

I agree in part and i appreciate your coments and value them, i do feel that the over simplification, whilst more direct and less time consuming and overindulgent in rant, than mine, it loses any sense of the real concern for the whole evening and not just the intrusive act whilst mid flight orgasm and detached awareness. These fuckers had a well excited plan, it had be used before and it wasnt just self centred but predatory and pack like, that's very worrying, im wont apologies for that in anyway, the long winded shit that wasnt needed in my message, however, i will apologies x

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Impressed you've had the energy and thought to write that length of a post, knowing it just won't attract a lot of people's attention, arguably almost pointless in hoping to attract the typical perpetrators too. Good luck though, always good to get things off your chest too

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Skim read as like others have said it's too long but what I got from it was someone decided to fondly you in the midst of your orgasm and they hadn't been invited too?? Was it really that bad? Perhaps I missed something.

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By *chillesHeelCouple
over a year ago

Somerset

Sorry you've had a negative experience but I'm really confused as to what has actually happened here. I don't get the gist of what he has done to you.

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By *ed14Couple
over a year ago

Yorkshire

Why did your partner not tell him not to touch you, think your biggest problem should be with your partner for allowing this to happen IF you did tell him you wanted nobody else involved, also you haven't said if the person in question carried on groping you after you asked him to stop, this sounds more of a communication problem between you and your partner than anything sinister. Just our opinion from what we have read.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Bloody hell ??

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Why didn't your partner get involved and stop him from touching you?.. Sorry for what you experienced though.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

" Sorry you've had a negative experience but I'm really confused as to what has actually happened here. I don't get the gist of what he has done to you.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I would like to know what your partner was doing at this time? He should have been protecting you.

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By *enithWoman
over a year ago

closer than you think

"Why didn't your partner get involved and stop him from touching you?.. Sorry for what you experienced though.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Don't play in public thus avoiding the arseholes

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I would like to know what your partner was doing at this time? He should have been protecting you."

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By *astersfuckpigCouple
over a year ago

Eastbourne

Well that was a long read..Luckily i have a Master who is very Dominant,so guys pushing it get told very quickly to pack it in..no matter who they are or what there look like..

I am sorry that your night was ruined but unless I am missing something nothing really happened..Some guy touched you,which as you say is very rare..And he got told to do one which he did..And you reported him.

As for the other couple you say he pushed his way into and had sex with..well unless you are that couple its hard to say what that was about..And why did the guy let it happen or the girl not call for help?

PS Do you write for the daily mail?

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

no offence... but most of that I would have discussed with any potential playing partners before I entered into a situation of playing.......

so maybe the actual lesson from your post is not only the understand of others.... but to change the ways you vet people you play with, and get across the do's and donts of the situation you are getting into

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By *uke olovingmanMan
over a year ago

Gravesend

i get dismayed by the feeding frenzy scrum that sometimes appears when a lady plays with one or two of the single guys in clubs .. creeps me out to be honest

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By *uiet confidenceMan
over a year ago

Warrington

I'm not surprised but very sorry to read this - even though it is a minority it just further tars the reputation of single men.

I'm still amazed at the number of single guys in clubs whose way of asking permission is simply to surreptitiously place a hand on a woman and wait to be told no. I suppose the few women who do like this or are accepting of it give these men confidence that this approach has merits with all women.

It is no consolation to the OP, but I've had single men do exactly this to me (another single man) and I was not happy one bit. I think the rule has to be that if you're in a public area of a club you need to keep your wits about you as sadly, this behaviour is pretty much impossible to prevent and difficult to punish retrospectively as it is often one person' sword against the other.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I've never been to a club. I might like to if mr right turns up but if as a newbie they wouldn't protect me from this, then I'm scared off already

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By *uiet confidenceMan
over a year ago

Warrington

It is well worth re-stating that the overwhelming majority of people in clubs are nothing like this, to the extent that I'm fairly sure that single girls are safer in swingers clubs than they are in traditional bars and clubs.

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By *lackCherryCouple
over a year ago

Bristol

Right I get it, someone got touchy touchy in a club when they shouldn't have.

on our 3rd visit to a club ever someone walked into a locked room and started touching Mrs Cherry when we were playing without being invited, I told him to to leave and reported him to the management.

It sucks and its not fun, it can ruin the mood but im afraid when you put people into these situations and ply them with alcohol these things happen.

This odd idea that by signing up to a website or going to a club suddenly changes people into the mythical "swinger" is odd, people are still people and expecting them to be anything else is a little naive.

Also whats up with the first post ? you literally take a paragraph to say something you can say just as well in a sentence its like you swallowed a thesaurus.

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By *lackCherryCouple
over a year ago

Bristol

"I've never been to a club. I might like to if mr right turns up but if as a newbie they wouldn't protect me from this, then I'm scared off already

Yes these one or two bad experiences from dozens of clubs and hundreds of club nights a year represent a majority and therefore are cause for concern

There are a lot of people on this forum that look for any post that contains negativity about clubs to immediately let us know that this is why they wont go to one or "now wont" its such an odd attitude.

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By *lackCherryCouple
over a year ago

Bristol

[Removed by poster at 09/08/14 11:46:12]

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By *lackCherryCouple
over a year ago

Bristol

also

"n, who understood perfect english but tried the i dont understand excuse for actions as justifcation, but he clearly indicated a very real fact that [b]eastern europian men[/b], "

way to throw a bit of racist stereotyping into your massive post. Was it a bet to see if you could be pretty outwardly racist in a forum post and hide it in about 600 words ?

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

and i must say that i agree with all that was said.

the most important thing to take from this experience is that anything which disrespects your boundaries should be reported to management. immediately. even if it spoils the mood, causes a scene or brings an early end to the evening.

i firmly believe that everyone who goes should be told in plain english what the rules are, with no innuendo. one of these rules is that you never touch without an invitation, whether it be verbal, a nod or other gesture. also, that an invitation to one half of a couple does not always include the other half.

its a minefield of etiquette, but communication is essential.

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By *lackCherryCouple
over a year ago

Bristol

Of all the clubs we have been too only one consistently makes this message clear to any new people is ourplace4fun, every new person gets a personal tour where the rules are explained.

They also have a white line round all of the play areas and if you want to join you have to be invited into the area.

Very few clubs take the time to explain the rules and etiquette a lot of it just assumed.

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By *ancs MinxWoman
over a year ago

Burnley

"no offence... but most of that I would have discussed with any potential playing partners before I entered into a situation of playing.......

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By *orthyorkypairCouple
over a year ago

North Yorkshire

"Zzzzzz"

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Of all the clubs we have been too only one consistently makes this message clear to any new people is ourplace4fun, every new person gets a personal tour where the rules are explained.

They also have a white line round all of the play areas and if you want to join you have to be invited into the area.

Very few clubs take the time to explain the rules and etiquette a lot of it just assumed.

I've never been to a club where you haven't had the rules explained and I always tell guys when i show them around a club

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By *orthyorkypairCouple
over a year ago

North Yorkshire

"Don't play in public thus avoiding the arseholes "

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

[Removed by poster at 09/08/14 12:55:37]

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I gave up halfway through tge second paragraph - executive summary anyone?

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By *ancs MinxWoman
over a year ago

Burnley

Of all the clubs we have been too only one consistently makes this message clear to any new people is ourplace4fun, every new person gets a personal tour where the rules are explained.

They also have a white line round all of the play areas and if you want to join you have to be invited into the area.

Very few clubs take the time to explain the rules and etiquette a lot of it just assumed.

I've never been to a club where you haven't had the rules explained and I always tell guys when i show them around a club "

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"unlucky at bein g in the wrong place at the wrong time with this rare one off freaks infaltrating the scene undected and not a feared indicater that the foreign gentleman, who understood perfect english but tried the i dont understand excuse for actions as justifcation, but he clearly indicated a very real fact that eastern europian men, with no respect for women, have become a problematic pest and threat to womens safety in some notable bars in manchester and concerning cases of abuse in young d*unken girls inexperianced and vulnerable, is widly reported in papers and reported to police stations, i really hope im being nurotic and over analylical "

Nurotic? Over analytical? I couldn't possibly say. But this section of your post shows very clear and unpleasant connotations

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By *bi HaiveMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Cheeseville, Somerset

"its a minefield of etiquette, but communication is essential. "

Etiquette is hardly a minefield !

No means no.

Waiting to be invited is the correct behaviour.

Respecting personal space.

And taking 'fuck off' as an indication that you've overstepped the mark/encroached to close as a signal to do just that.

Simple rules that if observed ensure a good time for all.

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By *ezebelWoman
over a year ago

North of The Wall - youll need your vest

If I was with my partner and he didnt deal with it he'd be the one getting slated.

Having said that, if I didnt feel that I could stay aware of what was going on - and open my mouth if someone does something that I dont like - then I wouldnt be going to clubs.

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By *astersfuckpigCouple
over a year ago

Eastbourne

'I gave up halfway through tge second paragraph - executive summary anyone?'

A man touched me in a club without permission..I told him to fuck off and reported him staff.

Also I don't like immigrates much..

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By *uke olovingmanMan
over a year ago

Gravesend

also .. go with a wingman you can trust to keep an eye on you . and the guys in the room

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By *lackCherryCouple
over a year ago

Bristol

"I gave up halfway through tge second paragraph - executive summary anyone? "

Someone touched her boob in a club without being invited and then she at a thesaurus :D

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By *lackCherryCouple
over a year ago

Bristol

Nurotic? Over analytical? I couldn't possibly say. But this section of your post shows very clear and unpleasant connotations"

yeah I thought the quite blatant racism was a nice touch, just far enough into it that most people have given up the will to live!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I've never been to a club. I might like to if mr right turns up but if as a newbie they wouldn't protect me from this, then I'm scared off already

Most clubs look out for single ladies so you shouldn't have any issues...

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Good lord it reads like it's been ran through Google translate then every word under 3 syllables had been put through a thesaurus to find a longer one.

It actually makes no sense at times because of this.

But yeah long story short someone touched her boob.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Wow! Eastern european men are the problem? Firstly, you have public sex. If you dont want strangers touching you maybe dont have public sex? And secondly you say this is you first experience of being touched yet you're happy to place blame on an entire group of people because of one guy? Not cool.

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By *lackCherryCouple
over a year ago

Bristol

But yeah long story short someone touched her boob."

An Eastern European touched her boob, this had a whole paragraph dedicated to it so I think its important.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Right I get it, someone got touchy touchy in a club when they shouldn't have.

It sucks and its not fun, it can ruin the mood but im afraid when you put people into these situations and ply them with alcohol these things happen.

Also whats up with the first post ? you literally take a paragraph to say something you can say just as well in a sentence its like you swallowed a thesaurus.

Are you for real?? A woman is sexually assaulted in a club and choses to share that with the forum and all you bang on about is about her English usage. FFS keep attending those compassion classes!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Firstly, you have public sex. If you dont want strangers touching you maybe dont have public sex? "

So to clarify - public sex equals an open invitation for others to join in?

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By *lackCherryCouple
over a year ago

Bristol

Are you for real?? A woman is sexually assaulted in a club and choses to share that with the forum and all you bang on about is about her English usage. FFS keep attending those compassion classes!"

This sort of stuff happens in the community, you deal with it at the time in a calm and firm manner you let the club management know and if its a decent club they will get rid of said person, you cant stop people being people just because its "swinging".

I do not believe that it should be a precursor to a pretty poorly written rant with a massive racist undertone to it no.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

id be thinking this is less likely to happen in a swingers club than out and about in a pub etc - still feel your partner should have protected you - i know mine would have launched him into next year

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By *bi HaiveMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Cheeseville, Somerset

"Firstly, you have public sex. If you dont want strangers touching you maybe dont have public sex?

So to clarify - public sex equals an open invitation for others to join in?"

It doesn't.

To 99.9% of club goers.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Hope you did report him. Should also consider reporting to police for assault.

A thread on here last week highlighted a guy who was done for rape in a swingers club.

From the sound of it these guys are only one step behind that.

I personally would never consider behaving that way in ANY circumstances. I have ridden "shotgun" for a lady friend of mine in the past and did have to warn one guy very strongly ( more about his possible liking of hospital food rather than threat of management if memory serves).

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Are you for real?? A woman is sexually assaulted in a club and choses to share that with the forum and all you bang on about is about her English usage. FFS keep attending those compassion classes!

I do not believe that it should be a precursor to a pretty poorly written rant with a massive racist undertone to it no.

So she's a racist who asked for it! Just because she has written a long post doesn't take away the fact that she was assaulted. Anybody with an ounce of compassion would sympathise with that. I have seen and witnessed the type of behaviour in some of the clubs in the north west that she is describing. She's not being racist by mentioning their ethnicity.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Firstly, you have public sex. If you dont want strangers touching you maybe dont have public sex?

So to clarify - public sex equals an open invitation for others to join in?"

I don't want strangers touching me during sex and the way i ensure that is by not allowing strangers access to me while i'm having sex. It is an extremely risky business having sex in pulic places, i'm sure those who do it know that. So they know that every time they do it they are open to a miriad of unpleasant things that could happen. I know this and i don't have sex in public, that's why i choose not to. There are many actions and choices we make every day and many of them are risk related. I have always wondered what sex with someone in a club would be like but after a quick visit to one i realised the risks outweighed the benefits and left.

No-one has the right to sexually molest another person however we all have a responsibility to make our own decisions as to how much risk we put ourselves at.

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By *lackCherryCouple
over a year ago

Bristol

No one said she deserved anything, are you a daily mail reader too because you're making some interesting jumps here.

Having been in a situation like this ourselves you deal with you tell the guy no and you report it to the club management, who if they are a decent club will bar him or deal with him.

As for the racist implications, if you don't believe that singling someone out for negative behavior (and going to some lengths to do it too) while attributing to his race/where hes from isn't racist then I'm not sure what to say to you (but you're wrong).

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

No one said she deserved anything, are you a daily mail reader too because you're making some interesting jumps here.

Having been in a situation like this ourselves you deal with you tell the guy no and you report it to the club management, who if they are a decent club will bar him or deal with him.

Whatever you say! As always someone who knows jack shit about me telling me what i am. Feel free to correct my grammar/throw racist accusations if it makes you feel better about yourself.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Its way to long to read but sounds interesting lol.

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By *lackCherryCouple
over a year ago

Bristol

Whatever you say! As always someone who knows jack shit about me telling me what i am. Feel free to correct my grammar/throw racist accusations if it makes you feel better about yourself."

Its not about grammar its about being understandable, I'm not sure why your singling us out but this thread is pretty much (aside from you) full of people commenting on the poor readability of the opening post and the odd racist end to it.

If you're going to get sanctimonious there is a whole thread of people saying the same thing you can start on too

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Right I get it, someone got touchy touchy in a club when they shouldn't have.

It sucks and its not fun, it can ruin the mood but im afraid when you put people into these situations and ply them with alcohol these things happen.

Also whats up with the first post ? you literally take a paragraph to say something you can say just as well in a sentence its like you swallowed a thesaurus.

Are you for real?? A woman is sexually assaulted in a club and choses to share that with the forum and all you bang on about is about her English usage. FFS keep attending those compassion classes!"

To be fair she dedicates about three paragraphs to repeat a dozen times the importance of good communication in swinging.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Its way to long to read but sounds interesting lol."

Just think of it like crunches you gotta slog through if you want that 6 pack prize :p

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Its way to long to read but sounds interesting lol.

Just think of it like crunches you gotta slog through if you want that 6 pack prize :p"
Yes like 3 sets of 10 reps lol.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Its way to long to read but sounds interesting lol.

Just think of it like crunches you gotta slog through if you want that 6 pack prize :pYes like 3 sets of 10 reps lol."

Sod that this is American psycho levels now you gotta reach the big 1k :p

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By *extoysareusCouple
over a year ago

kinky heaven

short and straight to the point

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By *entaur_UKMan
over a year ago

Cannock

No one said she deserved anything, are you a daily mail reader too because you're making some interesting jumps here.

Having been in a situation like this ourselves you deal with you tell the guy no and you report it to the club management, who if they are a decent club will bar him or deal with him.

Did you even bother to read the opening post from the OP all the way through???

The OP said she reported the incident to management but the management did'nt do anything about it, the management seemed to be friends with the guilty party and they had a well worked out routine of excuses. Thats what i read from the opening statement in this thread anyway.

Some people on this site it seems are just itching to throw the "you're a racist" accusation around, i've seen it many times on here on many different threads. So the guy who touched without permission was an eastern european, it really does not make the OP a racist for saying that if its a fact of what happened.

These silly little digs about being Daily Mail readers are also really not necessary.

No should always mean no in a club and no-one should ever join in on some action in a club without consent from those playing.

OP, can i ask a question and can you reply in short simple terms.....Did management ask the guy to leave, ban or remove him from the club or not?

If not then this club should be named and shamed.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Really, sexual assault should be reported to the police. If management were told about the incident and really didn't do anything about it, they'll soon get their act together when they realise people are willing to call the police every time it happens.

crystal

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"short and straight to the point

My favorite part was

"The added addition to this story..."

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I have to agree with what otters have said, the issue here is with your play partner not the other man involved.

If you were so out if it, how do you know he didn't get the okay from your play partner before touching you?

Also if you want one & one most clubs have lockable private rooms, use them instead of the more public ones.

I've been going to clubs for years and I've never done across this. In recent years I go as a single and men are respectful to the correct etiquette.

The phrase about mountains & molehills also sprang to mind and it just looks like yet another single male bashing thread.

I hope you had a severe word with your partner about him letting someone join in without your knowledge

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The fault lies with her partner not noticing the intrusion , or indeed the op not noticing . While not condoning the behaviour of the perpetrator who touched her boob , if no one told him not to , he will chance his arm . Just because it was in the couples room , it is still the responsibility if the players to ensure no one joins in uninvited .

As for those suggesting telling the police , ffs are you crazy ? Imagine the headlines and public interpretation , not to mention the further distress of a court case . And the possible closure of the club , and possibly all swinging clubs !

The racial undertone is irrelevant , and best ignored , just put it down to experience and be more aware if you go again

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By *et a roomCouple
over a year ago

Leeds

"'I gave up halfway through tge second paragraph - executive summary anyone?'

A man touched me in a club without permission..I told him to fuck off and reported him staff.

Also I don't like immigrates much..

Thanks

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By *abioMan
over a year ago

Newcastle and Gateshead

there are a million a one different issues here...

yes... the man who did the act was wrong...

yes... the person who you were with and wasn't looking out for your welfare was wrong

yes... the club who didn't look out for you after you made the complaint were wrong

yes... mentioning the fact he was eastern european and then making generalisations is wrong (why mention it in thee first place!)

so maybe there are a few things that need looking at..

a) people (men, women and couples) who think they are bulletproof and can get away with things they wouldn't be able to elsewhere because it is a swinging enviroment...

b) the clubs... and the way they treat accusations....

c) you and your partners communication and vetting skills.... as i said up before, I would have had the do's and dont's converstion way before I stepped into a playing situation.....

others can learn... sure!!

but you also need to learn what you could have done differently as well....

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Lost the will to live after 5 minutes of reading

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"The fault lies with her partner not noticing the intrusion , or indeed the op not noticing . While not condoning the behaviour of the perpetrator who touched her boob , if no one told him not to , he will chance his arm . Just because it was in the couples room , it is still the responsibility if the players to ensure no one joins in uninvited .

The racial undertone is irrelevant , and best ignored , just put it down to experience and be more aware if you go again

Just because she's having sex with someone in an open play area, it does not give anyone the right to sexually engage with her without consent.The recent rape case shows that the authorities do have the ability to take sexual assault in these environments seriously. If she's as upset about the lack of management action as her post implies then reporting the incident would, in my opinion, be the next step. The fault does not lie at all with either her or her partner but entirely with the person who touched without consent. It is not the responsibility of those playing to have to constantly watch out for straying hands. It's up to the owners of those hands to keep them to their selves until invited to do so otherwise. If her partner had noticed that there was a wondering hand, he should have intervened but I can't tell from the OP if he had noticed or not.

If your suggestion of all clubs being closed because of an incident such as this is accurate, then the recent case where a man has been convicted should cause all swingers clubs to be closed up for good.

crystal

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I would like to know what your partner was doing at this time? He should have been protecting you."

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I would like to know what your partner was doing at this time? He should have been protecting you."

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The racial undertone is irrelevant , and best ignored , just put it down to experience and be more aware if you go again

crystal"

I have to take issue with the point you raise about it not being anyone's responsibility but the owner of the wandering hands Crystal . We have been attending various clubs for 3 years and there is an onus of responsibility on the playmates too , even if there shouldn't have to be .

It's the nature of public sex , people will take chances , men , women and couples . We have told many of each category no thanks many times . No issue , no problem , and so we continue our adventure and if course it will happen again and we will continue to say no if it's not what we want .

Rape is a very different offence to touching a boob , and a court case involving this would be farcical . Perhaps I am wrong and court cases involving swinging clubs wouldn't lead to their closure , but they certainly wouldn't help , especially if this was taken as an example .

Andrew

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Was going say my god big problem going on here but having thought a little about it, think someone needs a new hobby!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"I've never been to a club. I might like to if mr right turns up but if as a newbie they wouldn't protect me from this, then I'm scared off already

Yes these one or two bad experiences from dozens of clubs and hundreds of club nights a year represent a majority and therefore are cause for concern

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By *ce WingerMan
over a year ago

P.O. Box DE1 0NQ

""Please respect peoples boundaries and always obtain consent before touching others" - would have used far less internet ink and paper.

Plus I doubt your target audience will be forum users.

Cheers Obi, that saved me a headache

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By *limandslenderCouple
over a year ago

stoke on trent

"well - blimey i read it all but a lot wont and it wasnt all necessary - id trim it to get the point across - whilst i agree with you and what happened was wrong i have to ask about your partner you were with - no way would my fella let anybody into a private room with us, touch me, or anything without my knowing and saying was ok - if i was so into my orgasm that i was unaware then more so he would look out for me - part of the partnership is this and why i play with only him there "

I agree. Glad you did the short version x

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

The individual was an ass but clearly there was a communication breakdown between you and your partner I would never sit back and let someone treat Mo without respect, we have preplanned signals and let our feelings clearly known.

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

A clear demonstration of your intellectual prowess, my dear. A valuable contributions for the benefit of humanity i see. You can actually use a key to make a noise, i'm forever enlightened.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"A clear demonstration of your intellectual prowess, my dear. A valuable contributions for the benefit of humanity i see. You can actually use a key to make a noise, i'm forever enlightened.

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By *lackCherryCouple
over a year ago

Bristol

Its pretty awesome Yoda signed up to fab swingers to be fair.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

This whole thread makes me a little uncomfortable. If the OP had been a bit more succinct and the end bit about Eastern Europeans wasn't there I feel like people's reactions might have been different.

Yes there's always personal responsibility and probably an issue of communication between OP and the partner she was playing with, but someone joining in uninvited in any way isn't ok.

It's probably a bit of a stretch to suggest that means there's some kind of widespread problem but the OP has had an unpleasant experience and it's something I would have been upset by too if it happened to me.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

communication is the key to all clubs!

I've never had an issue with men touching when not invited...... If with a partner we have a code word for if someone is a potential playmate.....

Alone I've had no issues with single blokes in clubs but I only have attended cupids alone & am safe in the knowledge that if a issue arises it will be dealt with (& I am more than capable of dealing with it myself)

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Thank you kindly for all the contributions on this issue,even the negitive attempts at personal slight. Your opinion and i wont contest, maybe something a few should learn, that individuals are equal and have value. But i must remind you. My motif was concern for preditory behaviour becoming a problem and that would be damaging to the inexperianced or even vulnerable. My only concern and have no issue with the act of being fondled. i am expansive enough to not be so self absorbed by my own self importance as the only outrage. I missed my cahnce at clearly demonstrating the unscrulpulous and well executed pack like preditory actions of two men that on two occassions demonstrated there diregard for women, with me but also another couple earlier. They have used this tag team pack like tactic before, that spells long term real issues for safety, as it only increases if left unchallenged. My partners response is of no importance, the set up and arrangement of our scene hindered our knowing etc. Its not impoortant. Neither is my feelings, however it is vital that we take responsibilty if we detect someone not following our one code of conduct as a safety net for alls enjoyment, consensual and not predatory foder. I do go on and on, I did say i would return and edit, quite frankly the bulk bores me too. I outline my own acceptance of that. But i am further saddened that the sentiment by this action, at a cost to leaving myself wide open for the intellectually challenged hurling insults at my person, i did so regardless, as i hold the safety and enjoyment of others as far more valueble than any barrel scrapping neanderthal thoughts or opinions of me.

The act, my partners response, my feelings, arent of importance here, its a potential disregard for the one rule and code of conduct, that is our only safe guard for a positive, fun, self exploration in a wonderful free environment. A warning and reminder that we are responsible and should be aware then act if this is apparent and a problem

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By *bi HaiveMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Cheeseville, Somerset

It happened to us once.

My head was elsewhere - her eyes were closed. She thought it was my hand on her boob - it wasn't. I spotted it and told the guy to stop. (The actual words were more like "what the fuck do you think you're doing?")

He stopped, visibly nearly shit himself - and by the time we'd dressed and I'd mentioned 'a guy in his 40's in a white shirt' to staff - he'd long since left the club.

Not a nice experience, the club said had they been able to identify him he'd have been banned - and I'm pretty sure the other single guys in the room learnt a lesson - assuming they didn't already know the proper etiquette.

Has it stopped us going to clubs? No

Would it have made a difference if he was Eastern European/black/Asian/Australian ? No

Has it made us a little more aware when playing in open rooms/public places? Yep

It's not a great situation to find yourself in - but one that can happen if you yourself take your eye of the proverbial ball. The offender is always to blame. There's no justification for it. But it has to be said it's a far rarer occurrence than is often made out (in my experience) and if couples look out for each other as best they can it's a situation often easy to avoid.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

I agree. Glad you did the short version x"

youre welcome - i have a headache now - x

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

To the OP you re quite right to be aggrieved and have every right to express it however you wish on this forum.

As for some of the replies.... What a sorry bunch!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

Interesting thread. Lesson learned for me; be more aware. Hope you're ok OP. x

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By (user no longer on site) OP
over a year ago

Wow, having just read all the responses, i will make no further attempts to rectify some of the issues off topic i've caused.

I will leave with this note.

It's absolutely sickening that the emphasis should be about the finer details, assumptions of my meaning (I take ownership, for some of that).Second guesses of the actual scene, the importance placed on my views,my partners actions, whether right or wrong, as being of more value. The many thoughts on me taking a different hobby as a solution, the intrusive act being of importance, the amount of similar situations being a measure of value. I have attempted several times be clearer about my actual message and yet there's still an ego based level of thinking here by quite a few. I can not say this any clearer than the baby language i now have to use. These men were different, They had a pack/preditory like plan and knew what they were doing, even down to their well rehearsed excuses to management. left unchecked This is a very real safety problem, If this is a one off incident, then no harm done by actions,( i am prying it is).But if my fears carry any weight, then i hope the ignorant, egos of some on this issue. Will be able sleep at night, even if one incidence escalates and does some real lasting damage to anyone. The eventual drive for clubs closure wont be the only thing for concern. Appreication for everyone's time, I've now left the building with Elvis xx

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By *umourCouple
over a year ago

Rushden

This has happened to us, about six years ago at a club in the East Midlands/Home Counties.

There was a single guy that used to follow couples about and constantly ask to join in, we always said no and thought he would finally get the hint. He didn't!!! One evening at the club, he actually crossed the line in the couples room and we told him that he should "Fuck off now before I get to stand up!"

He did leave us and I went to complain to the management (once we were dressed. ) I described him to the guy as permed 70's hair, wearing jeans and a blue and white shirt. We were told that it would be dealt with.

Later that same evening, we saw him again and went back to the management and asked what had been done, as he was still in the club. We were told it was "out of character" for him to do this and he was just warned. Not happy, we made our feelings known and another couple heard us and came to say this same guy had done the same to them. Others we have spoken to before also had problems with him.

It was then we found out that he was a friend of the owner and had numerous complaints against him, but always came back! And that is why we stopped going to that club! I suppose that we have to realise that single guys bring in more money per person than a couple. Without them, club prices would be higher, but Surely, complaints should be taken seriously?

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By *bi HaiveMan
Forum Mod
over a year ago

Cheeseville, Somerset

"This has happened to us, about six years ago at a club in the East Midlands/Home Counties.

Clubs aren't stupid.

One single male doesn't provide sufficient income to risk losing couple attendees and word spreading.

It would be business suicide and unsustainable. I guess friendship with owners will only carry so much weight for so long.

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Wow, having just read all the responses, i will make no further attempts to rectify some of the issues off topic i've caused.

I will leave with this note.

It's absolutely sickening that the emphasis should be about the finer details, assumptions of my meaning (I take ownership, for some of that)"

Just what is your first language out of curiosity?

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By *et a roomCouple
over a year ago

Leeds

Bloody hell, that post took some reading. Must be a solicitor.

We are regulars at Isis in Leeds & guys in there know if they step out of line they will be thrown out and banned. End of story.

If you play in a public room, you need someone to look out for you, and obviously no should mean no, whatever the circumstances. Otherwise, why not play in private, maybe with a viewing window?

Some guys may chance their arm, but in our experience at clubs single guys are always very respectful, and if we've been in a group situation and said we need a rest or a break, they've been off like a shot.

Clubs that we've been to have been a very safe environment to play in, particularly for single women. The actions of one complete wanker shouldn't be blown out of all proportion. Unfortunately there are some arseholes in all walks of life. eg my boss!

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

"Sorry just way too long to read, the gist of the story would have been so much easier"
I gave up reading it after half hour and only a 3rd of the way through. What was it about

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By (user no longer on site)
over a year ago

So only Fab members use clubs then..?

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